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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Epic Meets Leica

Kian Marandi said:
Forgive my lack of knowledge...

I am trying to learn as much as I can about lenses. What aspects of that mountain/moon shot indicate the higher quality of the lens? What is it that the Leica is able to do, that a lesser lens may not? My eyes are not trained to see the advantages yet.
Click to expand...

Hi Klan,

I'm FAR from an expert on this, especially relative to others here, but there are quite a few things that separate top lenses from others -- including ...

- Sharpness
- Color rendition
- Contrast/Micro-contrast
- Performance across all aperture settings
- Quality/beauty of bokeh
- Lack of chromatic aberration and other distortions

Also, there is something often referred to as "character" which is more subjective.

What everyone is freaking out about these Leicas is basically they win on every single criteria.

Historically, Leica has made the very best still lenses and this is not just an opinion -- I've seen
review after review from reputable experts about the exceptional performance of Leica M glass,
their R line, and recently their S line is believed to be the very best MF glass in the world.

Now, with the Leica Summilux-C's you get flawless quality across the board -- potentially beyond
what madePanavision lens performance legendary (Leica made the glass in Primos) ... you get the
incredible wide open performance Leica has always been known for ... and you get the "3D-like"
character people often praise Leica for.

And on top of all that, they are smaller than high-end Cine lenses like the Master Primes, they are
light, and they are the same size across all the focal lengths, making them easier to work with in
many ways.

Film making is many art forms rolled into one -- with photography obviously being a big part of it.
And just as lenses always make a big difference in the subtle quality and beauty of photography,
they also make quite a difference to DP's and directors expressing their vision on the screen.

Sorry to be rambling, I'm sure others can do a better job of explaining why Leica lenses are
technically superior -- but I just wanted to make sure you got at least a basic answer so you could
understand why all of us are freaking out.

Anthony
 
AnthonyFlores said:
Hi Klan,

I'm FAR from an expert on this, especially relative to others here, but there are quite a few things that separate top lenses from others -- including ...

...

Anthony
Click to expand...

Thanks Anthony for that post. Appreciate it.

As an example, what would have been/looked different in that shot of the mountain range had it been taken with a lower quality lens?

Is there something in that picture that popped out at you and you thought, "wow, those ____ looked so _____" ? =)
 
Does anyone know the book rental rate is on these lenses?
Curious what the approximate return on investment could be (seemingly the early adopters are more likely to benefit).
As RPP or Zeiss Compact Primes are around $400/day I'm assuming these are in the area of $2000/day or more (?)

Many thanks,

Brian Broz
DIT Underworld 4 3D
 
Brian Broz said:
Does anyone know the book rental rate is on these lenses?
Curious what the approximate return on investment could be (seemingly the early adopters are more likely to benefit).
As RPP or Zeiss Compact Primes are around $400/day I'm assuming these are in the area of $2000/day or more (?)

Many thanks,

Brian Broz
DIT Underworld 4 3D
Click to expand...

Hey Brian,

Well, given that their retail price per lens is pretty much on par with Master Primes ... I would expect a somewhat similar price. The only
wild card is demand could be higher because of the buzz, and also supply much more scarce than MP's or Cookes.

Given that, with Master Primes often going for around $1200-1500 per day (set of 5) ... you would expect to pay around $2000 for the full
set of 8 Leicas.

The more I think about it, however, the early buyers will probably charge a premium to get faster ROI before more sets hit the market. So
could be easily be $2500 per day.

Too much higher and it probably start to get ridiculous ...

Not sure if BandPro rents, but Otto Nemenz in LA will (from what I hear) and they are probably one of the few that will have matched
sets for rental this year. Here's their info:

Otto Nemenz Los Angeles >>>

(that's my best attempt at a Sanjin-esqe link!)

Btw, what lenses are being used in UW4 (if you can say, of course) ... ?

Thanks,

Anthony
 
Aparently Otto gets the first 25 sets, so they will tie up all rentals for sometime as these sets are hand made and will roll out slowly. Ive heard from sales dept at Band Pro that if you put in an order today you wouldn't see the lenses for at least a year if not longer. Plus they began taking pre-orders almost a year ago so many other rental operations have put in orders behind Otto's 25 sets, so possibly its a year and a half back ordered by now or more. But maybe if they get enough orders Leica will hire more hands to grind and assemble.

Its the perfect lens set.... but that's a lot of cash!

Anybody want to go in on a set? contact me, ideally east coast US
 
Hey Tom, I hope the weather is cooperating and you can shoot something fantastic. Really can't wait to see more of what you can do with the best camera and lenses in the world :)

Anthony
 
Weather has been very difficult all week! It's been the worst weather for filming since last April. BUT... we've been working really hard and driving all over the state to get some good stuff. Shooting on these lenses, with the Epic, is such a dream. It's going to be difficult to give them back to BandPro today!

Soon I will have some time to post more sample images from the lenses, and some behind-the-scenes photos from our shoot this week.

I want to thank BandPro again for putting their trust in me this week.

We drove all the way to Mono Lake yesterday. It was beautiful up there...

leicamono.jpg
 
Tom, no more evil BTS shots of that 18mm untill you post a grab please. :)

Kian Marandi said:
Thanks Anthony for that post. Appreciate it.

As an example, what would have been/looked different in that shot of the mountain range had it been taken with a lower quality lens?

Is there something in that picture that popped out at you and you thought, "wow, those ____ looked so _____" ? =)
Click to expand...

I am not a lens connoisseur either, or a DP, but the easy one would be CA, lack thereof. Most lenses shooting at T3 would have been plagued with CA on all the abrupt dark-to-bright edges, so pretty much the entire face of the mountain with dark trees and bight snow would have needed some post clean-up. But good lenses, and there are many, wouldn't have had that much of a problem with CA. These however, didn't introduce any noticeable CA, and wouldn't have done so wide open either which is wild. If you try to compare how well these perform wide open --at T.1.4-- then not only are they beyond comparison for those lenses that aren't as fast, but also will probably best all others in terms of how clean of an image you will get, other than perhaps MPs that will be close or right up there with them. All of this of course only based on what I saw and others are reporting thus far... but, all things considered these are most likely going to be the best all-around cine primes. A little pricier than MPs, but also a heckuvalot smaller and lighter, and probably even cleaner and sharper despite how incredible/unnecessary that sounds. 0.0002
 
It's really a pity that EPIC can't get Leica-M flange focal distance of 27.95mm for installing Leica-M bayonet mount.

Why?

Because it would be a killer photographer/cinematographer camera combo that could offer the smallest 5K digital cine camera together with the smallest and best FF35mm manual focus still lenses.

Btw. with Noctilux on Epic in low and available light you would't need HDRx...

But to repeat again that RED didn't listen to me...

page57_6.jpeg

MTF Summilux-M ASPH at 1.4,

Read More>>>
 
Wide open, at T1.4, these lenses are only 10% off maximum resolution, I've been told.

I'd love to shoot a resolution test against 65mm 5-perf using an Epic and these Leicas.
 
Yeah it would be nice to see the Zeiss M mount 15mm lens on a RED. Probally the greatest wide ever made.
 
chuck colburn said:
Yeah it would be nice to see the Zeiss M mount 15mm lens on a RED. Probally the greatest wide ever made.
Click to expand...

Chuck,

that's for sure. I tried it once in the shop but on RED1 or any other s35mm sized sensor would vignette.

I had Voigtländer 15mm Helier f/5.6 that is even much slower than Zeiss M 15mm f/2.8 and it was vignetting on RED1.

Have a look at the picture and a short test clip below.

Maybe Leica Summilux-M 24mm f/1.4 ASPH it could be the last wide lens that would not vignette at s35mms sensors.

The main reason I didn't try out that lens on my RED1 before is that the lens is still not available to buy just because Leica is too busy almost two years

to finish project of Summilux cine primes and they can't make so much of still lenses at the moment...

That's why stocks of Leica still glass are almost empty and vintage Leica glass have got the highest prices ever...

Voigthleander15mmHelier2.jpg

Shot handheld on RED1 with Voigtländer 15mm Helier f/5.6 @ wide open @ f/5.6 (vignetting of the lens is pretty much obvious).

A short test clip with Voigtländer 15mm Helier f/5.6 on RED1>>>>
 
I'm looking forward to using my Leica R's again -- on an Epic.
Was considering selling, but have just re-considered.
 
spaulgal said:
I'm looking forward to using my Leica R's again -- on an Epic.
Was considering selling, but have just re-considered.
Click to expand...

Me too.

And today I just bought Leica Vario-Elmar-R 21-35 f/3.5-4.0 Asph a small light-weigh zoom.

Awesome!!!
 
I have my eye on that lens too. It will cover a gap I have in my prime set.

How will you mount to your Epic?
 
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