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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

From Mac to PC LTO planning

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Walter R

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Hi All,

We are about to update our LTO-4 to a LTO-5. We currently use a Mac Pro as the host and the rest of our machines are also Mac Pro towers. After upgrading the LTO, we plan on taking all of our older LTO-3 and LTO-4 tapes, dumping them to a raid and then putting them on new LTO-5 tapes - a pretty major refresh of our archive.

At the same time we are, like many here, considering a possible future without the Mac Pros. We've already switched to Premiere Pro and while we love the Macs we need to be realists as well. The idea of having all of our backups trapped in the Mac world if we switch to PCs a year from now is a little worrying. So since we are about to do this major redo or our archive, I began wondering about making our backup machine a PC and integrating that with our (currently) Mac environment. This would prepare us for a possible switch to PCs without needing to keep an aging Mac tower alive to handle backups/restores.

Right now we're using Bru Server and have been very happy with both the product and the great support from Bru, but unfortunately we can't use them for PC so obviously we'd need to figure out a new backup software for the PC if we make the switch. Retrospect Pro? The thought was that if we use the PC with the LTO with Mac Drive Pro, we should still be able to access other disks/raids on our computers and still be able to back up and restore anything on our network with the PC.

Has anyone done anything similar to this? I'm hoping this is a possible option, but I'm a little worried about mixing machines on the network and winding up with a lot of time just trying to keep it all running.

Any help is greatly appreciated.

Thanks,
Walter
 
Bump.

Anyone tried backing up a Mac through PC with LTO?
 
You might want to consider going to LTFS. You won't get automated utilities, but you will get complete cross platform independence.
 
Hi Mike,
That sounds like a good suggestion. In Bru, we always have the software do a verification pass on the data, do you know if there is anything similar with LTFS? Alternatively, I guess we could and maybe should just start making 2 copies of the tapes to minimize the chance of a bad transfer.

Also, for LTO-5 tapes, does anyone have a recommended brand of tape or brands to stay away from? I know there have been some issues with some brands in the past.

Thanks again,
Walter
 
Tracking this post. I have nothing to contribute other than horrendous experiences with retrospect. Looking into CATDV, BRU, and others. LTO is the way to go, though.
 
Walter R said:
Right now we're using Bru Server and have been very happy with both the product and the great support from Bru, but unfortunately we can't use them for PC so obviously we'd need to figure out a new backup software for the PC if we make the switch. Retrospect Pro? The thought was that if we use the PC with the LTO with Mac Drive Pro, we should still be able to access other disks/raids on our computers and still be able to back up and restore anything on our network with the PC.

Has anyone done anything similar to this? I'm hoping this is a possible option, but I'm a little worried about mixing machines on the network and winding up with a lot of time just trying to keep it all running.
Click to expand...

Walter - even if you do move to Windows for work, there's no real reason to retire the Mac Pro you're currently running BRU Server on. Simply keep it going as your backup server and add the BRU Server Windows agent to your new PC systems. You get full windows compatibility with a backup and archival solution that you're already familiar with and already paid for :thumbsup:.

Tim
 
Walter R said:
Hi Mike,
That sounds like a good suggestion. In Bru, we always have the software do a verification pass on the data, do you know if there is anything similar with LTFS?
Click to expand...

LTFS is just a file system, its not a backup application. Your tape device just shows up as a drive, you can use whatever software you like to verify the copies. Because of the nature of LTFS, saving a catalog on an index partition of the tape, some methods will not work. For example if you used R3D data manager, you could assign the tape device as a copy destination - but the way it saves the checksum with the copied data will cause endless tape searches during verification and it will timeout.

To Copy data to the LTFS tape I use FastCopy, its much faster than accessing the device through explorer. FastCopy can also do a MD-5 verification. Alternatively you could use FastCopy or TeraCopy to do the copies, and use ExactFile,etc to create a md5 digest for verification.

One issue to be aware of , LTFS needs to save a copy of the catalog to the tape - the driver allows you to set this to happen every 5 mins, after every file is closed (slow!) or on eject. If you have a failure - blue screen, power outage, etc - before the catalog is written, the tape is pretty much lost - there is a recovery option, but its slow and not reliable. I have not had a problem with this, but be aware.

Also, the windows LTFS software is much more particular about sas controller, for example the LSI megaraid controllers although they specifically list LTO5 device compatibility, just do not work. They work under linux fine. The LSI HBA series and the Atto controllers work, but the Atto card needed some registry settings.


Performance wise, HP's driver is limited to 512kb block sizes under windows. This is now the default block size for LTFS, but it does support larger sizes, just HP does not - there is a about a 10% performance hit - and a problem if you created 1mb block size tapes on macos/linux.

Yes, you can backup a mac over the network from windows, we do this all the time over 10gbe.

I like being able to take the same tape and being able to read it on any workstation we use - linux, mac, windows - so I'm putting up with current limitations.

If you want a more traditional backup application - retrospect and novabackup are garbage, Uranium backup works well, but is very simple. Backup Exec is great for large workgroups, otherwise more hassle than its worth. Tim said they were doing a windows version of BRU PE back in 2009, but that never happened. If your going to make a switch to a new backup application, I think LTFS is a good choice, it has limitations, but it has a future - these closed ended applications do not. If you want LTFS with a more friendly face look at a cache-a box, you just pay an awful lot for that friendly face.
 
Thanks all for your feedback and suggestions.

Tim, do you know if our Bru license is okay for use on Linux if we went that way some day? We're okay using our Mac Pro for a while, but someday it may no longer be viable since we use that desk for other work as well. Also, any issue if we install the HP LTFS drivers alongside the Bru Server software? While it may seem excessive, I was considering both a Bru tape backup and then a LTFS tape backup since it would be nice to have one tape on-site and one in more controlled storage and this approach would also give us the flexibility to use LTFS down the road.

Christopher, thanks for your detailed response. Do you know if Windows will be okay with a Atto ExpressSAS H380 card?

Anyone with a suggestion of types of tape to avoid? I could swear I remember reading somewhere that some of the brands can cause issues or were less reliable.

Best,
Walter
 
Hi All,

I'm porting FastCopy to Mac OS X. Its name is RapidCopy.
RapidCopy can be fast copy with checksum to LTFS.

Finally RapidCopy going to sell in the AppStore about $10 price.
fastcopy is free, I become a paid because surely it takes money to porting.
I want you to pay it thinking it's my salary bill. I'm sorry:)

I am looking for a closed β tester.
Please Twitter DM if you are interested.

https://twitter.com/KengoSawa2

Teaser site(At present Japanese only. but β Application has English UI mode):
http://www.lespace.co.jp/file_bl/rapidcopy/rapidcopy.html

I'm developing a RapidCopy in a company called L'espace Vision.
L'espace Vision. is the post-production in Japan.
http://www.lespace.co.jp/

ps:
By the way, the developer of fastcopy not directly related to this project.fastcopy because it is very great software, and grateful to Mr. Shirouzu, I want you to also donate.
I also promoting the porting work got a variety technical tips from him.
 
Last edited:
Hi All,

RapidCopy is portable version of FastCopy that runs on Mac OS X.
It was released in the Mac AppStore.

RapidCopy AppStore URL:
https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/rapidcopy/id975974524

RapidCopy detailed manual URL:
http://www.lespace.co.jp/file_bl/rapidcopy/manual/index_en.html

RapidCopy supports LTFS Mode.
In LTO-5 test environment,RapidCopy can write speed of 130MB / Sec.


I am the author of RapidCopy.
We need a feedback from overseas. Please let opinion.
 
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