Economy price of RED ONE?

[Charles Nader]

Hi,

I was wondering with all this economy going down the tubes...jobs loss, companies folding and markets going up & down. I wonder (possibly) if Red was considering a discount on the RED ONE camera. I think Jim stated it wasn't worth the overtime to be spent since the demand is low...I mean low for the R1 or possibly say for the new camera line up.

So, I was thinking say if Jim & co was thinking of say reducing the price of the camera (now, 17.5K) and say lowering it to 14.5k because of the economy. I thought of this and say if you wanted to upgrade to Epic X, you would still get the option to do so but you would have to pay the extra 3K difference. New owners would have the opportunity to raise the extra cash with shooting, renting or just having the camera for gigs.

Just a shot in the dark since the R1 is on the market for say 1 1/2 years or 2 years...is that correct? Prices usually go down maybe not for darn film gear...but it does then in turn help owners out in this turmoil market.

Thought of a way to entice new ownership without say breaking the bank. I mean 3K isn't much but it helps & you could use that 3k for other film stuff (most will do) toward Red accessories to suit up the camera.

My two cents. Would that be a bad thing???

 

[Rick Darge]

I seriously doubt he will lower anything before the Scarlet and Epic come out. Red's are still making people money, bottom line

 

[bobaandy]

Exactly. You contradict yourself. With businesses going under, why would Red LOWER it's prices?

 

[Brandon Fraley]

the only thing competing with the RED ONE are the speculative scarlet and epic. it's still the best camera within a $30,000 price difference. I don't know why they'd decide to lower the price.

 

[Raphael Varandas]

Red does have nothing to do with BullSH...Jim got the right to put the price higher...good for everyone....hahaha


joking

 

[Martin Weiss]

The R1 already has an economy price.

 

[Jeff Kilgroe]

I don't see any reason for RED to cut prices on the One. Especially since the R1 body will hold its value due to EPIC trade-ins, etc..

However, if you're looking for a cheap RED, I bet there's going to be some deals to be had soon. The global economy is a mess and sooner or later some production companies and individual owners will have to make the choice of trying to hold onto their camera(s) or sell them.

 

[Zack Birlew]

Yes, most likely the deals will be in the used market rather than RED itself.

 

[Stephen Williams]

Remember the early adopters only paid $15,000 as they got a $2500 credit for accessories

 

[Robert Frank]

Don't twist the facts.

Don't twist the facts.

Remember the early adopters only paid $15,000 as they got a $2500 credit for accessories

If what you were saying was true then RED One owners would have been able to actually buy a RED for $15000.

Early adopters could not buy their RED One for $15,000, they got $2500 discount on accessories.

 

[dino g]

just to be clear, all of the early adopters i know < serial numbers 199 and less> , have spent well over 50k for their red cameras and related gear, most are in the 100k+ range, so if you think 3k is saving you something, you seriously do not understand what you are trying to buy.

but good luck with trying, one must step up to the plate and swing if they are ever going to get a hit.

 

[Simon Valderrama]

Sony went for HIGHER prices because of bad economy ...

 

[Zack Birlew]

Well, I think you forget that the $2500 credit wasn't an instant savings, you still end up paying $17,500. Depending on what you bought, you couldn't get a fully working RED One for that price. The lowest I could get was $21,000. That was without lenses too. Granted, since buying my Nikon D90, I've learned that I would have been fine with just my 50mm 1.2 for a good while, but that's just my case as a film student.

Plus, there wasn't a Douglas Underdahl upgraded Nikon mount, if there had been I probably wouldn't have been so quick to turn my reservation in as I could have used my brother's 18-200mm 3.5 DX zoom and been as happy as a clam, even though it would have been a stretch financially.

I think that's the problem here. There are people that make money with their RED Ones, such as rental houses and freelance cinematographers, and then there are people that want to make their films with a RED One, everybody else. If I had the money right now, I probably would try to get a RED One and see what I could better afford later, a FF35 Scarlet or an Epic. But I don't and I don't see the benefit in renting, as with many rental places I've looked at, for the period and frequency I would need the equipment, I might as well buy the equipment myself and either keep it for future productions or sell it off afterwards. That's basically the problem, I want a RED One for my productions but no matter what it's just out of reach. So, until Scarlet comes out, some people are going to be stuck.

 

[Jay A. Kelley]

If what you were saying was true then RED One owners would have been able to actually buy a RED for $15000.

Early adopters could not buy their RED One for $15,000, they got $2500 discount on accessories.

This was an allowance towards additional gear that contained a markeup. Depending on what you purchased, you could be looking at markups anywhere from 20% to over 125%. So the "cash discount" off the RED is that much from RED's point of view.

The same thing will apply to the trade in. WE will get $17,500 or more off the purchase price of the Epic-X but it won't cost RED that much.

This is as it should be.. It's good business.

That said, this is still a VERY aggressive policy. Good for RED!

Jay

 

[Stephen Williams]

If what you were saying was true then RED One owners would have been able to actually buy a RED for $15000.

Early adopters could not buy their RED One for $15,000, they got $2500 discount on accessories.

Hi,

To use a RED you need to spend a great deal more than $2500 on accessories, probably between $25,000-125,000 depending on the market your in. YMMV

Stephen

 

[Kenneth Elkington]

I can't see any reason why the RED would come down. It seems like a countercylical good if there ever was one. It's a camera with cinema quality images for a price less than half of the nearest competitors, so demand should be going up with an economic downturn and not down. Besides 3k out of 17.5k is nothing, so RED would be needlessly reducing income for a nonexistent rise in demand.

 

[Charles Nader]

I was saying since the economy is goes down the tubes...to sell more camera just a slight drop in just the camera would benefit new owners and in the result of this, new opportunities will emerge.

Of course, I know that new owners would be spending like 30-50k but its for the budget minded filmmakers that can have the camera like under 20k to shoot great images with say Nikon or Canon lenses, etc.

The camera wasn't built to make money if that was the case I would imagine Jim would charge 75k and still make a profit. He wanted to give filmmakers a chance and develop a camera that would surpass 35mm within an independent filmmaker in mind.

Yes, they did give $2,500 credit toward their purchase. I don't remember if it was only for accessories...its been so long. I was merely suggesting a offer during these hard times to come closer to attaining a R1 and making your films, commercials or just renting the camera to make money. Fine and dandy...but I think you are missing the point here.

I don't know how the demand should be going up since people are losing their jobs and work is very tight. Companies are dropping their advertising budgets. You think you would be making more money in this turmoil economy. If so, great to you. I've heard its slow...and it will get slower in the next couple of months...unless something drastic is going to happen.

I didn't say it was great move...all I'm saying to give a bit of a break to some that would like the camera...that's all.

 

[Meryem Ersoz]

I didn't say it was great move...all I'm saying to give a bit of a break to some that would like the camera...that's all.

And I would like to trade up my Prius for a Tesla.

Look, you're likely to get your wish in the secondary market, so I don't know why you're even bothering to ask for something that makes no sense in a market where camera sales are 40-50% below what was considered normal. A couple grand is not likely to attract many new buyers to this market, and the secondary market is already supporting value prices on this camera. And those cameras are still eligible for the EPIC-X upgrade....

 

[Steve Sherrick]

Of course, I know that new owners would be spending like 30-50k but its for the budget minded filmmakers that can have the camera like under 20k to shoot great images with say Nikon or Canon lenses, etc.

This is really not reality. When you have some experience with the camera you will know that even with Nikon or Canon Glass the investment is over $20K. I've broken this down before, but here goes again.

Camera - $18,000 (CF Module included)
Power - $1,450
Nikon Mount - $500
Base Production Pack - $1,250
Red Drive - $900
Lens from ebay - $60
LCD - $1,700

Okay, now you can turn the camera on and record images. Hopefully you already have a bunch of other accessories or have a rental company close by.

The camera wasn't built to make money if that was the case I would imagine Jim would charge 75k and still make a profit. He wanted to give filmmakers a chance and develop a camera that would surpass 35mm within an independent filmmaker in mind.

With all due respect, Jim is a businessman and as much as he loves what they have done with bringing Red to the independent filmmaker, it needs to run like a business. What they are not is a company that wants to bleed every last dime from you. But if they don't make some profit, they won't be around, just like any company. If that wasn't true, then Jim would just throw all the money at it and cameras would roll out even faster. But that would not be a smart business decision. Let's all try to live in reality.

Yes, they did give $2,500 credit toward their purchase. I don't remember if it was only for accessories...its been so long. I was merely suggesting a offer during these hard times to come closer to attaining a R1 and making your films, commercials or just renting the camera to make money. Fine and dandy...but I think you are missing the point here.

They are not obligated to change their pricing. This offer of $2500 was given to those who took a chance when they were merely a startup hoping to get off the ground with a really cool technology. The economic downturn or people's personal economic downturn is not their responsibility. However, Jim does seem to care and hence he has made some additional generous offers for the upgrades to the new cameras. So they are listening. But you have to be practical with your suggestions.

I don't know how the demand should be going up since people are losing their jobs and work is very tight. Companies are dropping their advertising budgets. You think you would be making more money in this turmoil economy. If so, great to you. I've heard its slow...and it will get slower in the next couple of months...unless something drastic is going to happen.

I agree with others. This economic trouble may actually have people look closer at Red. You can be shooting Red for less than Varicams, HPX3000s, Sony 900s, etc.

I didn't say it was great move...all I'm saying to give a bit of a break to some that would like the camera...that's all.

I understand that we'd all like a break in tough times, and I suppose it's worth asking the question, but it just comes off like you are asking them to drop the price so you can afford it. That does work with some things, especially in tough times, often prices are negotiable. But it doesn't make sense to me in this case. I agree that your best bet is the used market where people may need to unload a Red for $15,000 or somewhere around there just to recoup some losses. But I don't expecta big drop in the new camera price.

And I don't want to come off harsh either because that's not my nature, so please understand I'm only offering opinions based on my experience with the camera and the market. I'm not trying to steer you away from getting a camera. And I also don't want to speak for Red. It's just my .02.

 

[Charles Nader]

Heads are spinning...!!!!

Heads are spinning...!!!!

boy, all of you are pretty offended by my remarks or suggestions...that's all it is. I don't need a camera. All I was suggesting that during this hard times...they are hard, correct? I want to make sure all you all know that. I mean I didn't get one response from users here that the economy is booming for themselves and I think its great!?! Cause I would love to here from them.

I didn't suggest that comparing other cameras were cheaper or better or more expensive. I was merely stated a suggestion, but it seems it was a stupid one that most thought it was by their opinions and remarks.

Furthermore, I never suggested that they should or do??? Again, I was just suggesting with this economy that possible they would maybe consider lowering the price. I guess you know more of Jim then I do...here. That's fine.

In the reality...comment...I'm confused? I don't know why you, Steve would say that...because I clearly do know what is reality. When times are tough...prices do tend to go down. Look around you...stores are offering 50 -75% off. Why, they are struggling to survive. Again, I'm not say RED is struggling nor going broke...but you all don't know what's going on inside RED. So, truly you don't know...so I don't know why so many of you are responding in so.

Tough crowd...just a suggestion...not more nor less. Take as you will. Some of you are a bit steamed...you would be more steamed I'm guess if Jim would lower the price...you would all blow your lid. Ouch...