Epic noise and BB problems

[Meelis Veeremets]

Hi,

I have shot some tests with Epic-x and my color grader and I noticed that picture is much noisier that Red One MX picture. As we have been shooting and grading more that a year MX picture the difference was evident. We shot a small comparison test and it is true.

Another thing is that while preparing for the test shoot, I did a black balance for both cameras. I epic did black balance twice so that all red colors were blue. After second time it even did some strange motion and picture artifacts. I did reset for the camera and the again new black balance and then it was ok, but noise was still there.

No idea what it could be..

Meelis Veeremets, E.S.C.

 

[jimhare]

What compression ratio on the Epic?

 

[Meelis Veeremets]

5:1

 

[Deanan]

Can you send me a lenscap shot of black?
deanan at red

Epic has been way cleaner than mx in many ways in our tests.

 

[CK Olsen]

The EPIC noise you are experiencing seems highly unusual...

I am presenty working with several hours of low light footage from a 3 camera shoot (Shot at ISO setting of 1280) involving 1 Epic, 1 Red One MX, and 1 Red One NON-MX...

With all three synced images side by side, the EPIC footage is essentially noise free, with the MX Red One a VERY close second.

The only noise I am seeing is in the heavily pushed NON-MX RED One footage... and even THAT is holding up better than I expected.

All 3 cams were shot at 4K... the two Red One's at 4K 16:9 (I think RC28), and the EPIC at 4K HD (at 10:1 compression.)

 

[Gunleik Groven]

Sounds very strange...

G

 

[Axel Mertes]

Can you send me a lenscap shot of black?
deanan at red

Epic has been way cleaner than mx in many ways in our tests.

Hi Deanan,

how is that?

I think the sensors are the same, so shouldn't they produce identical results with identical settings?
Or is the noise correction/processing etc. different between the two cameras?

One of the reasons to keep the old RED ONE M-X as Stage 2 customer is to have a backup, second unit or simply matching second view camera at hand.
My expectations are they should match as close as thinkable.

Cheers,
Axel

 

[Gunleik Groven]

There's more to a cam than the sensor, fortunately.
R1MX and Epic CAN match very well, if shot on the conditions of the R1 MX.

Just my 2 (fairly thoroughly tested) cents

The Epic is another beast, and that is why we are so happy to have them, right?

 

[jimhare]

The Epic has advanced processing guts and can produce a cleaner image, but for all intents and purposes the bodies should be considered interchangeable for the most part, just that Epic has a slight edge.

Hi Deanan,

how is that?

I think the sensors are the same, so shouldn't they produce identical results with identical settings?
Or is the noise correction/processing etc. different between the two cameras?

One of the reasons to keep the old RED ONE M-X as Stage 2 customer is to have a backup, second unit or simply matching second view camera at hand.
My expectations are they should match as close as thinkable.

Cheers,
Axel

 

[Meelis Veeremets]

Hi Deanan and others,

my problem was solved with software update. We had 1.6.42 and we updated to 1.6.44 and it looks like noise is MUCH nicer. My color grader agrees. We have not done yet side by side comparison with MX, but it looks ok already. Before I had also problem that if you look color (red/magenta) preview, I felt all the time that magenta comes too early. Now it looks much more like MX and feels right.

Thanks for help and opinions.

Meelis Veeremets, E.S.C.

 

[Meelis Veeremets]

Hi,

It looks like noise issue is solved, but I have new question. When I first saw the Epic I felt something is wrong with the Exposure, but now after doing side by side test with MX I'm sure - Purple in Exposure view on Epic comes much easily than on MX. And now I'm not sure anymore how to expose. On MX I was using Exposure mainly for checking what is going on in RAW. On Epic I feel there is no good way anymore to know what is going on in shadows. I took two photos - MX sand Epic display at the same settings:

Any ideas?

Meelis Veeremets, E.S.C.