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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

EPIC to output PRO RES

Curran Giddens said:
What is wrong with bolt-on modules? I think the whole modular system is brilliant. I doubt a Red ProRes module would be very bulky or too heavy.
Click to expand...

And the great thing about a ProRes module is you could record RAW files at the same time so you have a negative to go back to if need be.
 
http://www.zoomfilmtv.com.au/ftp/Dynamic_range/Dynamic range from a 4444 PRORES _ FROM RED.mov

This is why I love RED RAW,
This is why I love RED LOG PRO RES

This movie is of some footage that my camera assistant rolled of by checking the roll button for the crane.
He was not concerned about what the f-stop was set at or the image captured.

The left side is a PROXIE (and what was on the split) - The Right side is a corrected REDLOG PRO RES file graded in FCP to retrieve what was there.
So in short. the R3D has even more information again, but the PRO RES file had all this to play with. Very impressive.
I will never ever shoot any shot under exposed like this, so this is why REDLOG PRO RES suites anyone that wants to work fast and still maintain huge amounts of grading range on a FCP time line.

R3D's are for people that completely stuff up there exposure or want to retrieve some thing from it it's darkest regions.
R3D is our Negative, Throw it back up into REDCINE X when you need it.

Film world still exists for me, but doesn't cost me $537 per 4 minutes (400ft roll) processed.

I so love this shit. :thumbup1:
 
Noah Kadner said:
Yup- while RAW is a great asset when you require it and have the post resources and time to fully leverage it, the efficiency of direct to ProRes and a speedy post finish are also desirable to a great many productions. I for one would welcome at least the option.

Noah
Click to expand...

Amen.
 
I would rather have a auto box to convert to prores so there's no added weight for steadicam or 3d rigs. Recording proxies on camera doesn't make sense to me for epic. It's like putting trailer on a lotus.
 
Nanoflash Pro Res capture from RED

Nanoflash Pro Res capture from RED

Johnny Friday said:
also the NanoFlash for prores 422. but not likely what you are talking about when digging into the deep RAW info from red.
Click to expand...

I've looked at the Nanoflash Johnny, are you using it??wonder if it will fit in Mike's AV housing.

Frazier
 
Guys, I'm fairly ignorant about camera tech -- however,
I'm guessing there's only so much technology they can
cram into that tiny little Epic brain. I mean, the Alexa
seems to be 3-4 times the size.

So I'm guessing if Pro-Res recording is an option, it will
most likely have to be modular. Which is fine by me,
it's so portable now.

It's already a miracle what they've managed to fit inside
the Epic as it is .......
 
AnthonyFlores said:
Guys, I'm fairly ignorant about camera tech -- however,
I'm guessing there's only so much technology they can
cram into that tiny little Epic brain. I mean, the Alexa
seems to be 3-4 times the size.

So I'm guessing if Pro-Res recording is an option, it will
most likely have to be modular. Which is fine by me,
it's so portable now.

It's already a miracle what they've managed to fit inside
the Epic as it is .......
Click to expand...
for me if, than it has to be a module,
i neee raw like a vampyre needs blood
 
J. P. Sendall said:
Why not just rent or buy a Atomos Ninja, 600 euros and takes the feed direct from the HDMI out, records direct to Prores 422 HQ and can record 8 hours of footage? Soon it will take SSD to.
Click to expand...

An onboard solution would have advantages over using the ninja or nano, not least in that the epic would automatically generate clip numbers which would match the r3d clip numbers, for easier linking with raw later in the edit.
 
There already IS a Prores module - its called a RED ROCKET CARD>
With SSD (2x offload time to CF) plenty of time to transcode that footage
to Prores with Redlog metadata.

Plus you can record 1080P off the HD-SDI out... if there is no time. But if you have time to edit, why not take the time to do a FULL 4K debayer to Prores via RED ROCKET>
and they are now only $3K (refurb) on RED.com - plus you can also serve AVID editorial clients
 
I wouldn't want a ProRes module... If RED did make one, then suddenly most of my clients would start demanding it. And directly recording ProRes would play right into the "good enough" mindset that so many people have. And why should we even need this now when we can create and load looks right into the camera anyway and then those are automatically transferred onto the R3D RAW footage. Other than FCP, every other mainstream NLE (the ones that matter, anyway) support R3D natively. If the next release of FCP/FCS does not have native R3D support I will not buy it. Case closed. L&T and QT wrappers is so 2008 -- time to move on. And maybe they'll shoot QT in the head and fix their gamma issues while they're at it. Not likely, but we can always dream of world peace and other impossible things.

And whatever happened to the RED working / RGB codec. If that's still on the table, why should they promote ProRes when they could release something better? Something that could be completely free to license and incorporate and use on any platform...
 
Last edited:
its about saving time...
yes, some would use the prores files as master, so what?
today alot of projetcs are transcoded and then finished in prores.
the transcoding step time sucks when you have 200 min + of footage per day.
i am all for a prores module or any instant editing codec module.

great offline files for those who do an offline online workflow anyway and
great finishing codec for tv and web.

and regarding native r3d editing:
avids AMA is useless for longform due to its 32 bit architecture, and it cant use a rocket for playback.
cs5, dunno, i dont know one single editor using it for longform,
cant talk about shorts, musicvids or commercials, though.
and vegas?
same as CS5
 
Here's hoping the new feature JJ is announcing in a few days is a tidy little ProRes module for Epic. Makes so much sense.

Even with Alexa & direct-to-edit - I just heard from a local DP here in Brisbane that the biggest post house in our state (who shall remain nameless but has recently recruited the former CEO of Supercheap Auto parts as their new CEO, whilst their former CEO runs for Mayor), are unrelentingly charging their clients who bring them ProRes footage, to output the ProRes files from an FCP timeline to HDCAM, then back into Media Composer 3.0.

Kind of a pointless story - but thought it was a nice example of the glaring dichotomy between the new wave and the Establishment :)
 
Jeff Kilgroe said:
I wouldn't want a ProRes module... If RED did make one, then suddenly most of my clients would start demanding it. And directly recording ProRes would play right into the "good enough" mindset that so many people have. And why should we even need this now when we can create and load looks right into the camera anyway and then those are automatically transferred onto the R3D RAW footage. Other than FCP, every other mainstream NLE (the ones that matter, anyway) support R3D natively. If the next release of FCP/FCS does not have native R3D support I will not buy it. Case closed. L&T and QT wrappers is so 2008 -- time to move on. And maybe they'll shoot QT in the head and fix their gamma issues while they're at it. Not likely, but we can always dream of world peace and other impossible things.

And whatever happened to the RED working / RGB codec. If that's still on the table, why should they promote ProRes when they could release something better? Something that could be completely free to license and incorporate and use on any platform...
Click to expand...

AGREE 10,000% - Prores Module is pretty much against everything RED stands for, and I so dont get this cry for a BAKED IN output... great points jeff!
 
Cüneyt Kaya said:
its about saving time...
yes, some would use the prores files as master, so what?
today alot of projetcs are transcoded and then finished in prores.
the transcoding step time sucks when you have 200 min + of footage per day.
i am all for a prores module or any instant editing codec module.

great offline files for those who do an offline online workflow anyway and
great finishing codec for tv and web.

and regarding native r3d editing:
avids AMA is useless for longform due to its 32 bit architecture, and it cant use a rocket for playback.
cs5, dunno, i dont know one single editor using it for longform,
cant talk about shorts, musicvids or commercials, though.
and vegas?
same as CS5
Click to expand...

Cuneyt- "TODAY" yes. but this world is changing FAST

OK, I could MAYBE see a prores module useful for SCARLET but not for EPIC> not the most advanced camera in the world... its not built for TIME but UTMOST QUALITY.

BUT, lets talk about that Module. Will it do full 5K Debayer on transcode like the Red Rocket? Will it take advantage of all that is glorious of EPIC? will it have to be small and modular to EPIC? If yes to any of the above there is NO way this will cost less than $10 to $15K module. When a Rocket alone costs
$5750. ($3K refurbed)

Why do you think the Alexa, Sony, etc is so much more $ ? its the Baked In Video Processing of the Prores module... FACT: onboard processing is the most expensive part of any "Video" Camera.

Can any of you clamoring for this module make back its likely high cost?
Will you settle for a lesser module that is cheaper but only does a 1/8th Debayer? If yes, then how will you pitch that module against Alexa's?

IMHO Scarlet should be the ONLY one to have a PRO-RES MODULE option.
If at all, but its likely high cost is not justifiable.

I love RED, but its not the best camera for EVERY job - especially one that requires I record 200 minutes of footage that needs to be "ready to edit" immediately and has no time for transcoding. Plenty of other choices for that.

THis all said, if RED comes up with a Prores Module that does a 5K full Debayer of 4KHD to Prores Quad for less than the cost of a Red Rocket, I'll buy one, but unless RED has another miracle and Jim is going to change his mind and target TODAY, it is highly unlikely we will see a PRORES Module.
 
hi tim, if the debayering is done through the GPU (which i guess will happen, because i dont see a scarlet buyer having the money for a red rocket) i dont need a prores module :)
at the end, i guess if you use epic in its full glory (5k redcode 5:1 with HDRx™ you will have to transcode anyway)

and i say, today and in the near future a rocket is a must have when you have invested in a red camera, too much benefits to count with a rocket
 
Surely the Module could work from the already debayered RGB path that is going to or coming from the I/O Module. Can't find the post with the prices for Epic/Scarlet accessories but I can't remember the I/O Module costing $10K-15K and this module does what you describe apart from the encoding to Proress/DNxHD.

For me, what is appealing about the Proress Module (I would prefer DNxHD for many reasons but that's another debate) is the speed at which you can begin an offline or begin working with footage without the need to transcode. I know that in the future native R3D editing will be the norm but currently it's just not as robust as working with NLE proprietory codecs such as Proress or DNxHD. Who knows what 2011 will bring but I cannot see this position changing substantially.

The Epic camera is modular for a reason - so we can add modules ;-)

RED would sell a boat load of these and I don't think it undermines the whole point of shooting RAW, it just gives us another option. Everyones mileage does vary and I can see that some would not need it but I would bet they are in the minority.

All the best,
 
RAW is great if you are shooting a feature or ad but the price point for RED's
cameras makes them an option for day-to-day video production.

This is the realm where turnaround wins.
 
just talked with a friend about the workflow situation in 2008.
do you remember when scratch was the only raw cc tool for red?
seeing how red changed the post market is great!

resolve for 1000 dollars is the highlight, dremacolor reduced the barrier for monitoring, avid doing a comeback as nle vendor.
stable redcine x...

man for 50k you get a cam and postsolution today which would have cost 500 000 k a couple years ago!
 
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