Epic 3D Behind the scenes pictures thread....lets see'em if you got'em!

[Pedro Guimaraes]

Figured I'd start a thread for images of 3D Epic's in action!

I'll start off....But please add you own !!!! ......would love to see some Spiderman 3D shots.....but I know that's not very likely. Maybe someday, would love to see their setups!


Here is some behind the scenes photos from the first project I have done using the Epics for 3D this time with the Epics and the Element Technica Atom(Magnisum) rig owned by Tonaci Digital.


Setting up the rig on day one in the middle of a wet grassy field.....welcome to 3D. We did have lots of help that day.

We used the Angeniuex Rouge lenses fitted with the V3 technology.

For more info on the V3 system check out their website....
http://www.inv3.com/...ging_technology

My rig on the docking stand ready to fly....I'll make this better for the next shoot.....constant refinement is key!!

Here's me in low mode....didn't get a pic of me operating in regular mode....low mode was tough! Rig was on the heavy side as well with the zooms and the V3

I hope I can do further improvements on the setup....maybe short primes (lighter) and moving some weight around. I have a 8 week job coming up soon!

.....akward position in that shot....ground was soft and sloped.....grrrr. Low mode heavy rig....arghhhh. I struggled thru that shot a bit...hoepfully the footage doesn't show it!

Then some handheld action.....1st AC Tanner Stauss handling the C-Motion Cvolution and Operator ?????? man....forgot his name? Tonaci refresh my memory?

Joel Moore (actor in Avatar) directing Brandon Routh (superman) and Rachel leigh Cook.

Tanner Stauss checking focus marks for Rachel Leigh Cook and Brandon Routh.

Finally inside on the slider

All in all a great shoot, thanks Tonaci Digital, 4k ninjas and the rest of the amazing crew out there on that cold rainy day!

Here's me with Actress Sarah Paxton and David Joel Moore who was directing instead of acting for a change.

Can't wait for the next one!



Would love to see everyone's pics! even if it is of just the RIG. That way you might avoid showing any sets or actors etc....and breaking any "rules"

 

[Clyde DeSouza]

Excellent pics! Would love to see more of this kind. As an aside, what was your reasons for the V3 system on an already stereoscopic 2 camera setup.

Not to detract from this thread, if it's too long an answer, i'd love an offlist email on it (if you have the time, and don't mind).
yes my initial exposure to footage from the V3 system for 2 camera stereoscopic 3D left me un-impressed, and I made no bones of it here: http://realvision.ae/blog/2010/09/wobble-view-the-latest-3d-gimmick/

For 2D to 3D this is an interesting device, hands down.
Regards

 

[Mark Toia]

Honestly....it looks cool.
But man, what a pain in the arse! and a waste of money.
2x the cost to shoot, double the post budget and producuction days... for what gain at the box office. Seriously ....
My kids wont even go to 3d movies anymore... (well maybe the big arse block busters or a 3d animation feature)

Still it's an awesome looking rig though. looks way cool.

 

[Pedro Guimaraes]

Excellent pics! Would love to see more of this kind. As an aside, what was your reasons for the V3 system on an already stereoscopic 2 camera setup.

Not to detract from this thread, if it's too long an answer, i'd love an offlist email on it (if you have the time, and don't mind).
yes my initial exposure to footage from the V3 system for 2 camera stereoscopic 3D left me un-impressed, and I made no bones of it here: http://realvision.ae/blog/2010/09/wobble-view-the-latest-3d-gimmick/

For 2D to 3D this is an interesting device, hands down.
Regards

Well,

As far of the use of the V3 system that was not a decision I was involved with. DOP and other factors above my pay grade are what determined that selection.

Like it or not, it is out there. People are going to use it and as a stereographer and a rig tech/operator I welcome the chance to learn and have some hands on experience with the technology. What do I think? Ask me in person...... but in sum I think there should be a good reason to use it. Like most tools.

I'm at the airport about to board a plane to India on a scouting trip for a upcoming 3D feature shooting on Epic's and the atom......should make for some great pictures for this thread in about a month or so.

gotta run!

Honestly....it looks cool.
But man, what a pain in the arse! and a waste of money.
2x the cost to shoot, double the post budget and producuction days... for what gain at the box office. Seriously ....
My kids wont even go to 3d movies anymore... (well maybe the big arse block busters or a 3d animation feature)

Still it's an awesome looking rig though. looks way cool.

Mark.....don't knock it until it starts paying your bills mate!

That is a very subjective point of view.

Even if you don't like 3D, It means more more work for AC's, operators, DIT, more work for the industry as a whole! More movies and projects getting funded.

I fail to see how that can ever be a bad thing.

Besides your incorrect.

It's not double the production days. All my shooting schdules on 3D movies have been just like a 2D. We might of liked more days but then again we say that at the end of ALL 2D productions anyways.

It's not double the cost to shoot. The lighting budget is about the same, the crew is about the same, your just renting a bit more camera gear and hiring 2 more people than usual......hardly double. As cameras and rigs get smaller things get even close to 2D.

While post is definitely more expensive, I don't think it reaches being double.

Given that.......I see the point your trying to make. There is truth to it ...... but......well you are in the 3D forum!

Cheers mate!

 

[Paul Leeming]

Thanks as always for the wealth of information and advice Pedro!

Cheers from Tokyo,

Paul

 

[Ketch Rossi]

Nice Pedro!

More 3D fun awaits you in Italy, both above and below water...

 

[Mark Toia]

Hi Perdo..

I don't mind 3d movies, Avatar is one of my all time Fav's! ... I haven't seen as good a 3d movie after that as yet.. But Im sure one is going to come out soon to surpass the 3d quality of it. I hope.

I do respect all your words about keeping people employed etc.. 100% agree with that. Big budget films can afford the extra time & waste. I say go for it. Make it work!

Regarding on set, I've sat on a 3d shoots and to be honest... it was much much much slower day and the DP on set was beside him self as the promise of working at the same pace in 2d was completely obvious to all on set that it was never going to be the case. Far more camera tinkering.. far more grip handling.. when cameras go from a small hand held EPIC size to a camera system 8x the size once put together, you have just lost your speed and handling advantage. Camera support is an always will be the slowest part of any shoot. You cannot argue with that. If I shoot on Panovisions 35mm compared to a RED shoot day I get 20% more done in a day just due to the camera size.
Been shooting solid for 15 years... seen it, lived it, doing it now..

Camera setup time is much longer as well. Once your rig is setup and on your shoulders, on a crane, on a trip... yes shooting speed is the same. But before and after that... well... sorry mate. no deal.
What I saw was a lot of mechanical work going on (all with professional crews) and less actual shooting going on. Lots of fast quick camera angles comprised because of rig size.

RE POST: Ive gone through the 3d post pipe line and being serious, 4x longer to pair and composite and to render. You have 2 files to sync, match, grade, and render. Huge amounts of data means huge amounts of handling.. FACT.

Here is an examle.
Friend on mine doing a 3d movie now which was to be shot 2d on RED. Budget set was 5.5 mil. New budget is 8 mil for the same shoot in 3d. So not twice as much. but a substantial difference. He needs a 2.5mil extra profit margin after the film is released... Will he get it because its in 3d... Maybe a Sales agent or cinema owner could jump in here?

I do respect that this is a 3d forum.. I'm not bagging 3d... Ive always loved it and always will, It fascinates me no end on many levels.

Oh and I'm not knocking it, I'm just trying to justify it to my clients and investors as I speak.

Have a nice day Pedro.. All cool, thanks for the reply, keep up the great shooting

Well,

As far of the use of the V3 system that was not a decision I was involved with. DOP and other factors above my pay grade are what determined that selection.

Like it or not, it is out there. People are going to use it and as a stereographer and a rig tech/operator I welcome the chance to learn and have some hands on experience with the technology. What do I think? Ask me in person...... but in sum I think there should be a good reason to use it. Like most tools.

I'm at the airport about to board a plane to India on a scouting trip for a upcoming 3D feature shooting on Epic's and the atom......should make for some great pictures for this thread in about a month or so.

gotta run!



Mark.....don't knock it until it starts paying your bills mate!

That is a very subjective point of view.

Even if you don't like 3D, It means more more work for AC's, operators, DIT, more work for the industry as a whole! More movies and projects getting funded.

I fail to see how that can ever be a bad thing.

Besides your incorrect.

It's not double the production days. All my shooting schdules on 3D movies have been just like a 2D. We might of liked more days but then again we say that at the end of ALL 2D productions anyways.

It's not double the cost to shoot. The lighting budget is about the same, the crew is about the same, your just renting a bit more camera gear and hiring 2 more people than usual......hardly double. As cameras and rigs get smaller things get even close to 2D.

While post is definitely more expensive, I don't think it reaches being double.

Given that.......I see the point your trying to make. There is truth to it ...... but......well you are in the 3D forum!

Cheers mate!

 

[Mark Toia]

oooh and Pedro... I dig your rig! way cool,
Youve done it perfectly!

 

[Lucas Wilson]

Regarding on set, I've sat on a 3d shoots and to be honest... it was much much much slower day and the DP on set was beside him self as the promise of working at the same pace in 2d was completely obvious to all on set that it was never going to be the case. Far more camera tinkering.. far more grip handling.. when cameras go from a small hand held EPIC size to a camera system 8x the size once put together, you have just lost your speed and handling advantage. Camera support is an always will be the slowest part of any shoot. You cannot argue with that. If I shoot on Panovisions 35mm compared to a RED shoot day I get 20% more done in a day just due to the camera size.
Been shooting solid for 15 years... seen it, lived it, doing it now..

Camera setup time is much longer as well. Once your rig is setup and on your shoulders, on a crane, on a trip... yes shooting speed is the same. But before and after that... well... sorry mate. no deal. What I saw was a lot of mechanical work going on (all with professional crews) and less actual shooting going on. Lots of fast quick camera angles comprised because of rig size.

Mark,

While you have some reasonable points, they are lost in exaggeration and hyperbole. I've sat on 3D sets as well... of some really big movies that are currently shooting EPICs with 3ality Digital technology. Those movies are working on a 2D schedule. Yes, most days are longer than they would be as a 2D shoot. But it's not a big enough difference that it's delaying the shoot schedule.

A camera system 8 times the size? I have no idea what rigs/systems you're talking about, because a 3ality Digital TS-5-based acquisition system and the Element Technica Atom are both small, lightweight, and not nearly as big as you seem to think "rigs" are.

Camera setup time being "much longer as well" is, well, not true. At least not with our tech. One of our new products, IntelleCal, allows a rig to be set up, lenses profiled, lenses and rig auto-calibrated and aligned and ready to go in 5 minutes with zoom lenses and about 3 minutes with primes.

And nowhere in your comments is the phrase, "and on the S3D project that I shot." Get out there and shoot some S3D with current generation technology, and then talk all the trash you want. But until then, it's hard to take your comments too seriously...

Lucas

 

[Rohan B]

......would love to see some Spiderman 3D shots.....but I know that's not very likely. Maybe someday, would love to see their setups!

Well here it is

 

[Rohan B]

see the 3d rig behind Andrew and Emma

 

[Lucas Wilson]

see the 3d rig behind Andrew and Emma

That would be a 3ality Digital TS-5 based acquisition system...

Lucas

 

[PatC]

Pedro , I will try to add to this a bit this week.

 

[Pedro Guimaraes]

Respectably ....... I have to echo Luke Wilson's sentiments here Mark....

My expirience,

I have worked on 3 3D features......and numerous other projects (small to large). I can tell you that yes in the beginning(3 years ago) we had some growing pains but a couple years later and numerous projects later......me and many of the crew I work with are amazing. I can guarantee that your statement is not true on many of the set I work on. Regardless of brand of rigs we are working with....

The last 3D feature I worked on for example ($35 million budget) we had 2 rigs, a side by side for helicopter shots and a underwater rig as well....we had amazing A-list crew from our DIT (Brook Willard) to our operators, AC's/rigtechs and myself... and I can assure you that they were rarely if ever......"waiting on camera".

We pride ourselves in that fact. We work hard in prep, we work on how do things faster better everyday of a production.

I cannot sit here and let all the hard work that I put in and all the other professionals I work with be misrepresented. I'm not lying when I say that these days Dp's and AD's are not waiting "on camera."

You said........"Camera support is an always will be the slowest part of any shoot. You cannot argue with that. "

I have to argue with that!

On that movie and many other recent productions I have worked on I would say 90% of the time.......we are always waiting on lighting. Lighting the set still takes the most amount of time.

Yes the rigs are heavier and slower to move around set/rig etc....but a good crew can mitigate this.

Post is getting faster and cheaper everyday.....new toolsets and software is speeding up?reducing cost everyday. pablo v4, mystica, scratch etc....


Now I am by no means saying it is just as fast as 2D but a good crew with alot of stereo experience can make a HUGE difference on making your days flow. Sure it's more complicated, sure there is more things to go wrong and fix, but it is truely not as bad as you make it sound!


Now you take and in-experienced crew/DP/director /AD and add 3D to that and you will start seeing delays......this also includes experienced crew with not alot of Stereo experience.


I don't want this thread to be derailed by this discussion......lets go back to posting and talking about the pictures that should be on this thread....

If you want make a new thread on 3D production or something....So Mark.....I see what your saying.....hell I lived it! But it's not as bad as it once was......

Like I tell my clients......"It's getting better everyday!"

Hi Perdo..

Regarding on set, I've sat on a 3d shoots and to be honest... it was much much much slower day and the DP on set was beside him self as the promise of working at the same pace in 2d was completely obvious to all on set that it was never going to be the case. Far more camera tinkering.. far more grip handling.. when cameras go from a small hand held EPIC size to a camera system 8x the size once put together, you have just lost your speed and handling advantage. Camera support is an always will be the slowest part of any shoot. You cannot argue with that. If I shoot on Panovisions 35mm compared to a RED shoot day I get 20% more done in a day just due to the camera size.
Been shooting solid for 15 years... seen it, lived it, doing it now..

Camera setup time is much longer as well. Once your rig is setup and on your shoulders, on a crane, on a trip... yes shooting speed is the same. But before and after that... well... sorry mate. no deal.
What I saw was a lot of mechanical work going on (all with professional crews) and less actual shooting going on. Lots of fast quick camera angles comprised because of rig size.

RE POST: Ive gone through the 3d post pipe line and being serious, 4x longer to pair and composite and to render. You have 2 files to sync, match, grade, and render. Huge amounts of data means huge amounts of handling.. FACT.

Here is an examle.
Friend on mine doing a 3d movie now which was to be shot 2d on RED. Budget set was 5.5 mil. New budget is 8 mil for the same shoot in 3d. So not twice as much. but a substantial difference. He needs a 2.5mil extra profit margin after the film is released... Will he get it because its in 3d... Maybe a Sales agent or cinema owner could jump in here?

I do respect that this is a 3d forum.. I'm not bagging 3d... Ive always loved it and always will, It fascinates me no end on many levels.

Oh and I'm not knocking it, I'm just trying to justify it to my clients and investors as I speak.

Have a nice day Pedro.. All cool, thanks for the reply, keep up the great shooting

 

[Doug Horton]

I don't know if I can post pictures from our latest feature yet, so I'll just post a pic of the rig in my apartment. PatC in the background, TJ in the foreground, Atom w/ EPICs in between.

 

[Mark L. Pederson]

 

[Mark L. Pederson]

 

[Mark L. Pederson]

 

[Ivan Kovax]

Awesome Pedro.

Looks like a hoot. Can't wait to share my future 3D shoot from Japan. I

Ivan

 

[Lucas Wilson]

I wish we could post BTS images from Spiderman... and The Hobbit... and Jack the Giant Killer... they are incredible.

But lawyers frighten me. Especially the Studio ones with big, nasty, sharp pointy teeth.

Best,

Lucas