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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Dragon - Initial Reaction After Taken Delivery

and in the 5K and/or 6K delivery - We are indeed providing delivery in those resolutions for digital signage - on matrix'd panel projects (several clients would like larger resolution options as they would like a 1:1 pixel to more panels and larger displays). SO - even though many only see the need (or lack of) of 4K - due to 4K panels and projectors - there is a market and need for originals and deliverables above 4K.
 
Clark Dunbar said:
and in the 5K and/or 6K delivery - We are indeed providing delivery in those resolutions for digital signage - on matrix'd panel projects (several clients would like larger resolution options as they would like a 1:1 pixel to more panels and larger displays). SO - even though many only see the need (or lack of) of 4K - due to 4K panels and projects - there is a market and need for originals and deliverables above 4K.
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For digital signage 6k isn't enough. With another Dragon owner, we recently shot with our two Dragons side by side and the client stitched them together in post to create 8k - 10k files to be shown on a bank of LCD monitors.
 
One of the first big jobs our Dragon was used for was targeting 8K width for special projection. Some corporate clients are specifying 4K now, unprompted... good times :)
 
F65 is 8192 x 2160 according to Sony's special way of counting.

Dragon counted that way would be 12288 x 1580 - neither sensor is that shape of course, but nonetheless some straightforward maths shows us that Red 6k has more pixels than Sony 8k
 
I agree that with reference to noise it is only fair to compare mx to dragon at a frame size not 1 to 1... After all many of us prefer to shoot frame sizes not pixels... (For example s35 etc)

That said the same is true for frame rates. Dragon need a very slight frame rate bump to match the epic mx.... At any given imaging size the dragon is currently a few percent slower re frame rate. Come on Red give us a 10% bump;-)

Thanks M
 
Michael Lindsay said:
I agree that with reference to noise it is only fair to compare mx to dragon at a frame size not 1 to 1... After all many of us prefer to shoot frame sizes not pixels... (For example s35 etc)

That said the same is true for frame rates. Dragon need a very slight frame rate bump to match the epic mx.... At any given imaging size the dragon is currently a few percent slower re frame rate. Come on Red give us a 10% bump;-)

Thanks M
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Yep, I'm psyched to be sending my Epic in for the upgrade on Monday...but I am REALLY going to miss not having 96fps at the same sensor size as the MX...that is the only part that feels like a downgrade.

-dane
 
Having a similar story with our upgrade path to yours and having shot with our Dragon recently, I saw right away what our upgrade money got us, Dragon Color. With our film, I was comfortable with the image we exposed and lighted, color correction was not necessary, not a concern, the image was love, it was beautiful. Out of the gate, the image looks beautiful for skin tones, I never felt the desire to click the sliders. It's a powerful tool and it's been a hell of a ride, it changes lives. This camera is good enough, so far. Time to shoot your movie.

Hans von Sonntag said:
Colour is the best part of Dragon.
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Clark Dunbar said:
agree - the signage industry is going LARGE!
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If RED would ever deliver that EPIC-645 of the 617 cameras that were announced a few years back… ;)

I pretty much only do corporate work and *ALL* my clients are 4K now. Some going higher for signage and multi-screen work. Logistics of image capture hold a lot of that back. Kinda like 3D, production logistics hold some back, but more so that is on the delivery end. A lot of these big corporate types would love 3D, if they could do it to large monitors and into public spaces without the need for glasses and from any arbitrary viewing position.

Don't get me started on Sony "6K" and "8K"...
 
Stephen Franchek said:
So, I know this has been beaten to death, but the comparable noise btwn Dragon and MX bothers me.
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Stephen, don't let you get bothered by noise. Any sensor exhibits noise, film does. It's the natural border of exposure and we have to deal with it. I can assure you that there is no camera for motions picture available with comparable DR and colour depth that is more sensitive to light than the Dragon sensor, or to put it differently less prone to noise. Neither is Kodak, nor is Alexa better in this regard. You may find in the DSLR realm cameras that are more light sensitive but they are in no means comparable to RED, Arri, your name it.

Currently physics are the obstacle for sensors that can deliver 6K resolution, carry 16 stops DR and should have a noise-free sensitivity of ISO 2000+.

In doubt, do what we all do and light the scene - at least for mood reasons.

Stephen Franchek said:
Jannard said, in no vague terms, that this camera would be as clean at ISO 2000 as the MX is at ISO 800.
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You are coming for NY, I'm German (even worse), haha!. Take it as a Californian classic. The people there have this unbeatable optimism I really love. MX was never clean at ISO 800 and neither is Dragon at ISO 2000. But It all depends on the environment you are shooting in. If it ist a dark lit but otherwise bright coloured scene you may get away with ISO 2000. In a low key scene with most of the part of the picture covered with dark colours noise is the boss, always has been.

Regards,

Hans
 
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