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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Faster than realtime full-debayer transcoding to DPX, QT, etc

what you talkin bout Willis?
 
R3D to DPX

R3D to DPX

Paul Hazlett said:
what you talkin bout Willis?
Click to expand...

He is saying he made 16:9 2K DPX, and to convert 60 seconds in less than that, i.e. 52 seconds.

I my Brother's computer it would have taken maybe half an hour to convert the same one minute shot... The half size is a bit of a cheat since no de-mosaic is needed for half size, you just take a group of four pixels, one red, one blue, and average two green to get the output RGB pixel, a better test would be 4K output.

My CC takes about a minute per frame for 4K to 4K (uncompressed TIF 16bit 48bpp) because of the Harddrive speed, only about 20% is the CPU time at 4K, so he must have a RAID array or something?

i.e. he has a very fast computer, it seems as a new product?
 
;) hehheh.

I'm talking about the world's fastest technology platform for viewing & processing R3D footage.

Realtime RGB 4/4/4 HD-SDI playout @ HD/2K (highest quality debayer) from 4K 16x9 MAX mode R3Ds? check.

Faster-than-realtime DPX/QT/AVI transcoding at 1080 & 2K (high-quality debayer) ? check.

Meeting tight delivery schedules and making it home for dinner on time? check.


-all this and more coming soon from the evil geniuses at BOXXlabs.
 
BOXXLabs said:
;) hehheh.

I'm talking about the world's fastest technology platform for viewing & processing R3D footage.

Realtime RGB 4/4/4 HD-SDI playout @ HD/2K (highest quality debayer) from 4K 16x9 MAX mode R3Ds? check.

Faster-than-realtime DPX/QT/AVI transcoding at 1080 & 2K (high-quality debayer) ? check.

Meeting tight delivery schedules and making it home for dinner on time? check.


-all this and more coming soon from the evil geniuses at BOXXlabs.
Click to expand...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qcDztfFXPww
 
this performance using what kind of software?

i mean , even using redcine or using Scratch?

Price range?

Thanks

G
 
Dan Hudgins said:
The half size is a bit of a cheat since no de-mosaic is needed for half size, you just take a group of four pixels, one red, one blue, and average two green to get the output RGB pixel, a better test would be 4K output.
Click to expand...

There are two modes for direct 4k to 2k. One does something similar to what you describe above, "half-standard" it is called in the control panel.

The other mode is "half-high", which is much more advanced and better looking than the above method, but slower. Still, it's a lot faster than doing a full demosaic of the 4k and a scaling operation to 2k.

I'm not sure from the description of what is being done here, but those are the options.

Graeme
 
Yeah, the new intel i7, single cpu and its xeon variations are fast.

Realtime playback at such settings (2Khigh and 1080) is what a typical 1300-1700€ PC today gives. (core i7/nvidia 260/80/sata onboard raid).

Rendering with such settings, a regular single core i7 writes 1 minute redcode footage to dpx in ~75 seconds.

The 2.6 Ghz (and faster) Xeon 7 series reach faster than realtime, and the upcoming i7 basing dual xeons as well.

What motherboards is boxxlab using? Traditionally tyan?

p.s.
However, 2K high gives you pretty much more "noise" - one should remember that 75% of the image data is not debayered, only 25% of the 4KRC36!
For full quality one should use 100% of the raw information, which doesnt run in realtime on the existing and upcoming i7 xeons, sadly.
 
As far as I know, what is called "half-high" in the RED Quicktime Codec Control Panel is not the same as what you're seeing in REDCine. When you're doing half resolution at high quality in REDCine you're doing the same as "half-standard" in Quicktime.

Yes, it sounds like the names are not intuitive and clash.

Graeme
 
Why would you use 100% of the RAW data if you only really need 2K frame?

The image quality of 2K frames generated in Scratch Cine (and Red Cine) at the "half-high" setting seems to be good enough for most people.

I'm not convinced that processing 4K of RAW data for a 2K frame would be worth the extra transcode time. Is this is a trade off that would make sense for most peoples needs?
 
Because it looks better? It has lower noise and less aliasing for starters! If you start with the full 4k and downsample, you'll get even better results still, but at the cost of longer render time.

order of quality would be

1st: 4k demosaic to 4k, then downsample
2nd: half-high in Quicktime, RedAlert etc.
3rd: half-standard in Quicktime, RedAlert, or the half high mode in REDCine

Order of speed would be the reverse order of above.

Graeme
 
Right. sure.

But now we're talking 25:1 (or slower) transcode times. This is not feasible for many production schedules.

I guess it's useful to weight the tradeoffs -and use whatever methodology will yeild the right results for your project.
 
In oh so many areas of image processing, there are ways to trade speed for quality. I believe in giving users options, so they can decide what will work best for them.

Graeme
 
Graeme Nattress said:
Because it looks better? It has lower noise and less aliasing for starters! If you start with the full 4k and downsample, you'll get even better results still, but at the cost of longer render time.

order of quality would be

1st: 4k demosaic to 4k, then downsample
2nd: half-high in Quicktime, RedAlert etc.
3rd: half-standard in Quicktime, RedAlert, or the half high mode in REDCine

Order of speed would be the reverse order of above.

Graeme
Click to expand...

What's most important here is the ability to playback and manipulate the data in realtime. We *always* process our final deliverable at full res and then down-sample to our end format. However, while we are working, we need the ability to grade and playback instantly. This is where the REDBOXX comes into play and this is what it was designed for. It was not designed to purely crunch data. Some people use the realtime SDI output as their final deliverable but we use it only for previewing while we grade and I suspect most people do the same. So this is a very important development for those of us who are trying to support a native DI pipeline.
 
That's right Emery, and that's why the half mode exists as it does in Redcine. It's designed for maximum speed.

Graeme
 
hmm. Makes sense.

I would love to know what % of RED projects use "1/2-high-rendered" HD/2K DPX/QT frames as the deliverable for online editorial? for VFX?

My assumption was that most folks used 1/2 high @ HD or 2K for the deliverable unless the project is destined for film or is VFX-heavy. Perhaps not?

Are most folks generating 4K frames (with the full 4K debayer) and then downconverting?
 
sorry guys ... where is the control panel to set this different modes...

i can't find that settings in redcine 3.1.2

thanks

g
 
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