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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Great day for current RED ONE owners!

michael zaletel

michael zaletel

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Remember three things about today's announcement.

1.) It is doubtful that EPIC or SCARLET will ship in any volumes for at least 12 months. And if they do, it is likely that many of the necessary "add-ons" will be on backorder for quite some time.

2.) Current RED ONE owners will get all of the first EPICS AND SCARLETS off of the assembly line when they do ship. The earlier your RED ONE serial number, the better. The very people concerned about the value of their current equipment when the new cameras ship are going to completely control the supply, rental market and resale prices of both the old and new cameras.

3.) There are some tremendous advantages to an "all-in-one" camera. RED's vision for the future is truly awesome but that doesn't mean it doesn't have its drawbacks. Even when EPIC and SCARLET do ship, there are going to still be lots of reasons to own a RED ONE, especially after the sensor upgrade.

By changing its' plans for SCARLET and EPIC, RED has just done an incredible favor for its' existing owner-base. They have given us (at least) 12 more months to earn money with this amazing piece of equipment without fear of SCARLETS showing up in boxes at Best Buy for $2,999 this Christmas or even next Christmas.

-shooter
 
good points, also look at all the firmware/builds updates we as red one owners have had to go through to get to this point..i will be watching the development of these new cams closely but still happy with the red1 at this point..

greg

www.onetrackmind.ca
 
Now days, I think "Sping" means "Spring".

So many of the delays and struggles with the Red One were software related. With Epic and Scarlet, the software is already done. Sure there are new drivers, and changes to accomodate new chips, etc., but a great deal of heavy lifting is already done.

Scarlet and Epic are built on the shoulders of Red One, so they should be much faster to market and I would bet that the S35 Scarlet, day one, will be more full featured than the Red one is today.

My Bet is Full featured, working models at NAB, taking orders for May delivery if not sooner.

The reasons for delays of the other formats are likely lens related on the different size ones (Red needs to make sure they have glass to sell at the same time) and Sensor related to the Epic releases.
 
Hi Thom:

I appreciate your point of view but do you have any idea how complicated it is to create a fully modular system of this nature? Design, engineer and perfect all the pieces to fit and work perfectly together, to work out physical interface issues and then to set up the manufacturing facility to generate sufficient quantities of each of the necessary component parts?

Don't get me wrong. RED has made the best choice ever. I actually suggested a modular system for Scarlet exactly as was released today back in April of this year. My argument in the thread titled "Technical Services Around the Globe" started by simonfilm was that a modular approach is really the only solution to expeditious worldwide technical support and repair for such a complex piece of equipment at such a low price point. People disagreed with me in that thread and pointed out the problems with a modular approach. I continue to believe RED made the right choice.

However, and make no mistake about this, their new plan and vision is an extremely wise, long-term plan. To expect to see all of these modular pieces manufactured to perfection and ready for the assembly lines by NAB (and shipping by May) is both naive and irrational. Red could have compromised their long-term future by doing just that with a single-piece Scarlet system, but they chose to take the path less followed, and that my friends WILL make ALL the difference.

I highly suggest people order a RED ONE right now, use it for free for a year and then upgrade to EPIC when the time is right. As for people that were hoping to buy a SCARLET right away, be patient, this new approach will be well worth the wait. If you need an inexpensive piece of gear to shoot with right now, be smart, don't waste your money on an inferior substitute, buy a good, used HDV camera on eBay and then sell it in a year for 75% of what you paid. Be smart like RED, invest in your long-term future by saving your money to buy into this amazing new technology when it does ship.

-shooter
 
No problem Akube, that's a complement coming from someone that looks like the crown prince of some very wealthy country. :)

-shooter
 
shooter said:
...do you have any idea how complicated it is to create a fully modular system of this nature?
Click to expand...

I don't, but Red sure does, and call me a Fan Boy, but I think they will do it.

When they started, and chose their delivery dates, they had never done it before. They had nothing set up, no infrastructure for delivery, and experience only brought with them from other companies.

They grew, build by build, building experience, building capabilities. Their manufacturing process is worked out, their shipping process is worked out, their Q/A process is worked out. They have tons of field experience. They know what it is to ship a thousand cameras a month. They know problems to look for, issues that will come up. Most of all, they have all worked together for over a year now, as a team. I doubt anyone leaves Red on their own free will--I bet most hang on to the best, most amazing job, they've ever had.

They know what it is to build a world class camera, now. If someone else tries to get into this market, like canon, Jim is like Tony Stark, "How did you solve the icing problem?" or in this case "Skew" problem. Cut to the look on Canon's face as it plummets to the earth.

I hear what you are saying, it's tough work, but it's tough work they know.

I still bet on early spring Beta, Mid-Spring shipping.
 
i think people are being a little too optimistic on multiple fronts.

the only thing current red owners should be happy about is any information regarding the mysterium-x sensor upgrade for the red one and i haven't heard anything about that. that upgrade is the only announcement that would affect my current investment today and is the only thing i need to improve my current red one substantially without doubling my investment. everything else is too far away to speculate on. we have no pricing for any modules which appear to be required to make any of these new models work. and none of these new reds will be out anytime soon. i'm guessing they'll start taking pre-orders around nab but that delivery probably won't happen for epic or even scarlet until later in the year.

maybe i'm being too pessimistic or i just missed some angle on all this news but that's the other problem i'm finding-too much info. red's announcements are so overwhelming that they're kind of underwhelming too. too many goodies and promises to deal with. i just want a better red one now (or at least soon).
 
Hi Wigby...

Tell, me, what is wrong with your current Red One?

You said:

"I just want a better red one now (or at least soon)"

Let's say RED were to refund your entire purchase price plus 20% for your trouble, what would you go and buy right now that would give you the same quality, expandability, workflow and support-level that the RED ONE gives you today?

-shooter
 
shooter said:
Hi Wigby...

Tell, me, what is wrong with your current Red One?

You said:

"I just want a better red one now (or at least soon)"

Let's say RED were to refund your entire purchase price plus 20% for your trouble, what would you go and buy right now that would give you the same quality, expandability, workflow and support-level that the RED ONE gives you today?

-shooter
Click to expand...

If they offered that I think I'd take it. Use the extra %20 to rent a RED ONE when I need to in the next 6 months, then by the $2500 Scarlet and then also get Monstro Scarlet Later that year when it comes out. All without spending another dime :) I dont think they'll offer that though.
 
shooter said:
Hi Wigby...

Tell, me, what is wrong with your current Red One?

You said:

"I just want a better red one now (or at least soon)"

Let's say RED were to refund your entire purchase price plus 20% for your trouble, what would you go and buy right now that would give you the same quality, expandability, workflow and support-level that the RED ONE gives you today?

-shooter
Click to expand...
my current red one is not defective. nothing is wrong with it but i am willing to pay more for increased dynamic range and more sensitivity without having to upgrade to all new hardware. if i wanted that business model, i would go with sony. some of us are willing to pay and others just want it for free. the point is we all want something better, especially if it was promised at some point.

your premise is absurb but if that was the case, i wouldn't go anywhere else. right now red is the best and only game in town but if they start neglecting legacy customers to please new ones, they will lose business.
 
shooter said:
Hi Thom:

I appreciate your point of view but do you have any idea how complicated it is to create a fully modular system of this nature? Design, engineer and perfect all the pieces to fit and work perfectly together, to work out physical interface issues and then to set up the manufacturing facility to generate sufficient quantities of each of the necessary component parts?

Don't get me wrong. RED has made the best choice ever. I actually suggested a modular system for Scarlet exactly as was released today back in April of this year. My argument in the thread titled "Technical Services Around the Globe" started by simonfilm was that a modular approach is really the only solution to expeditious worldwide technical support and repair for such a complex piece of equipment at such a low price point. People disagreed with me in that thread and pointed out the problems with a modular approach. I continue to believe RED made the right choice.

However, and make no mistake about this, their new plan and vision is an extremely wise, long-term plan. To expect to see all of these modular pieces manufactured to perfection and ready for the assembly lines by NAB (and shipping by May) is both naive and irrational. Red could have compromised their long-term future by doing just that with a single-piece Scarlet system, but they chose to take the path less followed, and that my friends WILL make ALL the difference.

I highly suggest people order a RED ONE right now, use it for free for a year and then upgrade to EPIC when the time is right. As for people that were hoping to buy a SCARLET right away, be patient, this new approach will be well worth the wait. If you need an inexpensive piece of gear to shoot with right now, be smart, don't waste your money on an inferior substitute, buy a good, used HDV camera on eBay and then sell it in a year for 75% of what you paid. Be smart like RED, invest in your long-term future by saving your money to buy into this amazing new technology when it does ship.

-shooter
Click to expand...

Just stumbled on this thread after keeping up with probably dozens of "obsolete" subject threads (bad news sells.)

I think you have a very well-thought out approach. Thom makes good points about much of the ground work being already done in R&D and software development, but this still looks like a complex undertaking.

R1s, in my opinion, have lost zero value because of this new announcement. Anyone wanting another one should buy before the sellers realize that the panic was a false one. And (I still find this hard to believe) the upgrade or the discount appear to follow the camera's number until exercised. What a world!
 
Considering buying a used Red One with Low Serial Number

Considering buying a used Red One with Low Serial Number

Thanks number 6. I agree this is a temporary panic by seller's. I saw the first R1 officially listed at below original price for sale on RedUser today. Everyone is underestimating Red's commitment to their customers. R1 owners are going to be happy in the end that they did not sell. I am personally betting on it and even considering buying a used Red One with an earlier serial number so I can get my Epic even sooner. R1's with serial number under 250 should be selling at a premium right now if people would just stop for a second, absorb all of this and really think it through.

-shooter
 
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