Welcome to our community

Be a part of something great, join today!

Log in
  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

epic decision: weighing the handheld options

Caleb Heymann

Caleb Heymann

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 18, 2007
Messages
330
Reaction score
0
Points
16
These are the options I'm considering for a handheld Epic. Need to decide within 24 hours. These are the pros and cons so far as i can tell.


Option A: The Clutch $4900 (plus extra QR baseplate)

Pros: low center of gravity, quick release compatibility, can take Quickplate for V-lock at back, versatile array of accessories, you can basically let go of the handles and the camera will stay on shoulder, great that the DSMC shoulder dovetail contours perfectly for the modules

Cons: expensive, a lot of stuff for me to carry for run n gun, no adjustable shoulder pad, downside of QR compatibility is needing 2 baseplates to take advantage, and needing LW 15mm support for follow focus


Option B: The Mantis $1950

Pros: durable, relatively inexpensive compared to the clutch, adjustable shoulder pad

Cons: high center of gravity, doesn't fold away nicely, OUT OF STOCK TILL END OF NOVEMBER


Option C: ActionProducts Razor shoulder pad with Arri adapter and Red front handle assembly (about $3600 in total)

Pros: Razor shoulder pad can be mounted under or behind the camera, and it's adjustable (but I'm worried about how much adjustment the arri adapter plate will offer) and can be mounted on top of the camera to 'undersling' the Epic (although with modules that likely wouldn't be practical). I like that Red's front handles can be mounted on the Red Top Handle via rosette if you want them next to the lens

Cons: Razor is not cheap for a shoulder pad, neither are Red's front handles -- this solution comes to almost double the Mantis price. With Razor mounted under bridgeplate, the Epic will sit higher on shoulder with Razor than with Clutch, but lower than the Mantis.


Option D: ActionProducts Razor shoulder pad with Arri adapter and 2-stage O'Connor O-Grips (about $3400 in total)

Pros: Same as above for Razor. I like being able to mount in low mode with O-Grips and their durability and strength may be better than Red handles, and slightly cheaper. Also they can mount on LW 15mm without adapter

Cons: Same as above for Razor. Only downside to O-grips so far as I can see is that they may be on the heavy side for a lightweight Epic handheld rig


If anyone has any views to share I'd love to hear, otherwise I may end up flipping a coin in a few hours.

Cheers,
Caleb
 
Hi Caleb,

I used to own a Mantis for my Red One, but it was a hassle to slide on and off, overkill really, so I sold it. I've moved to the less is more side. Instead of spending thousands of dollars, I paid $55 for one of these:

http://www.filmtools.com/camera-comfort-cushion-com.html

I bought a couple of used Red handles for $200. I did put some money into making the camera light - carbon rods, and the Red Quick Release System. To set up for handheld, I just wear the cushion, and put a handle on the front of the rods. I use a Red brick on the back of the rods for counterbalance. The camera can live on the tripod with the handle on. When I'm ready to go handheld, I just slide the brick back on the rods for counterbalance, and slide the base plate off the dovetail and on to my shoulder. Easy, inexpensive, and simple. It goes back on the tripod just as quickly.

I don't think it needs to be any more complicated than that. The fact that Epic is lighter makes a world of difference.

Tim Eaton
 
Buy the Red Shoulderpad (600 USD) and if you don´t have yet the QR Platform (Dovetail) á 700.- USD and 2 x DSMC Universal Mounts, then you can bolt your Shoulder Pad directly on the QR Plate and at the end of the shoulder Pad you can bolt the 2nd DSMC Universal Mount. Insert two short Rods at the 2nd DSMC Universal Mount and slide your battery on there, this will give you a inexpensive, well balanced Shoulder Rig. Handles in Front are up to your taste, I use my old handles from Red One, but also used a Mountainbike Steering Rod (don't know the appropriate name right now) and clamped it on the Rig. Don´t have a photo here right now, but i hope you understand it.
 
I plan on just velcro-ing some padding to the under side of the quad battery module, since it comes as part of the epic-x package, and throwing that right up on my shoulder. Add a wooden camera easy riser and LW rod adapter, and some redrock carbon rods with my cheap Ronford Baker Moose Bars, or even just holding the sides of the mattebox, and that's all it should take. Light and simple. That's the plan anyway. Won't know how it works until my camera ships.
 
Hi Guys,

I'm about to announce a handheld system that will blow peoples mind. It's quick, easy, light, small imprint on the camera. The design is so you can mount and connect in various configurations without any real interference with the camera system itself. I've designed this with a fellow reduser Kostas Tirintzis (very talented guy) and I have to say the design is no more then amazing. It was for me and my Epic's originally but the result seem to be so far ahead of most things that we've decided to try to put it out on the market.

The idea is that it's "smaller" then other systems. A LOT MORE balanced then most of them. Balance is everything and this one will be perfect. A lot of thought has been put in on making it so it fits perfectly with the Epic and doesn't really add anything. This system will work with the RED quick release system - although we're manufacturing our own quick plates, which actually are slimmer then existing ones. You will in 30sec be able to add it to the camera and it can go under the body onto the quick release.... Or onto an arm that will let it swing into any position around the camera. AND IT'S LITERALLY 30sec to attach.

It's modular so you can attach batteries in the back on rods - if you want to balance it out some more.

The connections ARE NOT Rosette's or allen key - it's something better - NO tooling around and hardly any screwing either LOL. It has a "quick release" for you to pop it open to move the joint and then just a quick turn to lock it. Simple, effective and above all FAST.

We're also designing an EVF mount that you will be pleasantly surprised by - totally effortless - no more bending you're head to watch the bomb evf - no more irritating nova arm to hold it.... AND IT IS VERY SLIM in it's design - fully integrated with the camera.

I LOVE MY EPIC's and above all how small and light they are. So it's important to me to have a system that feels integrated with the camera. Sleek and neat design that not only looks good BUT has functionality above all. This system does. I'm soooo existed about this and want to start telling people now, but have to finish the first prototype first (about 4 weeks), so we can be sure to keep my promises of how good this system is.

(It would contain shoulder rig with quick release system - so if you can wait to invest in quick release then do so.... That goes for top plates to Epic etc as well - as we're designing our own - it makes sense when you will see it)

Ohh did I forget to mention that if orders are large enough most of it will be built in titanium for strength and weight :)

I will start a thread soon about this to see what the interest will be

thanks for listening
 
There is no perfect one stop kit. Mix and match the bits you like/need. I've got a clutch/mantis/allstar/wooden camera creation in progress, just waiting on a few key pieces.
 
Jarek Zabczynski said:
There is no perfect one stop kit. Mix and match the bits you like/need. I've got a clutch/mantis/allstar/wooden camera creation in progress, just waiting on a few key pieces.
Click to expand...

Maybe but I'm pretty sure that ours is as close as it will get :) and I'm pretty sure you will want one too lol.
 
Hi Freddy

Can't wait to get my hands on your system for a real test...

(Disclaimer: I've seen some early sketches of Freddy's design and it looks very interesting... but as always the devil is in the details ;-)

Hurry up!! I'm coming back for another Noma taste treat soon so hopefully by then?

Michael L
 
Thanks for the responses! Very informative. It's interesting to see the range of different solutions. Epic is truly the Harley Davidson of cameras.

@Manuel That's an interesting idea to mount a universal plus rods at the back of the DSMC shoulder pad. I wonder about simply mounting the Quickplate onto the Universal, or if that would get in the way.

@Paris I'm not sure if the modules are meant to take so much strain. Isn't that what the DSMC shoulder pad is for?

@Allstar It seems that if one wants to use the Red QR baseplate (or any arri baseplate) with your system you end up raising the center of gravity significantly, as in the attached photo. Which probably makes it more like a Mantis. Is that so? Also, when will your dual bridge plate be ready, as that seems to be an integral part of the system?

fullsetAR.jpg

@Fredrik I'm curious to see what your idea is, but unfortunately I've got to get a working solution immediately. Looking forward to seeing your work. Will the shoulder pad be countered to the modules a la DSMC or under the camera and adjustable a la Mantis? Are you doing handles as well?

@Jarek -- Curious to hear what you've got going. I'm guessing shoulder pad from Mantis and handles from All Star? Please do share!

Looks like I'll be going with the DSMC shoulder pad (attached to Red QR plate), with universal adapter in the back plus Quickplate and possibly really short rods. And I went with the Spidergrips for handles, as they seem very light weight, well constructed, and the price is right.
 
This is my super small mono pod rig... Ive just shot two massive TV commercials using this config... but not for everyone.
But it is simple and fast.

small_rig.JPG
 
Caleb, I've got something coming very soon that places the Epic optimally and has some other nice advantages. At any rate, as you surmise, everything currently available has its pros and cons. More options are on the way, but if you have to act now I think you have a good handle on the choices.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top