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Field Camera Jib/Crane Suggestions

M_Sanderson

M_Sanderson

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Hi,
I need to buy a jib or crane. But there are so many companies making them. Would be great to hear real world experience.
I am looking for jib or crane to be able hold my (f)red. :)
One that can be set up by one person very quickly (10mins?)
One that has minimal parts and is not too heavy.
I dont need a Hugely long one but not a short one either.
Plus I want to be able to attach a remote head if need be (suggestions of remote heads is also appreciated)
So far I have looked at ABC Cranes and Glidecam (I wil continue my research as well thought i'de just drop a line here)
Many thanks already
Michael
 
Hi Michael,

Have a look at Doug Underdahl's Seven Jib.

http://www.longvalleyequip.com/sevenjib.php

The thing I like about it is that it folds into a travel case you can take on a plane.

Really solid, not too heavy, and Doug is a great guy who will bend over backwards to help you if you have trouble.

A few people here use their RED on it.
 
There are two systems I really like. The first is the Porta-Jib. They have a few models, but I'm still fond of the original standard model (I used to own one of the very first units built). The basic unit is the same size as the Seven Jib, but far smoother in operation. It is also expandable, with an extension that gives it about 9 feet of reach. And there's a remote head option for it built by another company - Stanton Visual Systems (makers of the Jimmy Jib, which is also great but probably too much machine for anyone who doesn't plan to make a career out of it).

The other rig I like is the Intel-A-Jib from Industry Advanced. You can buy it in stages like the Porta-Jib but this is a very clean, simple system that can expand to a size slightly greater than the Porta-Jib solution. It is extremely simple to set up but I believe is the slightly more expensive solution.

It so happens that Abel sells both of these products, but that has nothing to do with my recommendations. I think these are both terrific devices, especially for the price(s).
 
I've never used a porta-jib that didn't give me the heebie jeebies, they always work but feel so flimsy. Personally I haven't found a small jib as portable or as versatile as the 7 Jib for the money. Of course the intel-A-jib is a nice unit and I've played with them at Abel, but it's more than I would care to own. At a certain point it's time to hire a jib guy.
The 7 jib is about as much Jib as I can handle on my own without much backache. The Micro dolly jib is also nice but pricey.
 
I can't imagine how you felt a Porta-Jib to be flimsy. I've seen IMAX rigs hanging off them. The standard model is super strong and comes with aircraft pin safeties so one doesn't sweat the ring clamps.
 
I didn't say it was flimsy just that it seems so, the ones I've used always creeked and bowed, i've never seen a failure so I'm sure they hod up fine but the one I use for this TV One show I shoot always seems on the edge of falling apart. It always needs a few good sprits of Tri-flow before we roll but it always works out in the end.
 
I've been super pleased with my Porta-jib Traveller (purchased from Abel in 2005) and fly my R1 on it all the time without issue. As you note, Evin, there is a minor bit of flex, especially when extended to its full length.

The best part of the Porta-jib solutions is the easy telescoping of length.

Michael
 
Thanks for all the feedback.
I like this vector based system on the portajib is this the same on the others?

The only crane I ever used (it wasnt mine) was a custom built one which took 30 mins to set up, screws falling out everywhere and came in three cases, basically it was a mess but had 4metres reach. I rather buy one now, but I would love at least 3 metres. I might need to compromise for mobility.

What about the varizoom MC100 head any good? Once again my only experience with cranes is WITH a remote head (custom built) but all the pictures I see of the portajib are without a head.

That saying the best shots are always the simplest. Renting a head when needed might be a good idea, but then I need to be sure the crane is compatible with remote heads. (btw when does a jib turn into a crane how many metres? :))

Any notes on the varizoom snapcrane12?
All your thoughts are very much appreciated.
Michael
 
You can get a longer jib than the 7 jib, for sure, but then you need a remote head, because you can't use the full length of the jib because you can't reach it. So I made the 7 to be as big as possible but with the average man still being able to reach the fluid head under the camera. I also made the 7 to set up in about 90 seconds, and fold for airline travel. Pretty sure it's the fastest jib to set up, still, after 10 years.

No one ever told me that one jib was "smoother" than any other. They're all smooth, in my opinion. It does take a while for the bearings on a new 7 to work themselves in, I'll admit, but then there's no sticktion left. I've sold dozens of 7s through Abel over the years, too, and still do.

If you want to use a remote head with the 7, or most any other jib, I recommend heads made by Camera Turret. They work well, are very tough (I've really beat up my PT24), are light, and cost about half of what they are really worth. But as with other remote heads, you should know that they are going to take much more time and effort to set up than just using the fluid head that you already have: control cables, video cables, monitor on a stand, power cables, the control box with joystick, battery power supply, all have to be set up. Once you do, though, you can do shots that you can't do with just your fluid head under you camera. But it's a trade off, for sure. As Evin says, at a certain point you just call the guy with the Jimmy or Techno and let him do it, while you get other shots. (I have sold 7s to a bunch of guys with Jimmies because they say that the Jimmy is too big for a lot of situations. Also, Steadicam guys have bought a lot of 7s because they sometimes get to a shoot and the director asks them to do a shot that's actually a small crane move, not a Steadicam move, and rather than disapoint them, they just set up the 7 and get the shot).
 
Thanks for the post Doug.
Very helpful info.
It all sounds very tempting. I had a look at your dolly too. The prices are pretty extraordinary.
This might be something to start with and see how I fare and maybe hire a monster crane on the (probably one or two) days i need it.
I need to do a lot of thinking!!!
 
You could also check out Kessler crane systems. I plan on buying one of their rigs once I find the steps out of the basement I fell into. Talk about value for money. Reach and options galore. Some say the tenth owner of the R1 is a user. You didn't hear it from me, but I heard it from the co. This is in no way an endorsement. Check it out and use what works for you in the given situation. Good luck and happy shooting!
 
Doug,
I bought your 7jib and have to agree, it´s fast to build up, rock solid and smooth. I love it! It´s a great solution for a "one man show", which is the way I work sometimes. I would always again add the extension bar to it. It saves a lot of weight carrying around.
Michael don´t forget: to a heavy Setup a normal tripod doesn´t give enough stiffness to the whole system. No matter which Jib you will choose. I had a lot of problems with a 16kg Setup on a tripod which is ready for 80kg. Maybe you work with smaller lenses, but a Remote head adds a lot of weight too.

Doug, Mitch, could you maybe give me an advise for a Dolly with Bazooka which carries R1 with Cooke 20-100 on the seven Jib?
Should be small to carry, with outdoor wheels.
Thank you!
Marc
 
Doug,

Didn't wish to demean the 7jib at all. It is a great device especially for the price. But it is also more difficult to fine tune and does not have any tension-resistance adjustments like other jibs do, including the similarly-sized Porta-Jib. But for a clean, basic and bulletproof rig that travels in one case, the 7jib definitely rocks.

Marc,
For a decent dolly with a bazooka and outdoor wheels I would say to check out the Panther Husky dolly. It is a solid & stable setup and I've used it many times in tandem with a jib. Another option might be the new Red Dolly from Matthews. I have not used it yet and I don't think this would be the optimal use for this device, but it is worth looking at.
 
To fine tune the 7 Jib, snug the spin on weight collars up against the counterweights on both sides, and turn the weight stack like a steering wheel, clockwise toward the camera to make the camera drop, and counterclockwise away from the camera to make the camera rise. Or find the dead spot where the camera does neither. Turning the weight stack like a steering wheel creeps it fore and aft on the acme threaded rod in very fine increments. Just one secret that dawned on me during a shoot. No need for a small "fine balancing" weight.

As for tension or drag, these are exactly what I DON'T want on my jib. No resistance, just the powerful inertia of the camera and head at one end and the weights at the other providing smooth moves with fingertip control.
 
Another Jib worth taking a look at is the one from EZ FX.
I'm quite happy with mine.
 
I'll give a shout out for the Intel-A-Jib. The sturdiest 10' jib I have found. I was looking for something transportable that would easily hold the weight. The Intel-A-Jib is extremely well made and sets up very quickly.

Don't consider the Kessler Crane for the Red. I have one of those as well for a small camera and it will not be able to handle the weight of the Red.
 
We owned a JimmyJib at the shop I worked at previously, and while fully extended ( I think it was about 16' max ) and rigged it was impressive and made for some great shots, it was not an everyday tool. Even the short version was time consuming with all of the controls. Also getting quality moves with remote operation when you don't do it that often is tough. I use my Miller Projib all the time with my SDX900 fully rigged with Hytron 140 and 7" LCD, with not a bit of flex. It takes very little getting use to for a solid shooter. Setup is very quick. I need 50lbs to counterbalance, but use more for a shorter footprint. It's plenty of movement for most gigs at it's modest about 5 feet. It's like they say it's not the size, but how you use it that counts. :wink: Haven't used it with the RED yet, but I'm sure I'll be able to configure a similarly weighted rig and do just fine.

I haven't seen or worked with Dougs 7jib, but it looks very similar to the Miller based on the pics, and at the price is probably a great rig. I second Doug on not needing the tension adjustment. I always fly mine as loose as possible, and it works great if you get your level and counterbalance spot on. I do use the locks quite often to eliminate an axis, or as an added safety feature. You may want to look for that feature in any of the options.
 
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