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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Dragon / Epic / Scarlet Camera Beta Build 5.1.23

Yeah this whole idea that RED should prevent individual clip deletion because people would accidentally use it is a bit ridiculous. We better also disable every other function on the camera since people might misuse them and complain it's not their fault. RED is not a simple camera to use, and neither are most professional cameras, but that complexity is outweighed by increased functionality. Also I don't really see what the big deal is about being afraid of delete functions, it's not a secure delete so even if you delete a clip you most likely could just recover the file until it gets overwritten, so it seems to me accidental delete function usage isn't a big deal. By the same logic RED should remove the option to format MAGs in camera since that would lighten their load of support tickets resulting from accidental formatting. I thought if ever there was a company that made products that valued functionality over simplicity, it's RED, so why not just stick to that? Crippling functionality in favor of ease and safety is a bit out of character :P

And aren't these DSMC cameras? Have you ever seen a digital still camera that didn't let you delete photos from the memory card? Then again there aren't many other digital still cameras that can't shoot a single still frame at a time but can shoot 72fps...
 
I too rather have the option to delete individual files. It's easy enough to probably create a "lock option" if you prefer NOT wanting the camera to erase files. Now if there is a reason like it damages or drains the life of a card quicker, then I can understand.

If there is a lot involved in rewriting the software based on how the files are recorded onto the card (since it might be hard to recognize what space is erased and not hurt the stuff that isn't), I can understand the delay offering (but still want the feature).

There should be no reason why you cannot. Perhaps even an 'undo' option to undo erasing the last clip (prior to recording new footage). There can be a few warning windows prior to erasing. Maybe even record on other empty space first and leave the newly erased space last to record. I don't know the logistics. Merely stating how it can be improved.

Like all other camera manufacturers that offers this option...including a iPhone, it is Red that's not in touch with what the consumer wants (in this feature). Unless there is a reason, the reason not to have is weak...especially in this digital age. Whether it be a DIT or a director, we trust them not to drop the card. Should we not trust them to erase the right footage? We are after all professionals... or at least competent. Like dropping the card, accidents happen. Not being able to erase footage is like a card that cannot come out (for fear of dropping) and require a usb to connect to the camera for access. My analogy but you get the idea.

Not a deal breaker feature but definitely not one that shouldn't exist either.
 
Again, Last clip delete only would be nice, easy and secure.
With a safety to delete last clip only once, so it would not be possible to click on it ten times in a row.
Also, it should not be keymappable, and accessible only in the playback menu to be perfectly secure.

The reel number should be minused while doing it.
 
While I don't typically delete files from cards while I'm working I will occasionally remove last shots if something obvious has gone wrong. This is specially true when on location with limited remaining resources. I agree that last clip delete would be a nice feature to have.

Bill
 
There's soooo much to love in this build. …nice going RED!!!
 
Just some humble suggestions to how it could possibly implemented.

1) Different firmware. Every release has 2 firmwares, the only differences is that one has a delete feature and the others does not. This means all the blockbusters and rental houses can use the one without the delete feature and all of us documentary filmers etc can have delete. I have been photographing all over the world and I often go through and delete material on site in my camera. Not a single time have I deleted a photo that I meant to keep.

2) Password protected Delete Feature. What we want to accomplish here is that the DOP/Director can easily make sure that the cameras have the delete feature disabled on the camera. It must also be easy to change the password so that the operators simply do not know the password. It should only be the DOP or similar that knows the password on all the cameras and not the operators.
- Delete Setup Meny
-- Set Password. You type in the old password and then you can set a new one.
-- Disable Delete. No password required. This is what the DOP would do on the cameras if needed.
-- Enable Delete. It asks you if you want to reuse the password or create a new one. This is what the camera owner would do at home. On a shot he will not know the password.

In the thumbnail view there is now a Delete button. If you press it while viewing an image you need to retype the password. If this is done then the file is deleted. You can also mark for delete.

In the interface were you are shooting there is an Icon that shows that the Delete Feature is enabled. This makes it easy for a DOP to verify that all cameras are "secure". If any camera has the delete icon then the DOP goes into the meny and disables Delete.

A system similar to this would be very secure.

You say that some people format by mistake (and blame Red which is just nuts). I actually think the format meny feels a bit risky and could be made more secure. One way is for example adding icons to the buttons, now it just says Ok/Cancel or something like it with text in the same colors. Icons with strong colours will help. For example a big strong X on Format and a Green Cancel button. I think maybe even a third prompt may be in order (Confirm delete of all media). I once pressed Format by mistake when I really only meant to press "go back" because I was clicking to fast.

Its not so fun to read so many posts saying "this will be very bad on a big movie shot etc". Well isn't the camera meant to be a bit more flexible than that. Is it only the masters like Peter Jackson and his colleagues that we should tune the workflow to. Yes I understand if they are the focus and get cameras first but the Red Epic is such a flexible camera that others workflow should be kept in mind. If you are hiking deep into the jungle or up into the Artic I assure you that its nice to be able to delete those 100GB of "nothing happens" on your shot, especially when its to wet or cold to offload the material to your laptop. There are several types of shots that I simply do not do because I know that they will take too much space on the drive. For example filming animals for 30 minutes in a row just to get a very long sequence of activities. I also often avoid HDRx even though I really like it. If it was easier to delete I could run multiple cameras filming for a longer time, then I can go and verify that they have something. If they don't then I just delete it. Its not really realistic to work like this when you can't delete, because I may be in the mountains. Offloading to a laptop is not possible usually in the mountains because the big fast RAID drives I'm using requires external power so I need to go to base camp. This only leaves 2.5" hdd that are slow and will take up to 2-3 hours to copy a 512GB to. I can't usually wait 3 hours for 1 clip to offload. Ok, maybe bringing many laptops, yes, but now its getting heavy. Of course if we had 4x512GB for each camera this would be less of a problem but I would rather buy another Epic to use instead of spending our finances on the media.
So as you can see in this scenario we are actually dropping our quality and compromising our workflow because we don't have the delete feature. Its never fun when you have to drop your quality because of yourself "being protected from yourself". Personally I really like testing, testing in the field and letting the camera roll to capture unexpected actions.

Well, I hope this post explains a bit why people like me would use it, and hopefully illustrate a more safe way of protecting the big studios. :)
/Andreas
 
Trent, I was recently wondering why the REDMAG use is only shown in percentage. Or am I missing something?

It would be very helpful to show the remaining recording time for the current settings. Even if it's a minute or so give or take this would surely make a lot of things easier. Something like h'm" instead of xxx%

Is this planned, not possible or already there and I'm just not seeing it?

Thanks for listening :)
 
Patrick Grossien said:
Trent, I was recently wondering why the REDMAG use is only shown in percentage. Or am I missing something?

It would be very helpful to show the remaining recording time for the current settings. Even if it's a minute or so give or take this would surely make a lot of things easier. Something like h'm" instead of xxx%

Is this planned, not possible or already there and I'm just not seeing it?

Thanks for listening :)
Click to expand...


Great idea!
 
Patrick Grossien said:
Trent, I was recently wondering why the REDMAG use is only shown in percentage. Or am I missing something?

It would be very helpful to show the remaining recording time for the current settings. Even if it's a minute or so give or take this would surely make a lot of things easier. Something like h'm" instead of xxx%

Is this planned, not possible or already there and I'm just not seeing it?

Thanks for listening :)
Click to expand...

It is on our list of things to do.
 
what happen to DSMC Build v5.1.35 Firmware??? I went to down load it and its locked.
 
OK I'm good, I clicked on brain firmware and got nothing but when I clicked Epic firmware it came up. Thanks
 
Patrick Grossien said:
Trent, I was recently wondering why the REDMAG use is only shown in percentage. Or am I missing something?

It would be very helpful to show the remaining recording time for the current settings. Even if it's a minute or so give or take this would surely make a lot of things easier. Something like h'm" instead of xxx%

Is this planned, not possible or already there and I'm just not seeing it?

Thanks for listening :)
Click to expand...

Good suggestion Patrick...


Trent Lillehaugen said:
It is on our list of things to do.
Click to expand...

And this is how RED operates... And btw, it's a feature we'll all endue finding extremely usefull... ;)
 
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