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FCP to AE to Color. Where all the experts?

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Paul Harding

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I want to edit proxies in FCP or Premier CS5.
Then Connect to the R3D files in After Effects for keying and effects.
Then send to color.

I have search for a few hours today and can't find this workflow.
Does it exist or is there a better way?
I want to end up with edited R3D files in After effects.

Paul
 
I just did it on a feature online. My conclusion - next time, rent a Scratch or use Avid and DaVinci Resolve!

Or send things to After Effects then re-assemble in FCP, then send to Color from FCP. Or something. But be prepared for ProRes gamma hell.

Probably some of my issues have been fixed by now with stuff like Automatic Duck, etc. But man did it suck.

If it were a smaller project, it would have been fine, I think,

FCP w proxies -> EDL -> Premiere
problem #1: had to manually edit the EDL to trick Premiere into relinking into the R3D files
problem #2: had to write a script to gather all of the R3D files used by the EDL into one folder or else it won't relink
problem #3: Premiere crashed once I tried to re-link more than 50 or so clips at the same time

Premiere -> After Effects:
problem #4: have to apply a Red look for each R3D clip by going Interpret Footage -> Load Look -> OK. Solution - hire an assistant to click through it.
problem #5: After Effects crashes out when you try to render more than 50 clips. After Effects crashes out when trying to do things at 4K.
problem #6: After Effects is not properly multithreaded and sucks performance-wise. Solution - run multiple copies of After Effects using AeAe - thank you Andoru.

After Effects -> Color:
problem #7: Color doesn't want to use AE renders during EDL conform. In the end I ditch the EDL and get After Effects to output each clip as 001_CLIPNAME_TC, 002_CLIPNAME_TC etc. Then drag and drop into color and it puts them on the timeline sorted by name
problem #8: Since I used ProRes, gamma is inconsistent between AE and Color. Solution was to just fight through it.
problem #9: Halfway through my Color project, the Add node in my FX tree stops working. If I reboot it works sometimes. Solution was to use Graeme Nattress' free Transfer Modes effect.
problem #10: When I take my Color project from my Mac Pro to a brand-new iMac, the project renders as stretched horizontal lines. Solution: none, just render everything out on the Mac Pro, curse Color to heck and take everything back into After Effects for a final conform.

After doing that for several reels, I vowed never to do it again and am finishing the rest of the feature using saner methods (Scratch, Resolve).

Bruce Allen
www.boacinema.com
 
There are different programs like automatic Duck, or one by Boris, there is also a free FC to AE scripting you'll find by google search. All these bring your cut into AE out of FC but with different extensions to other parameters you may have changed in the cut like speed, scale etc.
I don't know why you would want to get anything back to color out of AE than a rendered uncompressed QuickTime of your composite because you need to color correct your keys, plates and effects in AE to match, blend or look good. Than you could send renders to Color to do a "normal" more global correction but I would make those final adjustments in AE aswell as long as it saves one more step and Im more flexible by being able to refine some of the comp layers, if needed. There's nothing you can do in color that you couldn't do directly in AE.
Hope that helped
 
What about

1) editing R3Ds in Premiere at low res
2) rendering from Premiere into ProRes 444
3) Round trip to AE from Premiere and back
4) Exporting either XML or Final Cut EDL from Premiere
5) Opening in FCP
6) Send to Color

Seems to me things are pretty good once you get into ProRes and go between FCP and Color. Also, break the timeline into 20 minute segments as if they were film reels. No need to be sending a huge timeline all at once. Films edited in AVID used to be done that way because AVID couldn't handle large, complicated timelines back in the day.
 
Problem 1-3: You don't need to go through premiere to get your EDL into AE - use a script
4. I think you can automate that. Need to find out where I read that
5. Don't know, didn't have that issue. It's always good to restart your computer before rendering and hit the caps lock while rendering.
6. Try out Nucleo Pro
7. No clue
8. In the project settings click the checkbox saying something like match QuickTime gamma legacy, don't know exactly would have to look it up. Fixes all the gamma issues between aplications and OS.
9.+10. no clue
 
Kim Frank said:
There are different programs like automatic Duck, or one by Boris, there is also a free FC to AE scripting you'll find by google search. All these bring your cut into AE out of FC but with different extensions to other parameters you may have changed in the cut like speed, scale etc.
I don't know why you would want to get anything back to color out of AE than a rendered uncompressed QuickTime of your composite because you need to color correct your keys, plates and effects in AE to match, blend or look good. Than you could send renders to Color to do a "normal" more global correction but I would make those final adjustments in AE aswell as long as it saves one more step and Im more flexible by being able to refine some of the comp layers, if needed. There's nothing you can do in color that you couldn't do directly in AE.
Hope that helped
Click to expand...

Thanks Kim.

My main concern at the moment is getting the edit of the proxies from FCP and then connect the edited R3D files into AE. as you suggested the other day.
It's a music video so its only 3 minutes long.

I was thinking of going to color because I have never used AE for colour correcting, but I will give it a go. Thanks for all the advice.

Paul
 
Try Clipfinder…
 
How does it get the R3D files into AE?
Paul
 
I have been in this situation and after a bunch of tests I went
FCP edit ---> Color ---> back to FCP ----> AE

Attached is a script I found on the internet for FCP to AE. It reads an exported FCP XML

edit: this was with a prores 4444 online edit
 

Attachments

Clipfinder works very well for me, it can replace R3D for proxies and vice versa in XMLs.
 
I could not seem to get the work flow working with after effects. So just bought Automatic Duck. Just trying it now.
Paul
 
Paul Harding said:
Thanks Kim.

My main concern at the moment is getting the edit of the proxies from FCP and then connect the edited R3D files into AE. as you suggested the other day.
It's a music video so its only 3 minutes long.

I was thinking of going to color because I have never used AE for colour correcting, but I will give it a go. Thanks for all the advice.

Paul
Click to expand...

As Uli suggested clipfinder can relink your R3Ds, than send to AE through Automatic Duck.

If you are familiar with Photoshop, the main After Effects color correction tools work the same. You can put them on a adjustment layer or directly onto the Footage. Also I'd recommend Colorista for powerful colorwheels or just use Color Finesse.
As I said for compositing work for me it's better to stay in AE to really be able to match the several plates and than apply an overall Look with. Colorista or Color Finesse.
 
Good advice Frank. I am now editing log and transfer files in FCP then will output XML then Automatic duck into AE.
Hope it works for me.


Paul
 
Yes I think it is, I tried it, but it did not bring in the R3D files, which is what I was looking for
Paul
 
I would also render DPX out of AE to avoid the gamma issues. Color likes working with DPX. Or was there an issue with the kind of DPX AE generates not working in Color? Test!

Automatic Duck worked great the last time I used it.


Dusty
 
thanks for the tip Dustin, I haven't got that far yet!

Paul
 
I once had a similar workflow problem (FCP to AE, no need to go back in Color however) and I solved it by reconnecting my r3d footage by using Clipfinder, exporting an XML and importing it in Premiere afterwards. I then just had to save the Premiere file and import it in AE.

It worked without any problem on this project (the final output was in 1920X1080), but I was wondering if it made any sense at all, since I think it's a pretty weird workflow. Also, is there any chance that the footage might change, have some quality problem, etc.?
 
I purchased Automatic duck.
It does bring in the red files, to AE but the trim points are jumbled up and in the wrong sequence.
I have tried to contact automatic duct but failed

The submit ticket form comes up with an error
They are offline with instant messaging
The telephone number they give comes back wit a message the numbers not allocated.
No support email address

To be honest I really ticked off the moment. Been on the project all day and nowhere!
 
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