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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

David Fincher Social Network Adobe conform

I'd like to chime in here.
I'm also conforming and finishing in After Effects and what I would relly love and couldn't get done yet is that when I change my Cut in Premiere, that AE recognizes those changes but lets all the Effects in place and automaticly repositions keyframes, etc. so that I don't have to go through it again, if I made some changes to the Cut in PP what can get really time consuming.
Is that possible?
 
Kim Frank said:
I'd like to chime in here.
I'm also conforming and finishing in After Effects and what I would relly love and couldn't get done yet is that when I change my Cut in Premiere, that AE recognizes those changes but lets all the Effects in place and automaticly repositions keyframes, etc. so that I don't have to go through it again, if I made some changes to the Cut in PP what can get really time consuming.
Is that possible?
Click to expand...

That would be very tricky to do. Are you using dynamiclink or copy/paste/import to get your cuts into AE?

Cheers

Dave
 
That is really the only gripe that I have with the adobe workflow as well. I realize it is definitly something that is tricky, but it does limit me from bringing whole projects to finish in after effects any more. The biggest issue is that my clients want to see what everything is going to look like before they make changes. My workflow would go like this.
Make my edits in Premiere
Import project over to AE for individual clip effects and color correction.
Export from AE for client viewing.
Client decides the the current clip order ABCDE should be ACEBD and that clip E should be longer and clip B should be a different clip.

Now I'm stuck. i could make all the changes in AE, but that's just a tedious way to edit, and you always tend to miss something without having realtime playback of clips.

Now my workflow goes like this.
-Make original edit in Premiere.
-Use RED cineX to make 1st light color correction within premiere.
-Select clips that need AE compositing and copy/paste into AE.
-Create effects in AE then render out as 10bit uncompressed. (I do this because when rendering from Premiere AE Comps take way longer to render than directly from AE).
Bring 10bit uncompressed back into Premiere and lay on top of original clips.
Make final color correction using Magic bullet Colorista II

It is initially a bit more work, but when clients come back with changes I can quickly do them within premiere.

This is the ideal workflow, if possible.
-Make edit in premiere.
-Import entire project dynamically into AE with all clips being accessible individually,not just one comp.
-Do compositing and color correction in AE.
-Export from AE.
-Client makes changes.
-Go into Premiere make editing changes there.
-These changes are reflected in AE with all of the AE work still intact.
-Re render final from AE
 
Interesting. So it is now possible to import/export EDLs in AE without a plugin?
 
Stefan Scherperel said:
This is the ideal workflow, if possible.
-Make edit in premiere.
-Import entire project dynamically into AE with all clips being accessible individually,not just one comp.
-Do compositing and color correction in AE.
-Export from AE.
-Client makes changes.
-Go into Premiere make editing changes there.
-These changes are reflected in AE with all of the AE work still intact.
-Re render final from AE
Click to expand...

Oh how I dream of of the day Dynamic link would work like that. PPro is definitely one of the most powerful platforms out there but its creative tools are limited, and its plugin architecture is very limiting. There are less and less plugins being written for Ppro. It seems right now only Adobe's own engineers are writing plugins for PPro. That could be good in many ways but very limiting in others. Its good because Adobe's engineers have proven to be out of the box thinkers implementing new solutions for old workflows. But it takes them two years to do it.
 
Whenever you dynamically link over a cut into AE for a grade it obviously breaks the film up into a layer per cut which is not only extremely arduous for the computer (if its large resolution I usually solo the layers) but its also frustrating to work with. If you are working on a film with heavy cuts its just crazy. I would pre-comp it by scene to minimise the size of the prime comp.

It would be really cool to have a Premiere timeline in After effects to unite the toolset of AE with the simplicity of a PP timelline. Or there might be a far easier way of doing things that I'm blinded to...
 
funny thing is we obviously don't know the whole story behind the the Social Network's post process, but most of what the assistant editor was doing can be achieved natively in PProcs5.
 
Nice thanks for that Oliver. It is always inspiring to hear someone like Fincher talking - empowering the independent souls like us.
 
Thanks Oliver. cool write-up.
 
David McGavran said:
So Tyler is really fun to work with and had some great ideas to bring to the table... We are open and willing to help with your ideas as well.. What do you want?

Cheers

Dave
Click to expand...

I REALLY WANT a clone stamp tool that works with trackers - in fact let me assign anything that is positioned in XY space to be able to be attached to a tracker. Getting rid of wrinkles and so on is a very common task, at least for us.

I'd also like a slower, but more precise "super tracker" that would use a user-definable number of iterations to get me a clean track.
 
Stefan Scherperel said:
That is really the only gripe that I have with the adobe workflow as well. I realize it is definitly something that is tricky, but it does limit me from bringing whole projects to finish in after effects any more. The biggest issue is that my clients want to see what everything is going to look like before they make changes. My workflow would go like this.
Make my edits in Premiere
Import project over to AE for individual clip effects and color correction.
Export from AE for client viewing.
Client decides the the current clip order ABCDE should be ACEBD and that clip E should be longer and clip B should be a different clip.

Now I'm stuck. i could make all the changes in AE, but that's just a tedious way to edit, and you always tend to miss something without having realtime playback of clips.

Now my workflow goes like this.
-Make original edit in Premiere.
-Use RED cineX to make 1st light color correction within premiere.
-Select clips that need AE compositing and copy/paste into AE.
-Create effects in AE then render out as 10bit uncompressed. (I do this because when rendering from Premiere AE Comps take way longer to render than directly from AE).
Bring 10bit uncompressed back into Premiere and lay on top of original clips.
Make final color correction using Magic bullet Colorista II

It is initially a bit more work, but when clients come back with changes I can quickly do them within premiere.

This is the ideal workflow, if possible.
-Make edit in premiere.
-Import entire project dynamically into AE with all clips being accessible individually,not just one comp.
-Do compositing and color correction in AE.
-Export from AE.
-Client makes changes.
-Go into Premiere make editing changes there.
-These changes are reflected in AE with all of the AE work still intact.
-Re render final from AE
Click to expand...


Let me think about this a bit... Most of my last 5 years was spent making dynamiclink and import/export work as expected... This is a tricky feature request. Let me see if I can come up with any ideas...

btw, where are you located?

Cheers

Dave
 
The ability to add tracking data to a mask would be unbelieveably helpful.

I think the problem to me with using AE as the finishing tool is that it still feels like u are using a 2d FX app for it rather switching to a different work space to a purposefully designed toolset.
 
Updating in and out-points from a Premiere Project shouldn't be too complicated. It's like conforming an EDL, grading it and then getting a new EDL to reconform while keeping the grade.

I think something as simple as updating the in and out points would suffice for most people using this workflow.

The real problem is that AE's timeline UI is really punishing when grading...
 
Stefan Scherperel said:
Thanks David. I'm located in Seattle.
I understand what I'm asking for is no little task, but it sure would be great for those clients that just can't make up their mind.
Click to expand...

I will be in seattle in December with a few other guys... Maybe we could consider getting together and talking workflows? send me a private message

Cheers

Dave
 
I treid all different ways, dynamic link, copy paste etc.
I think this couldn't be that hard, when even Davinci Resolve Mac has the feature of reconforming a new cut but lets grade and effects stay in place, I think you adobe guys can make it too.

Another thing, more a question: When I send my PP cut to AE via DL the Cut in PP gets nested into a single layer comp. How can I reopen this comp. I always only get into AE. It would be nice to reopen, make changes, send again, etc.

And another request for After Effects as an finishing tool:
I really don't get, why every cut gets a seperate layer. I also do compositing and grafics work in AE but I really don't get the advantage of that. It would be great to have the possibility to put several cuts on one layer, to make the comp smaller and to apply effects to multiple layers that need the same adjustments. At the Moment if I change for example a curves adjustment in one clip I have to manually copy and paste it to all the other clips that are supposed to have the same adjustment. Makes it really hard to simply try something and undo it. If it isn't for a reason I can't emagine impossible to do so what about thinking about layer groups like sub mixers in Audio Software and then be able to apply effects to each group. The architecture, that as I said, doesn't make sense to me would stay the same, but you'd be able to change Adjustments of multiple Clips/layers with just one click.

Thank you for listening David...
 
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