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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Epic M or X ?

R

Richard Lowther

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If you had a up coming lower budget movie project due to start photography at the end of August and you were in line for stage 2 Epic X program (low 1000 serial #s)
Would you go through with Epic M or wait for Epic X? I would not get the M until mid August. Would the Epic X be shipping late August? Is it worth the extra $25k or so for a M? Really need the slow motion of the Epic so Red One will not work...... Just thinking out loud......any input will be greatly appreciated ?????

Thanks
Richard
 
EPIC-X UPDATE on 07-01-2011 by Jarred

EPIC-X UPDATE on 07-01-2011 by Jarred

Jarred Land said:
Many of you may of heard the news from Japan today via the IHS ISuppli chain summit, that the Electronics Supply Chain is expected to recover in late August / early September, and I am happy to confirm that our suppliers are finally reporting to us a very similar message.

For those of you that may of missed the news:

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/semiconductor-supply-chip-supplier-japan-earthquake,13030.html

http://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-20110629-710262.html

Granted.. we have been told various recovery dates over the last 3 months that have never panned out, but we are incredibly optimistic that the train has finally been put back on the tracks and we will be able to begin shipping EPIC-X cameras at the end of August with full production in the first 2 weeks of September.

As you know, we have been at the mercy of suppliers since March, but we haven't been standing still.... Our assembly lines and assembly staff in Southern California have been built up to full capability and once the parts hit our docks, we will be able to build a tremendous amount of cameras in a short period of time.



I can also offer some clarity regarding the EPIC-X package, since a few things have changed since we first announced Stage 2.

We have upgraded the package to include a Titanium PL mount as standard instead of the Aluminum mount,, and also upgrade to the Side SSD module as standard instead of the CF side module. The Base I/O module has been discontinued and will no longer be included.

I am happy to say the package price will remain the same.

Previous Stage 2 Package: Brain, PL Mount (Al) , Side CF Module , 5" LCD, REDmote , Module Adaptor , Base I/O Module , Pro Battery Module, 2x REDVolts , Travel Charger

New Stage 2 Package : Brain , PL Mount (Ti) , Side SSD Module , 5" LCD, REDmote, Module Adaptor , Pro Battery Module, 2x REDVolts, Travel Charger
Click to expand...

EPIC-X UPDATE on 07-01-2011 by Jarred
 
get the epic M, probably you will have it in a few weeks.
and the M is here today. the M works. the M has support today.
for a whole feature the 25k premium to be save are definitly worth it.
2 lire's from here.
 
Richard,
contrary to what anyone may have told you....reality is you won't know WHEN you'll get the M. On two that i have....there was a 3 week wait, then i think 6 week wait....today it may be even longer due to more demand. So i doubt you can count on a delivery time table.... is it worth the extra $25k? why would you ask this question first....seems you are the only qualified person to answer that question. So, is it? Are you at least making $25k on the camera?

One scenario is shoot on RED ONE MX, then when you need to shoot hi-speed; rent an EPIC M. Seems pretty simple to answer those questions you pose. I'll also add.....how do you know X's will ship in late August?
 
A recent post (can't fnd it right now) mentioned a wait of around 2 months for delivery of an M.

So I think you're too late to bet your project on either option.

How long is the shooting likely to take? Is your start date set in stone? Rent an M until your X shows up seems to be your only choice at this stage.

Mike
 
I'd be careful quoting a post you can't find from a source we aren't sure of especially when everything is changing. :-)

I'd suggest calling Brent to get a current estimate.

Jim

Mike 'Fireman' Ross said:
A recent post (can't fnd it right now) mentioned a wait of around 2 months for delivery of an M.

So I think you're too late to bet your project on either option.

How long is the shooting likely to take? Is your start date set in stone? Rent an M until your X shows up seems to be your only choice at this stage.

Mike
Click to expand...
 
Jim, your resistance to the urge to give dates is... Admirable?

I'd ask why not give the guy something tangible to plan on instead of this, but I already know the reason why not. ;-)

Jannard said:
I'd be careful quoting a post you can't find from a source we aren't sure of especially when everything is changing. :-)

I'd suggest calling Brent to get a current estimate.

Jim
Click to expand...
 
Scott Crawley said:
Jim, your resistance to the urge to give dates is... Admirable?
Click to expand...

I think when schedules change so rapidly, people will be quoting Jim's word as law. It will be quoted on Twitter (in a short soundbyte) without the rest of the "story" behind what causes the schedule to fluctuate.

I think the choice to let owners post for themselves what kind of wait time they had is smarter when you begin to look at the full picture...
 
I'm in the same boat, with a September start for a six week movie shoot. I already decided the M would make sense and put in my request about a month ago, but haven't heard anything yet. If I get my X by then, that would be even better, using the two of them.

Tim Eaton
 
If I can get the M in time, I'm planning to scout with it, shooting location and storyboard frames, all part of the new paradigm. A Director's finder was a decent way to scout for film, discussing framing with the Director, while using a DSLR to capture stills. This system worked okay, but not very precise. To have the precise framing and lens we are going to use in the movie, and capture frames with the Epic we are going to use would be gold.

Tim Eaton
 
Timothy Eaton said:
If I can get the M in time, I'm planning to scout with it, shooting location and storyboard frames, all part of the new paradigm. A Director's finder was a decent way to scout for film, discussing framing with the Director, while using a DSLR to capture stills. This system worked okay, but not very precise. To have the precise framing and lens we are going to use in the movie, and capture frames with the Epic we are going to use would be gold.

Tim Eaton
Click to expand...

I'm not saying you are wrong mind you. But on the features I've shot the last thing the directors what to lug around on a location scout is a 6-10lb camera rig with big heavy batteries. For me its been more usual to see them with iPhone cameras or compact cams, and very occationally DSLRs. All three are quite sufficient for -most- pre-production work. Scarlet may be a bit better. Don't forget that run-time on the handle batteries are 20-40 minutes. So you'd need a box full of spares and chargers as well. And NO director is going to want to deal with that so now you've got to add a camera assistant to location scouts to help change lenses, and batteries.

Now I generally work on a certain calibre of film in the low-to-ultra-low budget. And there is also a political aspect. If while scouting I shoot a quick shot with my Lumix LX3 (which I usually use as it is easy to carry, has multiple aspect ratios, and the math for doing lens conversions to S35 is easy) and don't bother to use grads and ND and Polas for exteriors, or light carefully for interiors, nobody is going to think twice about it. Its just a location scout pix. BUT if I used the Epic, and did a quick and dirty, and the director looks at the footage later and says, hey, this is the cam you are recommending we use for the feature and it doesn't look that great, I've got to explain about all the things we will do to make it right during production.

So I'm not saying you are wrong, but for me I probably won't want to do that on my scouts. I'd rather just talk through the looks we want with the director while we are there and then make sure that all gets reflected in the shotlist.
 
Paul Nordin said:
I'm not saying you are wrong mind you. But on the features I've shot the last thing the directors what to lug around on a location scout is a 6-10lb camera rig with big heavy batteries. For me its been more usual to see them with iPhone cameras or compact cams, and very occationally DSLRs. All three are quite sufficient for -most- pre-production work. Scarlet may be a bit better. Don't forget that run-time on the handle batteries are 20-40 minutes. So you'd need a box full of spares and chargers as well. And NO director is going to want to deal with that so now you've got to add a camera assistant to location scouts to help change lenses, and batteries.

Now I generally work on a certain calibre of film in the low-to-ultra-low budget. And there is also a political aspect. If while scouting I shoot a quick shot with my Lumix LX3 (which I usually use as it is easy to carry, has multiple aspect ratios, and the math for doing lens conversions to S35 is easy) and don't bother to use grads and ND and Polas for exteriors, or light carefully for interiors, nobody is going to think twice about it. Its just a location scout pix. BUT if I used the Epic, and did a quick and dirty, and the director looked at it and says, hey, this is the cam you are recommending we use for the feature and it doesn't look that great, I've got to explain about all the things we will do to make it right during production.

So I'm not saying you are wrong, but rfor me I probably won't want to do that on my scouts. I'd rather just talk through the looks we want with the director while we are there and then make sure that all gets reflected in the shotlist.
Click to expand...

Paul, this is true in many cases - point well taken. But in this case, we're not talking low to ultra low budget - $12 Million for a coming of age story, family picture, with few VFX, stunts, etc. Director is a good friend. He won't be lugging the camera around. I'm not talking about a company scout - just previs for the Director and me. I think it's worth a shot. I'll have to figure out the battery thing though.

Tim
 
Sure, working with friends is always nice as it removes a good amount of the politics. And for careful pre-vis maybe using the epic is just the thing. Sounds like a nice project with a nice budget. Good luck!
 
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