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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Black Shading Tests

bevan goldswain

bevan goldswain

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I have just done black shading at the following settings:

47C for all
1: 1/48
2: 1/100
3: 1/144
4: 1/240

When shooting at: 23.98 1/48 I seem to be getting a lower noise floor by choosing the black shading calibration that is the furthest away from my current shutter speed

chosing the black shading calibration that matches my shutter speed: (1/48) I get the most noise, as I choose black shadings that are for shorter shutter speeds I get a cleaner image.

Take a look at these shots, shot at 12800 ISO

Anyone know why this is?
Black shading was done in a very dark room, with cap on and additional blackout over camera.
 

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That's impressive!

Does this create softness in the footage?
 
Um.

I think that you'd need to show some real images here as the black shading will have an effect on the colour cast of the images. While the noise floor might be lower, chances are the colour might be unacceptable.

Battistella
 
Yeah I plan to do a test with actual footage today.
I've just spent the last hour or so testing loads of possible configurations, in every configuration I have tested and when shooting plain black it ALWAYS gets cleaner with a black shading with faster shutterspeed than the one you are shooting, the faster the cleaner...

But as you say, with real images it might fall apart.
 
Shoot a few charts if you can too.
Happy filming...

battistella
 
bevan goldswain said:
Yeah I plan to do a test with actual footage today.
I've just spent the last hour or so testing loads of possible configurations, in every configuration I have tested and when shooting plain black it ALWAYS gets cleaner with a black shading with faster shutterspeed than the one you are shooting, the faster the cleaner...

But as you say, with real images it might fall apart.
Click to expand...
Looking forward to your results.
 
Michael Lindsay said:
I noticed this a while back and notified Red . So they are aware of it... I'm sure they will sort out with this next release.

Michael
Click to expand...

They must have done some testing then. Can anyone from RED chime in and let us know of any benefits/problems from blackshading at faster shutter speeds than used to shoot?
 
ringading ding -

testing ...

something for the weekend ;-)
 
I just did a blackshade at 23.976 and 1/100 th, 47/65 degrees C, 12800 iso.

Then I pointed my camera at a scene with indirect ambient light from a window receiving indirect early morning sunlight. My settings were 23.976 timebase, 360 degree open shutter, 800 iso. The scene viewed on the touchscreen was much brighter than my eyes were seeing.

At 1:1, I observed as much sharpness as ever. I also observed some noise as well, both in the areas receiving reflected light and the shadows that were pretty dark... but you have to really look for it, otherwise you'll miss it.

But the best part of all was... no red speckles. At least none that I could find. And from what I was seeing through the touchscreen, the colors, though in this scene were muted tans for the most part, seemed true.
 
Last edited:
Michael Lindsay said:
I noticed this a while back and notified Red . So they are aware of it... I'm sure they will sort out with this next release.

Michael
Click to expand...

I noticed this and notified Red as well several weeks ago. I got the best results by BS at 1/400 for shooting at 1/48-1/50 at 24 fps and 60-65C. It seems that it had just one visible effect: the red noise in the image was much more acceptable.
Ever since, I've left my Dragon camera black shaded at 1/400 to get clean images.
 
Hats off to you guys who, instead of cursing the darkness, struck a match instead.

(But you could have told the rest of us! '-)
 
The great thing about this fix is that it's reducing RedNoise™ and works with the existing post workflow instead of having to roll back to a 2008 workflow of running all your footage through RedCine. Now you guys need to find a fix for the DragonShadow™ gate shadow that is cutting flares.
 
Ignacio Aguilar said:
I noticed this and notified Red as well several weeks ago. I got the best results by BS at 1/400 for shooting at 1/48-1/50 at 24 fps and 60-65C. It seems that it had just one visible effect: the red noise in the image was much more acceptable.
Ever since, I've left my Dragon camera black shaded at 1/400 to get clean images.
Click to expand...

Can you attach some of your footage that you shot with black shading to 1/400 and is ISO 800 or more? I'm interested to see how it looks.
 
Can Graeme or anyone from RED comment on this?
The Pro's is there isn't red color noise, what are the cons for black shading for 1/400 but filming at 1/48?

Is the red color noise basically a black shading issue?
 
Paul J Steinberg said:
The great thing about this fix is that it's reducing RedNoise™ and works with the existing post workflow instead of having to roll back to a 2008 workflow of running all your footage through RedCine. Now you guys need to find a fix for the DragonShadow™ gate shadow that is cutting flares.
Click to expand...

If there aren't any problems, then yes it would be a great solution for the time being, I'd really want to see some real life tests to see if it's affecting the image in any negative way or not.
 
Paul J Steinberg said:
The great thing about this fix is that it's reducing RedNoise™ and works with the existing post workflow instead of having to roll back to a 2008 workflow of running all your footage through RedCine. Now you guys need to find a fix for the DragonShadow™ gate shadow that is cutting flares.
Click to expand...

Paul, did you trademark those two terms or is that an under-the-radar commentary? '-)
 
Let's not let this thread die, this is VERY interesting stuff. Just had my first Dragon shoot yesterday...
 
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