Doc Package Recommendations with RED

[BrendanLeahy]

I'm off to shoot an arts festival documentary (mostly b-roll with a couple of interviews) on a small, relatively remote island coming up soon.I was wondering what people who have shot docs on RED typically suggest bringing as a basic/bare-minimum package in terms of power and media to last me through a 14-hour day? I'm trying to stay lightweight for the most part - currently have four REDvolts, two 95w v-mounts, and a couple of chargers. There should be power that I can tap into for charging.

 

[Steve Sherrick]

Will you need to move back and forth between tripod and handheld quickly? If so, I would recommend a system that allows you to do that. I use the Sony VCT mounting system and I really like it for that purpose.

Will you have time to charge batteries? I know you said you'll have access to power, but time is actually the biggest question. If not, I recommend bringing a few more than you think you'll need.

For media, if you think you'll be shooting non-stop throughout the 14 hour day and you won't have time to do backups, you'll need to bring an appropriate amount of media cards. My guess is you'll shoot 4-6 hours worth of footage. So, plan for 8 hours so you don't run out.

I would focus on ergonomics in terms of getting the package light. If you'll be doing lots of handheld, make sure the system is comfortable and balanced. 14 hours of shooting will wear you down regardless of how light the camera is. I would go for comfort and ease of operation. If you are doing this one man band style you'll need to make your life as easy as possible when it comes to moving the camera between support devices, handling sound, etc. I've done what you are doing but with a Red One. If I can survive that, I think you'll be fine with an Epic or Scarlet.

 

[Mark Phelan]

I've done what you are doing but with a Red One. If I can survive that, I think you'll be fine with an Epic or Scarlet.

That's because you're a member of the Brute Squad.

 

[Steve Sherrick]

That's because you're a member of the Brute Squad.

As long as that doesn't require working out and being in shape, then yes.

My son on the other hand will probably lug a fully loaded Red One on an Oconnor 2060 up a mountain and get some amazing shots some day. He already tries to carry my big Pelican cases around and he's only 3.

 

[Patrick Tresch]

I usually use 2 Pelican cases 1550 (for flight purpose) with an Epic on Nikon mount. 3x 256GB SSD (1TB could be better for a big day). 1TB Shooting on Dragon 6k 2:1 @ compression 14:1 1TB is 4 hours rushes. Good shoulder rig that you can go from tripod (sony VTC) to handheld is the Zacuto recoil (with added rosette & handles). I digged 2 holes in the shoulder rig to screw the Epic V-lock plate.

I usually use 3 160wh batteries for 1 big day but allways carry 4 with me.
4 way charger
1 MBPr with USB3 Hard Drives and an USB3 SSD reader to backup (gets me 40' to download 1 card of 240GB), I can backup 1 card of 240 to 2 USB3 Drives without power on the MBPr battery.
Drag and drop from the original for every copy. Control bites number for each copy.
Try to get the downloads going during shooting if you can. 2X1TB of backup/day is a lot of work after shooting.

For light weight purpose, I use "simple" lenses like the Rokinon. No follow focus but sticks on the lens to make the focus.
Screwon filters (ND9,12,18) Allways on my belt (I don't use Vari as I don't like them to turn without warning ;-) ) Other in backup (6,1.5) Pola
Screwon Sunhood http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/858897-REG/Kaiser_206827_77_mm_3_in_1_Rubber.html
I use the grid viewfinder on the 5'' Touch screen
no side handle
Paralinx arrow for the director's 5'6 inch monitor (that has a Vlock power)
TC and sound cables
Good 100mm head (I use a Panther X15)
Lightweight legs (I use carbon fiber Miller solo eng3)

My Epic setup is about 9kg. Well balanced you can handle it a day (or a month) without problem.

Pat

 

[ErnestoDeCarvalho]

Great discussion.


I am about to go shoot a long documentary for a month in a remote area also, and I'm prepping gear. One challenge is that I intend to do a lot of handheld. I am perfectly confident that using a Red DSMC camera for this is fine. I’m using a Scarlet Dragon with an Action Products shoulder mount connected to Red Quickrelease via dovetail. I'm putting the camera as far back on the shoulder as I can, so I can use a v-mount attached directly to the camera, as I feel that’s better for moving around. Then using a Wooden Camera EVF mount to get an EVF well placed forward. I agree that minimum amount of big 160wh batteries for a full day is 3, and 4 is best. Some 4 redvolts for swapping moments are important.


Amount of media also depends on resolution. One big concern for making a rig like this work for a documentary is lensing, and how it relates to resolution. After thinking a lot about it, and experimenting, I decided to go with an Arri Zeiss 12-120 (converted) Super-16 lens, and shot @3k with it. Mostly because this film has a direct cinema approach but also because I think it’s a perfect. Some people will think it's a waste of the camera sensor etc. I think it’s great. I've shot a couple of projects using 3k with super-16 glass (super speeds etc) and I’m in love with that combination, especially for documentary with a lot of footage and simple image-post-production involved. Producing 5k of direct documentary footage is very heavy. And it’s hard to find a robust lens that covers the range that Super-16 lenses like that cover. If you’re in an intense running around situation, having a lens that you zoom properly (with a zoom stick and not a flimsy still lens rubber barrel) is a world of difference. 4x4 Matte for filters. Sometimes clamped-on. Filters on a belt-pouch, redmags also, big batteries on my parter's backpack. And there we go.

 

[Demetri Zuev]

Battery belt clip is a must for doc situations with Epic. I wouldn't bother with 95W batts. Get something like Redbricks and throw them in your backpack with the belt clip, running power via cable.

 

[Joe Kyle]

Battery belt clip is a must for doc situations with Epic. I wouldn't bother with 95W batts. Get something like Redbricks and throw them in your backpack with the belt clip, running power via cable.

This is what I'm doing - I have a three day + night shoot in the Rockies and I have to carry all of my equipment. Getting the battery off the camera is a critical piece of the puzzle. I'm not even going to use a side handle - I'm just mounting a small off-the-shelf hand strap to the side of the brain and I intend to basically just palm the thing. I'll see if I can post some photos of the setup on Monday.

 

[Stacey Spears]

Pat, nice detailed list, thank you for sharing.

 

[Alex Doctor]

On a packing note: I do heaps of corporate one man banding, travel Australasia extensively. Last year was 180 flights. I can fit my entire red package into the crumpler extravaganza bag. It looks like an oversized laptop bag and never draws attention so it's always carry on.
Everything to do with the red including batteries, chargers, mounting options as well as a laptop and a few lenses. This way if everything else goes missing I can still shoot.
I then have a larger suitcase which I breakdown my extras and pad out with clothes. that's normally at the 23kg limit, I use the crumpler red wine no 10 (no I don't work for them, just an awesome Aussie brand with lifetime warranty). In there goes lights, mono pod, leads, light stands, slider etc...
and then the tripod as an extra bag. Other than the tripod no one would have clue that I'm shooting anything. Low profile while travelling is always a bonus.

 

[Patrick Tresch]

Ï don't understand the run and gun thing when speaking about documentary. I think it's vital to be lightweight but it's where you put your camera or where you stand that is important. I'm mainly shooting with the 35mm the handheld stuff and never use a zoom for "flexibility" reasons. The 24, 50 and 85 sometimes gets on the cam for interviews or special shots. The 35mm gets me in the right distance or proximity to the people I film.

Pat

 

[Ted Parkes]

By the rules all of your Lithium batteries have to be carry-on. I travel often and my bag has my Camera with side handle and 5" touch, 4XSSD (in a red SSD case) 4 X 140wh batteries and 2 Contax Zeiss lenses. So again if all other bags are lost I can still start shooting. But it is very over weight for carry-on. When they do flag me I simply explain the contents, most of the weight are the batteries and they can't be checked. I have always been allowed to continue. But I can see the day when they take things to the next level and I will have to change my set up. My advice is to make sure the bag at least conforms to the carry-on size restrictions. One less battle to face. Issue there is carry-on sizes are different for airlines around the world.

 

[Patrick Tresch]

It depends the company. If it has ATR planes the 1550 are a no go but they are unusual planes. Usually if you can carry the carry on bag yourself the company don't say much. Mine are about 15-17kg each! ;-)
I usually ask the AD to help me carrying the case through the embarking gate.

Batteries between 100wh and 160wh are allowed 2 per person. So if you take 4 of them make sure you travel with someone. So they can't bother you.

Pat

Ps: and I use the FanPlate to cool the camera down and have a quiet shoot ;-)

 

[Joe Kyle]

Thanks all for your contributions. It sounds like a few of you are solo-shooting as well, so I must ask - what do you sacrifice bringing? I know I usually have a minimum of one 20kg bag of just gear, then a tripod, bag of clothes, and some tent/sleeping bag stuff. It's typically been a pain to haul 3-4 bags solo.

Also, how do most of you justify using a Red package over a Canon C-series with an Atmos for your style of doc work? (Have to play devil's advocate here.)

I don't really sacrifice much (at least I don't think I do). I pretty much just load up and deal with it. My hiking/camping/climbing equipment is all ultra-light, and I don't take much of that. Basically one set of clothes, tent, food, etc...just bare necessities. Then I load up with film equipment until I tip over, and then take one piece off.

I thought about using a 1DC or an A7s + Shogun combo for my entire shoot, but it was only a momentary flirtation. If I'm going to haul a whole bunch of heavy equipment into the boonies, I want it to be worth it. I want 6K, I want it at 70+fps, I want compression options, I want raw. I'm spoiled.

I'm spending this week prepping, and my kit is still not finalized but at this point I'm looking at 5 anton bauer HCs and 4x 512GB mini mags for power and storage. I have to make that last for two full days, plus a little on a third day. And that includes some quick pop-up interviews. I just have to be very, very disciplined about what I'm doing, when I'm powering on the camera, etc.

Right now I'm trying to make a little handheld rig work...the one I attached is currently at 9lbs 7oz, and it's not too bad ergonomically speaking. The IS on the 16-35 will really help. Battery belt clip for power. I may change my tune as the week goes on...I have some shoots I'll be test driving it on to see how workable it is.

 

[Adrian Weinbrecht]

Hi Joe

I'm interested in the mic setup you're using, can you please explain/share the cables, mic choice and how you set the Reds Audio up for this? We normally use a Rode NTG3 for scratch but it's a heavy setup and draws more power from the camera.

Thank you

 

[Justen Nguyen]

Adrian, it's a DIY hack. Fairly simple and works on the Video Mic Pro series. Essentially if open it up and cut a white wire it will properly send signal that the Epic/Scarlets can read.

Here is the thread discussing it.
http://www.reduser.net/forum/showth...-RODE-VIDEO-MIC-PRO-working-with-Scarlet-Epic

 

[Joe Kyle]

Hi Joe

I'm interested in the mic setup you're using, can you please explain/share the cables, mic choice and how you set the Reds Audio up for this? We normally use a Rode NTG3 for scratch but it's a heavy setup and draws more power from the camera.

Thank you

Adrian, it's a DIY hack. Fairly simple and works on the Video Mic Pro series. Essentially if open it up and cut a white wire it will properly send signal that the Epic/Scarlets can read.

Here is the thread discussing it.
http://www.reduser.net/forum/showth...-RODE-VIDEO-MIC-PRO-working-with-Scarlet-Epic

Yep, that's the magic thread I wasn't so bold as to cut any wires, so I opted for a simple stereo-mono airplane adapter. It's definitely not as tidy as it could be with the extra wires, but I'll just tape them down.

 

[Mike Simpson]

i dont really see how you guys operate just palming the camera for so long. I cant shoot long verite handheld sequences without being able to support the camera on my shoulder.

Im doing a 3 weeks shoot out in the Philippines for a doc and this is the setup Ive been using. Im running 2 channels of audio into the camera so a bit of extra business mounted for that, but otherwise ive tried to get everything as light as possible while having a comfortable shoulder mounted camera. I can go all day with this setup pretty comfortably. In retrospect i should have probably picked up some carbon rods and lighter hand grips but otherwise no real complains with this setup.

I carry a few screw on NDs and pola, and a couple other lenses. I also have a touch screen that I swap with the evf depending on the situation (if i need to manage audio levels for example). Card wise I have 1TB of media split between 256 and 128gb cards and im a bit liberal with my resolution (generally 4k or 5k for sitdowns, 5k or 6k for verite scenes, 6k for more expressive or b-roll heavy sequences).

Managing audio levels as a single shooter is probably the difficult part of shooting doc with the red. I wish there was some sort of physical nobs i could access while shooting without having to be touching the touch screen.

 

[Trevor Meier]

Here's the setup I run with:

• Wooden Cam 15mm LW baseplate & EVF mount
• Manfrotto 394 baseplates on everything for quick swaps
• Zacuto handle & attachments
• Nato rail (no top plate), Red handle (reversed) and 5" touch LCD on top
• Audio shockmount on nato rail
• Sennheiser wireless velcroed to the smart side
• Side handle + Redvolt
• V-mount (90-Whr split travel batteries)

It's served me well almost unchanged over more than three years and a dozen countries. It's balanced and rugged.

My main gripe is the power usage of the whole system, along with the weight. I really, really wish Red made us indies a low-power (i.e. 5K / lower processing power needed) version of the lightweight Weapon body. That would really make my day. Solo-hauling the Epic + batteries up to Annapurna Base Camp nearly finished me.

 

[Trevor Meier]

When it comes to power: you'll need about 500-700WHr to run a decent day. So however you achieve that...

Similar for media: it all comes down to resolution & compression. I run 4-5K for interviews, 5-6K for visuals. After testing, 8:1 is my lowest acceptable compression (except in emergencies or when 1080 with no cropping is guaranteed to be all that's needed). I'll shoot 5:1 when I can or when in low light (helps the noise not to block up). That adds up to a lot of data. Heavy days can encroach on 1.5-2TB, so I'll manage my data rates according to the situation.