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Filming in a cave

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AlexJones

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I'm going to be DP'ing on a shoot in the next few weeks for a short that will be filmed mostly in a real cave. I was wondering if anyone had any suggestions on lighting? I won't have access to any lights that require power from a generator. I was thinking of using LED panels for hair light and fill lighting, inky lights for edge lighting on the walls and hair lighting. Flashlights for practicles and different lighting techniques. Any other battery powered light suggestions to light the cave with out making it look lit? I will be shooting the cave to make it look big in some parts and small in other areas. will also be shooting on the scarlet and want to know if keeping a lower iso like 320 is a better idea than 800...
 
How wet is the cave? That would be a big concern for me. We have a huge network of caves here in TAG (Tennessee, Alabama, Georgia) and having been in several, my first concern is how to keep the gear clean when everything becomes wet and brown.

As for continuous lighting, I think you're on the right track. LEDs with their low draw would be a good choice, as would LED flashlights. Might check with your local grottos to see what they might recommend too.
 
not wet at all. that would help a lot with the light shining on the rock. We're filming in a very dry environment in California. Any suggestions on iso settings? Want to stay away from any noise what so ever.
 
I would shoot between 5000k-5600k if you can, seems most of your sources will be in that range. Make sure you blackshade once camera is at operating temp, I always have my Epic at 60 degrees, works great. Since you're not shooting outside, you can definitely shoot at 320ISO, though 800 will give you a bit more DR, I don't think that should be a problem for you, unless you're really focusing on those practicals and flashlights.

LED's are going to be your best friend, especially battery powered ones. Try and get ones that have a high CRI rating. Though if you're on a tight budget, even the F&V ones which have a CRI of 85 do really well and don't have much, if any color shifting. You can get a 3-light kit for a little over $1k. Great price for great lights.

Good luck shooting! Sounds like fun.
 
This ws shot quite a gew years back on 35mm, we used 5 or 6 of the small litepanels hidden on the ground which all ran on 12v as well as a 200 joker which also ran on 12v. We used the joker as the key.
 

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nice! I'm looking for a more white and light blue look though. 5600 would be too warm for me. I like the white and black look for dark scenes. Jokers are a great idea!
 
Perfect! Thanks Chris. As far as LED's go, What sizes would you use for lighting the rock and faces? it needs to look polished at the same time, This film will feature a cave monster. I want to keep the light dark to give the feel and also the "Jaws Effect".
 
alex, if you want an 'unlit' look you're going to need a lot of diffusion/bounce so as not to suggest a source, which means (especially if you want zero noise and a dark look/feel which is impossible, you'll likely want/need noise reduction) you're going to want quite a bit of light all around even if you're wanting a dark look. it's much easier to pull everything down and adjust it when you have light to begin with and that's the best way to avoid noise. depending on how much light you have, expose probably for 800 or below and then pull your iso down on the monitor (it's just metadata) to get a good preview of what you want that'll pull the shadows down or even crush them. you can get a pretty good test done in a darkened room as far as what equipment you want to drag in, just remember to bring a little extra cause you may have high ceilings you want to hit and some caves just eat light up (particles and stuff in the air, or dark magic)... (:

and do be careful, helmets are not a bad idea. i hit my head on a rock almost everytime i go in there without one, so i don't know which is harder, my head or the daggum rocks. better not to find out...

Indiana-Jones-bts.jpg


raiders-of-the-lost-ark-imax-1024x576.jpg


probably not what you're going for, this scene has a very classical/theatrical/stage lighting-look (which is a choice, kind of like musicals i think the artifice of it highlights the artifice of the art of storytelling, which makes it work - that being said, i like motivated light... see roger deakins for great balancing skill) and it's not a cave as i'm pretty sure it's open to the sky/canopy - point is they 'overlit' (think day for night) and that's a common thing to do. what i mean by that is as much as i like to light only to my eye and just capture it, the fact is that especially in dark places the eye is a lot better at adjusting than cameras are and it's technically going to work out better to have more light than your eye needs, it's the camera that's capturing it forever.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CzinPgsxokE


[url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QdvWcO62ABA
[/URL]
 
My vote is for torches and put a blue fill flashlight like the one Phil Holland has. 5600k.

If you shooting MX and worried about noise, shoot 320. What you see on the monitor will be close to what you get. Remember. Click the LCD to max brightness, then 4 clicks down to get what you see.

AlexJones said:
I'm going to be DP'ing on a shoot in the next few weeks for a short that will be filmed mostly in a real cave. I was wondering if anyone had any suggestions on lighting?
Click to expand...
 
Shoot 320 and as much light as possible.

Then use neatvideo in post. If it was a Dragon shoot, you'd have less to worry about. When is the shoot?

AlexJones said:
not wet at all. that would help a lot with the light shining on the rock. We're filming in a very dry environment in California. Any suggestions on iso settings? Want to stay away from any noise what so ever.
Click to expand...
 
I shot ULB in a network of lava tubes with no natural light peeking in, and the walls, floor, and ceiling all acted as negative fill. In this case, lighting the talent would just make it look as if they were in a black void.

If your location is similar, I'd recommend either bringing in a hazer, or do a good deal of wetdowns on the walls. In either case, treat it like a night exterior and think in terms of silhouette for wides.
 
We shot this with only the fire torch light. It gave us an f/2 at ISO 320. Used a 1/4 black promist too.
 

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I shot a film a few years ago called "Secret of the Cave" and a fairly large cave sequence was shot, partially in a cave in Ireland, in a cave in Alabama, and on a stage. We hiked in a bunch of marine batteries and used a big inverter, an approach that I can't really recommend, but it sort of worked. Our main source was actually a xenon maxi-beam flashlight. The project was super 16mm and that light source on tungsten balanced film looked really amazing. We also used fog which helped a lot in bringing down the contrast and generally dispersing the light, and showing the beam. We also used a 1200 watt HMI for some of the bigger rooms and some 650 and 1000 Watt tungstens when we needed warmer light when he was getting toward the "inhabited" part of the cave (which was a set). Dirt and dust will probably be a big problem. Set up clean staging areas with something on the floor and then try to minimize traffic in and out of those clean areas. Everything was vision 2 500T 7218 I believe for that sequence. We shot some very low light stuff and it came out looking pretty good.
 
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