Does Camera Brand Matter to Distributors for Theatrical Release?

[Jose Mojica]

Hello, we are shooting our first feature this year, and even though we know it's going to be difficult to get theatrical distribution, we're doing everything we can to increase our chances...

As we are comparing different camera packages for features, image quality, workflow, etc. a question came up: Does the brand of the camera you used to shoot your movie matter to distributors, or do they only care about the final product?

These days someone can shoot a feature with an iPhone. We'd prefer to shoot ours on a RED Scarlet-W of course, but we all know how long that line is... So what about other cameras: KineMax 6K, Canon C300 Mark II, Varicam LT?
You hope people will see your film before making a decision, but can your movie be dismissed because you chose to shoot it on a KineMax at 6K vs. a RED or Arri? And along the same lines, does it matter in their eyes which RED camera you used?

I tell you, I never thought much of camera brands before doing a feature movie. We always chose based on specs, workflow, etc. But I am finding as we are casting that actors associate some brand names with you knowing what you're doing, specially if you are not well known yet. So when they ask, "what camera are you using?" and you say RED, you can see in their eyes that they're thinking, "Oh, this is a real movie!" I was wondering if it's the same with distributors.

Thanks,
--Jose

 

[Fabricio Morato]

Short answer no it doesn't matter.
Long answer: firstly you should be in talks with a distributor before you start principal photography. I know it's not always easy and sometimes quite frankly frustrating but it's the way this works. The distributor is the one paying for the p&a and sometimes they like to have a saying on the story. You might not agree but they have way more experience at how market a movie, and knows what people might like or dislike in a story.
Second, once they agree to take on your project (this before the shooting begins) they won't be telling you what gear to use, though they might have a few requirements (like Netflix and Amazon 4k minimum), but other than things like these would be rare they tell you to shoot with camera X.
Now even indie movies get in talk with distributors before shooting, maybe someone from China is willing to put money on your script if the main character is played by the actor from one particular tv show (because he sells in Asia), of you had your movie done and it's with another actor then you won't be seeing this distributor money's.
Now getting back to topic (sorry hehe) story is always king. If you have a good one and it was shot by a good dp, cc by a good colorist, had good production design, god actors etc etc it won't matter the camera you shot with. Obviously if you have a great script (Oscar nominee level) and you call your buddies and family to play everyone and shoot with your phone with no lighting then it would probably never sell as is (it could sell to the studio so they could make a remake).
So if you're doing everything right with the movie (good actors, cre, lighting etc) all the cameras you mention would create some excellent images. Dont be attached so much on the gear, if you can afford high-end by all means go with it, but if on a limited budget choose wisely. Sometimes it's better to invest in other areas of your movie.
Hope this helps and sorry for any potential misspellings (I'm typing on a phone and it's stuttering hehe) and good luck with your film!

 

[Jose Mojica]

Thanks for the information, Fabricio. That's very useful.

 

[Marc Wielage]

A +1 to all of Fabricio's advice -- that makes a great deal of sense.

What might be the most important thing for any indie filmmaker is get feedback from the distributors before you shoot your film, so you have a sense if your film will be commercial enough for them to buy it. Maybe the most important question to ask is, "who wants to see this film?", and I think often not enough indie filmmakers think about this before they shoot their dream project.

 

[Christoffer Glans]

Nope, it's a choice for the production company/producers/director. The only thing they might want is that it has a specific resolution or a certain "bar of quality", but most cameras can deliver on that so it's more of a creative choice really. Only times I've seen certain cameras being barred from the distributor is Netflix and Alexa, but it has to do with the resolution, so whenever Alexa gets a 6K s35mm camera there will be more Netflix productions with them.

 

[David Peterson]

I see you mention the Kinefinity Terra 6K, but also keep an eye out for reviews of the Terra 5K when it ships. Because 5K is already plenty of resolution, but not only is it cheaper than the Terra 6K, but it also has a global shutter! Which will resolve the most significant downside to the 6K sensor.

 

[Jose Mojica]

I see you mention the Kinefinity Terra 6K, but also keep an eye out for reviews of the Terra 5K when it ships. Because 5K is already plenty of resolution, but not only is it cheaper than the Terra 6K, but it also has a global shutter! Which will resolve the most significant downside to the 6K sensor.

It's funny, we've been ranking all of the cameras in our price range, looking at image quality, dynamic range, max resolution, ease of workflow, and finally cost, and the winner was Scarlet-W followed by Raven, followed by Terra 5K and then Terra 6K.(None of which are available to us yet.) The first camera on our list that's available is the KineMax 6K, then the Canon C300 Mark II.

 

[Eric M Hurt]

The last person I'd trust to give me advice is a distributor. First off, the camera system doesn't really matter, as long as it works for the film you're shooting then you're good to go. If this is your first feature it's unlikely that you have connections with many distributors, and even less likely any established ones. If you do have some connections, that's great, but listening to what they say is the fastest way to crush creativity. They will only be looking out for what they want, not any vision you have. Their job is to make money, for them. They are aware of the kinds of movies that make money, so most would push you in that direction. Smaller distributors go bankrupt all the time, and if you're making a small indie film those are the distributors that will be willing to speak to you. Remember that these people are not creative, that's why they are in distribution. Distributors are lower than used car salesmen, the only people lower than distributors are sales agents. Don't trust a thing they say, watch your back and never sign a boilerplate contract.

 

[Christopher Mills]

Nope, but you have a tougher situation to face.

Nope, but you have a tougher situation to face.

No, they do not care. What they want is the cheapest film with the best cast you can get. They may have a category of script in mind, but most of them don't actually have the ability to tell if you have a good or bad script. Actors and their agents largely do, will swiftly tell you if you got that part right.

They will ask you your budget point. If they are not paying the bill, NEVER tell them. Ask them what they feel the presales for your project are. They will base this on genre and cast content. If you don't have known cast, don't bother to contact distributors, because none of them will care about your movie. It just can't be monetized for a new film maker without a known cast.

Use the best gear you are competent to use, and rent rent rent! Do not be learning how to use your camera on your for profit feature.
This may still be the same package that you are considering purchasing.

The price of owning a camera package will go so much further in rental than in ownership, and may save you enough to buy a week or two of a well known actor to appear in your film.

Back to the suggestion of asking a distributor about cast, that is valid, but make sure that you can actually turn a profit on booking that cast member.

Best of luck.

I am speaking from development through distribution producing experience.

 

[Terry VerHaar]

Wouldn't it be great if it were that easy! They specify the camera, you shoot with it, they distribute your film!! LOL

;-)

 

[Jose Mojica]

If this is your first feature it's unlikely that you have connections with many distributors, and even less likely any established ones.

You are right, we have zero connections .

I'm thinking because it is our fist feature it's also unlikely distributors will talk to us yet. Our plan was to shoot our movie first (all self-funded), see if we could get it into some film festivals, and then see if we could connect with a distributor at one of those festivals. If that didn't work, we were going to try Tugg and see if we could get some reviews and generate some buzz. And if distribution attempts failed, then we'd try Vimeo on-demand. (I get the feeling that is everyone's plan and that it doesn't work often.)

We are not shooting until April next year, so we're trying to do what we can to maximize our chances for distribution. I wanted to make sure we didn't do something that would disqualify us, like choosing a camera no one's heard of, but I'm glad that that doesn't matter because we want to choose the camera that's best for our movie. Of course, it will be a RED , but only if we can get a Scarlet-W by the end of the year. The backup may be Terra 5K or KineMax 6K.

 

[Aaron michaels]

You are on the right path to me. Don't burn a lot of money trying to sell your first feature. you are going to make mistakes, changes etc. See if people like what you have done then go from there.All of this pay a DP and get a well known actor cost big bucks and it will only grease their pockets. They get paid and can care less about your movie. Some distributors want the movie when you call them, when you have nothing it could kill there interest in what you have. Talking and no product could be a waste of time.

 

[Daniel Stilling]

April next year? Order a Scarlet-W. Forget film festivals. They are only good for one's ego as you always get a lot of compliments. The festivals that matter (Sundance, Tribeca, Toronto et all) are really a misnomer. They are buzz platforms for studio movies. The Martian Premiered at Toronto. They get thousands upon thousands of submissions and don't have anywhere near enough staff hours to watch all the movies. Do everything you can to get into film markets. Several out there. Be proactive. Contact distributors.

 

[David W. Jones]

We are not shooting until April next year, so we're trying to do what we can to maximize our chances for distribution. I wanted to make sure we didn't do something that would disqualify us, like choosing a camera no one's heard of, but I'm glad that that doesn't matter because we want to choose the camera that's best for our movie. Of course, it will be a RED , but only if we can get a Scarlet-W by the end of the year. The backup may be Terra 5K or KineMax 6K.

For heavens sake, forget about purchasing a Scarlet, or any other camera by the end of the year, and concentrate on preproduction and everything else that is truly going to make a difference with your film. You can rent any camera package and lens kit ever made when you are actually ready to shoot your film.

Good Luck!

Dave

 

[Carey Lee Coffey]

No.

 

[Sabyasachi Patra]

For heavens sake, forget about purchasing a Scarlet, or any other camera by the end of the year, and concentrate on preproduction and everything else that is truly going to make a difference with your film. You can rent any camera package and lens kit ever made when you are actually ready to shoot your film.

Good Luck!

Dave

Completely agree. You have other things to worry about than camera package. Ofcourse in a gear forum people are likely to worry about equipment more. However, you have other priorities. Since this is your first feature and distribution is uncertain, it is better to plan for the lowest cost possible. Keep on chopping your budget to remove the unnecessary things.

In one low budget film, the DP protested that he can't work without a walkie to call his assistants. In no time he was fired. Certain things may be necessary in big productions but not in small ones. Small films are like guerrilla warfare. Junk the non-value added processes of the big-budget film projects.

The other day we were discussing this topic and the director just said he will hire an Alexa for one day and shoot the rest with a C300. When I asked why, he said that he will tell people that he shot in an alexa and other cameras. By hiring an Alexa for one day, he can talk about using such big cameras without being accused of lying. The C300 and alexa will match seamlessly and no one will know. He said he just wants to make the film and was just tick marking all the probable questions.

 

[Mark K.]

You are on the right path to me. Don't burn a lot of money trying to sell your first feature. you are going to make mistakes, changes etc. See if people like what you have done then go from there.All of this pay a DP and get a well known actor cost big bucks and it will only grease their pockets. They get paid and can care less about your movie. Some distributors want the movie when you call them, when you have nothing it could kill there interest in what you have. Talking and no product could be a waste of time.

Huh?

A well known actor and an experienced DP are two of the single most useful people you can bring in on a small first film (if you genuinely want to sell it), the actor will give you legitimacy and a strong performance, the DP will give you a film that looks professional enough to actually be sold.

Oh, you'll also really want a talented on-set stills photographer, without one, you'll have no decent material with which to actually market your film when it's done.

 

[Jose Mojica]

The other day we were discussing this topic and the director just said he will hire an Alexa for one day and shoot the rest with a C300. When I asked why, he said that he will tell people that he shot in an alexa and other cameras. By hiring an Alexa for one day, he can talk about using such big cameras without being accused of lying. The C300 and alexa will match seamlessly and no one will know. He said he just wants to make the film and was just tick marking all the probable questions.

Wow, I wonder how often that happens with smaller cameras, people getting a bigger camera for a short time to be able to say they shot with the bigger camera for marketing purposes.

 

[Chris Henze]

My 2 cents. Make a good movie and nobody will care about the gear. My buddy has a film he shot on the first iPhone exhibited in the Guggenheim museum.

 

[Jose Mojica]

This is an awesome forum, lots of great information. Thank you.

Just to clarify...We probably use our camera differently than other productions. Once we select the camera that helps us tell the story best, we buy it, because we literarily use it evey day until production. Every shot is crafted and practiced. We work on workflow. We change the practical lighting on the set to help the camera, etc. By the time we shoot, we can move very quickly. It just makes more sense financially to buy it. But because of all the preparation, we need to get it as quickly as possible, which is why it's hard to wait, and why we've been looking for backup options.

We are a small team, but we have one person dedicated to figuring out theatretical distribution. That's new to us. And so when we were discussing which camera was best for our story the question of distribution came up. Does it matter to anyone else what we shot the movie on? I had read it mattered for NetFlix for their own productions, and it seems to matter to actors for some reason, but I wondered if it mattered to distributors or not. The consensus here appears to be "No," which is great for us.