Have we forgotten about HDRx?

[Craig Parkes]

The other situation where it is in regular use is science I believe.

For example I am pretty sure both NASA and SpaceX have utilised HDRx for examining rocket exhausts.

 

[Alan Greene]

You could do two r3d's with full a and full b track settings.

I've tried and it didn't seem to work. Not sure what I'm doing wrong, but when I set the current track either way, or move the blend slider one way or the other, it doesn't seem to affect the output. I also tried the REDline command line tool, and got the same result. Could you explain how this is done?

 

[Zack Birlew]

Sorry to bring this thread back up but I always thought RED was going to expand upon HDRx until it was the mainstream way to shoot. It's basically the beginnings of an HDR camera which I have seen in prototype form from Spheron at Siggraph several years ago which was honestly the best 1080p camera I've ever seen. I understand RED will probably be limited by storage speeds for future 8K cameras but even having a full artifact-free and motion accurate HDR mode for 4K/5K/6K would be amazing!

 

[Joel Arvidsson]

I agree, but I guess the post side was not ready for it when it came out. It turned a normal shot into a vfx shot. But now decompression and debayer done on gpu it should be revisited and improved for a more seamless experience.

 

[Mark Phelan]

Seeing this thread again made me search my old Mac one more time, and I found the example I'd mentioned previously.

Here is Boo, who rides in the tin can being pulled by a bulldozer as he plants on average 7,000 trees a day by hand. It's hot and hard work on an old back as the box bounces back and forth over tree stumps and other remnants left by the previous harvest. He's been doing this for decades, and Lord only knows how many trees this man has planted.

The inside of the box was quite dark, the day was quite bright. So it was a perfect opportunity, and a last-ditch attempt to get some sort of shot showing both and my first and only time to use HDRx. Took it to Light Iron where Corinne Bogdanowicz was able to effortlessly combine the two. She is a master!

Also found a short video example of it for your viewing pleasure. I'd posted this about ten years ago on REDUser: https://vimeo.com/431432308

Combined image:


A Frame:


X Frame:

 

[Michael Tiemann]

Sorry to bring this thread back up but I always thought RED was going to expand upon HDRx until it was the mainstream way to shoot. It's basically the beginnings of an HDR camera which I have seen in prototype form from Spheron at Siggraph several years ago which was honestly the best 1080p camera I've ever seen. I understand RED will probably be limited by storage speeds for future 8K cameras but even having a full artifact-free and motion accurate HDR mode for 4K/5K/6K would be amazing!

Actually storage speeds have become kinda unlimited lately. Yes, the MiniMag is showing its age and CFast 2.0 is already behind but storage can be fast as heck these days.

I agree that the big challenge is that most editors, especially one-person-band types are not prepared for adding a vfx step to their workflow. And so much better results can so often be addressed with lighting. Maybe somebody can create a righteous plugin that can decompose an image into halation/flare, highlights, and darks and then recompose, but halation is a factor that stopped me from making more progress with HDRx.

 

[Patrick Tresch]

I've used the X track for tracking on VFX. The faster shutter speed and lower motion blur helps post for tracking.

 

[Michael Tiemann]

I've used the X track for tracking on VFX. The faster shutter speed and lower motion blur helps post for tracking.

Really good point!!!

 

[Mike P.]

Speaking of HDRX, IPP2 doesn’t seem to work with magic motion for me. The gamma goes wonky and it actually clips faster when a normalization LUT is applied, rather than extending the DR. Is that just me?

Simple Blend works fine though.

 

[Alan Greene]

The inside of the box was quite dark, the day was quite bright. So it was a perfect opportunity, and a last-ditch attempt to get some sort of shot showing both and my first and only time to use HDRx. Took it to Light Iron where Corinne Bogdanowicz was able to effortlessly combine the two. She is a master!

Phenomenal example, but also a little bit of lift and grading to get it to that final result. Looks beautiful. You could even go for just a little less of the X frame, as the sky is just barely holding on in the A frame.

 

[Mark Phelan]

You could even go for just a little less of the X frame, as the sky is just barely holding on in the A frame.

Yep, agreed. If I had the chance to do it over again, think I'd open up the A frame even more and probably spread the bracket farther as well. Corinne was able to push it so much in post, it would have been fun to give her even more to play with. As for the motion blur, I don't think anyone even notices it, but it's definitely there. With the clip being so short, you don't pay attention to it. It's most noticeable on the tip of the brim of his cap, but you'd really have to pixel-peep to see it.

 

[Patrick Tresch]

There is a harsh mask on the composite clip of the working man.

 

[Mark Phelan]

There is a harsh mask on the composite clip of the working man.

And your point is?

 

[joshua csehak]

Also found a short video example of it for your viewing pleasure. I'd posted this about ten years ago on REDUser: https://vimeo.com/431432308

This looks really great! Any idea what kind of magic she used? I have trouble getting HDRx to look more than just a little better than non-HDRx. (But I'm only using Red Cine X)

 

[Mark Phelan]

This looks really great! Any idea what kind of magic she used? I have trouble getting HDRx to look more than just a little better than non-HDRx. (But I'm only using Red Cine X)

Corinne was working on Light Iron's Pablo system, so checking my notes and as I watched, what I do recall from ten years ago was she turned some dials to the right, a couple knobs to the left, spun the wheels hither and yon, and then smothered it with love.

 

[Patrick Tresch]

And your point is?

Nothing about HDRx, more about the grading. I do see a harsh mask. The man enters the mask when he leans back.

 

[Mark Phelan]

Nothing about HDRx, more about the grading. I do see a harsh mask. The man enters the mask when he leans back.

Patrick, you'll need to show me where you are seeing this because I cannot see a harsh mask.

 

[Alex Lubensky]

Patrick, you'll need to show me where you are seeing this because I cannot see a harsh mask.

I think what he describes as a "harsh mask" is junt a known artifact of two motion blur's in the same image.

 

[Patrick Tresch]

You can see it better in the video file when he is mooving.

 

[Mark Phelan]

You can see it better in the video file when he is mooving.

Roger. Think it was an expediency versus ROI decision. Seems like we did have a discussion about how much time we wanted to devote to tweaking it, given the amount of time it was seen.