Can you make a decent film in a Socialist Country?

[Liam Hall]

Umm... China and North Korea are communist countries.

Andrew, Umm... ..not sure where you are getting your references...

I thought I was pretty clear on my definition: countries that define themselves as socialist either in name or in their constitution.

From Wiki:
A Socialist state, sometimes (though incorrectly) known as a communist state, is a country that practices a form of economics where productive property (companies) is owned by the state. Many socialist states refer to themselves as communist countries, though communism, a classless society in which the people in common control property, is not the system that these states operate by. Some states practice certain forms of revolutionary socialist ideology, such as Leninism or Maoism.

From me:
You might want to check Article 1 of the Chinese State Constitution which describes China as "a socialist state under the people's democratic dictatorship"[1]

North Korea has also enshrined itself as a socialist state in its own constitution. If you don't believe try google; it's a right riveting read...

 

[Radoslav Karapetkov]

Can you make a decent film in a Socialist Country?

No.

Cause there has never been such a thing as a socialist country. And probably never will be.

 

[jake blackstone]

No.

Cause there has never been such a thing as a socialist country. And probably never will be.

Funny, as all my life I was made to believe, that I'd spent half of my life in one. No less of an authority- comrade Chrushev, General Secretary of Communist Party publicly proclaimed at a Communist Party convention, that USSR had succeeded in building a developed socialist state. I guess he was wrong
And wasn't Bulgaria with Todor Zhivkov at the helm on the same path as the rest of brotherly socialist states of Eastern Europe ?

 

[Andrew McCarrick]

Andrew, Umm... ..not sure where you are getting your references...

I thought I was pretty clear on my definition: countries that define themselves as socialist either in name or in their constitution.

From Wiki:
A Socialist state, sometimes (though incorrectly) known as a communist state, is a country that practices a form of economics where productive property (companies) is owned by the state. Many socialist states refer to themselves as communist countries, though communism, a classless society in which the people in common control property, is not the system that these states operate by. Some states practice certain forms of revolutionary socialist ideology, such as Leninism or Maoism.

From me:
You might want to check Article 1 of the Chinese State Constitution which describes China as "a socialist state under the people's democratic dictatorship"[1]

North Korea has also enshrined itself as a socialist state in its own constitution. If you don't believe try google; it's a right riveting read...

I was getting my references from wikipedia, just like you.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/China - Second Paragraph

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Korea - Third Paragraph

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_Workers'_Party - First Line


You are correct in looking at their constitutions, they do claim socialism. Although, IMO, they can claim whatever they want. When you have the sole party in a country having the word of "communist" in it's name, it's a communist country.

 

[Radoslav Karapetkov]

I proclaim that I have succeeded in building a mini nuclear plant in my basement. I'll power the whole neighborhood with it for free. Don't believe me?

 

[Andrew McCarrick]

No.

Cause there has never been such a thing as a socialist country. And probably never will be.

Sorry, but then what do you define socialist as?

Because, IMO, most European Countries are, and the US is close.

To me socialism is an attempt to equalize classes (one class; no rich, no poor, no working class), through wealth redistribution, public healthcare, food stamps, social security, and other government run SOCIAL programs.

As per wikipedia:

Socialists hold that capitalism is an illegitimate economic system, since it serves the interests of the wealthy and allows the exploitation of lower classes. As such, they wish to replace it completely or at least make substantial modifications to it, in order to create a more just society that would guarantee a certain basic standard of living.[15][16] A primary goal of socialism is social equality and a distribution of wealth based on one's contribution to society, and an economic arrangement that would serve the interests of society as a whole.

 

[Liam Hall]

I was getting my references from wikipedia, just like you.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/China - Second Paragraph

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Korea - Third Paragraph

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_Workers'_Party - First Line


You are correct in looking at their constitutions, they do claim socialism. Although, IMO, they can claim whatever they want. When you have the sole party in a country having the word of "communist" in it's name, it's a communist country.

Umm...

First up Andrew, I have shot many times in these countries, I'm not just trawling google to back up my point. Second, you really need to understand the difference between a political party and a political system. I know that can be confusing when we are talking about one party states - but there is a difference. If you look at your own references above you are misunderstanding this basic point. Anyway, this thread is supposed to be discussing films made under such systems, not the systems themselves, I suggest we get back to talking movies before the thread is locked...

 

[Radoslav Karapetkov]

And wasn't Bulgaria with Todor Zhivkov at the helm on the same path as the rest of brotherly socialist states of Eastern Europe ?

I see that I didn't express myself clearly enough. Yes, many countries (including my own) were forced by the occupying Soviet Army to transform into a "socialist" state. But this means one-party totalitarian dictatorship with kgb-style state police terror, labor/death camps, etc. not the promised socialist utopia. It's all fake.

What I wanted to say is that they can all put the label "socialist" or "humane" or whatever on themselves. Even Qaddafi was some kind of "socialist". But it's simply a dictatorship, that's using that word or label or philosophy as a facade.

Socialism and Communism are utopias and the attempt to introduce them in Russia and Eastern Europe lead to a catastrophe for these countries.

So, experience proves that these systems can never happen.

But we can certainly improve capitalism.

 

[Andrew McCarrick]

Umm...

First up Andrew, I have shot many times in these countries, I'm not just trawling google to back up my point. Second, you really need to understand the difference between a political party and a political system. I know that can be confusing when we are talking about one party states - but there is a difference. If you look at your own references above you are misunderstanding this basic point. Anyway, this thread is supposed to be discussing films made under such systems, not the systems themselves, I suggest we get back to talking movies before the thread is locked...

Whatever...

Even according to the US state department, they're communist countries.

http://www.state.gov/r/pa/ei/bgn/2792.htm
http://www.state.gov/r/pa/ei/bgn/18902.htm

 

[Dave Blackham]

But we can certainly improve capitalism.

I agree, capitialism has proved to be a complete disaster of late for many countries. Doesnt the USA owe China 1.1 Trillion ?

As many have said people make films not countries, having worked and filmed in the west and what was easter block countries, Ive worked with highly skilled and helpful people in both, if the kit isnt state of the art in some countries its made up in ingenuity and skill.

 

[Martin Weiss]

Time to move this discussion to a different place; reduser is about RED digital cinematography.