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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Converting Red to how Alexa handles saturation

Gavin Greenwalt said:
The Alexa/Red differences are most easily going to be solved optically not electronically.
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Depends on what you consider as "easy".
Many things are solvable in digital domain.

Gavin Greenwalt said:
If RED offered a Red, Yellow, Green, Cyan, Blue pattern sensor then you could digitally match a RED perfectly probably to an Alexa, however the filters on the bayer pattern and the OLPF irreparably affect how the image is recorded.
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Years ago I proposed here RGBCMY CFA. In a few types of hexagonal arrangement. But sensor domain is not our area so that all may be just a fantasy...

Regarding OLPF...color part is not irreparable. To an extent. It just takes a road less travelled. Or a venture into unchartered territory.

Gavin Greenwalt said:
That's not to say that the gap can't be closed substantially because it can.
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Yup.

Gavin Greenwalt said:
And that's not to say that Alexa isn't doing some really pleasing things on the image processing side that RED couldn't also adopt( and should adopt). But, there are limits.
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There are always limits of course (often dismissed by overly optimistic perception of "raw") but there is also a room for improvement. Also, Red's image performance has some important advantages over Alexa. Which become more visible once the signal is...I'd say "optimized".
 
Something to add to the conversation here is tonal range (not dynamic range) but the number of shades of grey and how shadow to highlight transitions and accomplised, especially in 1/4 and 3/4 tones. This is where I feel Red's far exceed the Alexa, the image processing that is responsible for the "Alexa look" is great for skin tones but it seems to be at the expense of some of those really beautiful tones. This is also why the monochrome bodies produce such rich black and white footage but also why I find the Red color more pleasing than Alexa, but it does require more work and more skill to produce the images that really harness this attribute. However if you look at "Better Call Saul" (A show I've shot 2nd unit for) or any of the Nextflix series you'll see a stunning tonal range and diverse color palette that can match or exceed similar Alexa shows.
 
Something to add to the conversation here too is:
Measuring picture properties with an Alexometer is as dumb as it once was dumb to measure power with a horse. There's Luxes, Stopses, Frapses, Bitses, Nitses and other measuring Unitses. :smeagolmodeoff:
:biggrin:
 
Fellas, hoping you can help. Where the heck is RED wide gamut?
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Not sure why this is uploading upside down....dang it.
 
Jason Crittenden said:
Ahhhhhh gotcha. Thanks brother. I appreciate the response.
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Even if it was in the camera you need the LUT in camera to be able to see it on location, otherwise it looks like an even more washed out RAW-mode.
 
Christoffer I'm also interested how we can achieve this. As you mention: if we are able to succede will be good for us...more clients, better image.

I love the Arri colors.
If Red Team can bring us some amazing lut that we can use to have an Alexa image...will be marvelous
 
I posted an ARRI Rec709 conversion LUT for the Helium camera on a post titled ARRI Christmas LUT. The LUT is far from perfect but I think it's definitely a step in the right direction. I want to make a version for the Dragon sensor but I need some help getting a variety of RAW side by side comparisons between the two cameras.
 
Anton Esteban said:
I posted an ARRI Rec709 conversion LUT for the Helium camera on a post titled ARRI Christmas LUT. The LUT is far from perfect but I think it's definitely a step in the right direction. I want to make a version for the Dragon sensor but I need some help getting a variety of RAW side by side comparisons between the two cameras.
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?Link
 
Minu Park said:
Or someone actually making a lut that identical to alexa lut like sony did amd charge 150$

I am sure every one will pay for it
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Sony did not make a LUT identical to Alexa.
 
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