Best "Run and Gun" Setup for Red?

[AnthonyFlores]

Hi Guys,

I'm sure this has been covered before ... but since things move so
fast in the camera support/accessory world -- I'd like to open up the
discussion again ...

My question is, for those of you who shoot a lot (or plan to) with the
Red One shoulder mounted ... what is your rig/support of choice?

Let me preface by saying I have the Red shoulder mount and grips,
but the shoulder pad is fairly thin and when you load up the camera
it's certainly not that comfortable or balanced. Yes you can put a
pillow on your shoulder but still not ideal ...

I've tried Zacuto's products before with DSLRs and they're great --
but not sure about how well they work with Red.

The solution I'm leaning toward is the OConnor Ogrips used in conjuntion
with the Element Technica Mantis shoulder pad -- and of course the
OConn CFF1, Obox, etc.

This seems like the best of all possible worlds -- the comfort and
adjustability of the Mantis pad, the versatility of the Ogrips (so many
possible configurations!) and of course how well the other new OCon
products work with each other.

Also, I think we all clearly wants it to be future-compatible with the
Epic and Scarlet.

Thanks in advance for your thoughts!

Anthony

P.S. For anyone who knows, is it possible to buy just the Mantis
shoulder pad/plate without buying the other parts of the rig? (i.e.
grips, etc)

 

[Taylor Morrison]

And don't forget your EZRig! Nothing makes the camera more comfortable than taking the weight off the shoulder and putting it on your hips... At least in my book.

happy shooting

Taylor

 

[Steve Gibby]

ET Mantis for sure...:thumbsup:

I was one one of the guys who field tested the Mantis when it was in development. Ever since then I've owned and used extensively several Mantis units with my Reds.

Most members here on Red User know that extremely mobile "run & gun" EFP style has been my camera setup mode for my Red cameras ever since I received my first Red in August 2007. If you checkout Jay Kelley's Red 101 DVD you'll find a segment on there about me and my lightweight, mobile Red setups.

Bottom line: IMO the ET Mantis is one of the key kit items for effective run & gun with Red.

 

[AnthonyFlores]

Thanks Steve! Looks great and definitely trust your opinion. Yet
I can't help but be impressed with the strength, versatility and
options provided by the OGrips -- which is why I'm leaning toward
a Mantis along with them ...

Eric, if you read this, can you please chime in -- as I think you
have successfully combined the Mantis and OGrips before. Would
love to get your thoughts or images (if you have them.)

Also, Eric -- if you can say anything about OConnor venturing into
the world of shoulder-mount accessories and when, that would be
awesome ;-)

Sincerely,

Anthony

 

[Dan Kanes]

My vote for lightest run and gun would be:

Long valley lws front rods, no follow focus, allstar mount with contax zeiss or nikkor lenses, screw on filters, a mantis with low slung evf or red lcd only.

Ps the long valley front is there only if you have to slap on a mattebox or lws follow focus...

 

[Nick Gardner]

I have done a bunch of this type of shooting, and here is how I roll doc or run and gun with red.

ET or Long valley LWS, Elite 25-80 zoom, cintech FF, for super light weight, screw in lens shade and filters. Arri SR hand grip with built in zoom control for the right hand, left hand grip, both mounted on the lightweight rods.

That covers you for 90% of what you need to shoot for doc or corporate, and it weighs as much as an arri SR. the camera goes on and off the tripod quick, i put a cloth diaper or a piece of duve on my shoulder and away you go.

Nick

 

[Mitch Gross]

Answering for Eric ...

OConnor is developing shoulder mount accessories along with other gear. In the meantime, Abel offers many other accessories that can be used in conjunction with the O-Grips. Some people like to have as little as possible on the camera and instead pad themselves. Our House of Power shoulderpad straps to the body quite comfortably and allows quick and easy movement of the camera. Everyone has their own preference on these things.

http://www.abelcine.com/store/House-of-Power-Universal-Shoulder-Pad/

 

[AnthonyFlores]

Thanks Mitch. I know that Zacuto's individual pieces of the Zacuto
rigs can be purchased -- is the same true for ET products like the
Mantis?

 

[constantine Tirintzis]

I would think that there is no reason why to use O-Grips with the Mantis as , as far as I can see the way Mantis works its geometry you would have to use half off the front rig and mount the O-grips on the last bit where you mount the handles with rosettes.
I cant see any benefits and hearing that the O-grips are a bit heavy that will make non purpose heavier rig.
If you use the O grips directly on the O-connor mattebox I think you will have very small leverage and possibly they will be very close to your body , and I dont think it will be good for control specially with heavier loads.
Thats what I can see , but I havent tryed it, maybe Mitch can tell us if its a good combination.
As far as I can tell Mantis is a complete rig , and much cheaper if bought with its own grips. Dont see why should you combine these 2.
Best

 

[AnthonyFlores]

HI Contantine,

Thanks for your reply. Your rig looks really awesome by the way, please
let us know when it's ready and send videos/pics.

I got the idea of combining them from Eric, and only because OConnor
wasn't yet ready with their own shoulder pad or complete solution and
ET seemed to have the best shoulder pad available.

To answer your question, what I like about the OGrips is all the possible
configurations. Not sure if you've seen the video, but it's possible to use
them ... double arm ... single arm ... you can turn them into a cage ...
one grip can go against your chest, the other on your right hand, etc. The
possibilities are endless.

(I may sound like I work for OConnor, but I assure you I don't. Lol.)

I think these configurations might not matter that much for the Red One
because it's so heavy, you really need two hands almost all the time. It's
not very portable ...

... but for the Epic and Scarlet, with the lighter brains and also the lighter
batteries and SSD modules (instead of the drive) I think the total weight
will be a lot lighter and all these additional configurations that the OGrips
offer will come into play.

But I'm open to others -- I really loved Zacuto products with DSLRs, so I
imagine they will work great with Epic and Scarlet. Also, yours looks
really unique and well-built ... thanks for posting about it.

Anthony

 

[constantine Tirintzis]

Anthony hello and thanks for the compliments.
My rigs will be here soon so you can view them or even send one over to demo.
I can show you all simplicity and different configurations you can do as well as other solutions.
I like O-Grips a lot but there are also things I dont like about them.
One is weight. The other is that they look too short and sometimes you need more leverage for better control.Of course you can add more but the cost goes up a lot and so the weight.
About my upcoming rig MODULA-PRO
I have loaded every possible feature on the ModulaPro rig.
I have designed it so its very light soecially the front handle system which is all made of CARBON FIVER 1.5 TUBES, they use the same diameter for steadicam posts.
I can add more sections to make anything really.
The gripping is very solid at that diameter.
Shoulder pad is adjustable in angle, and also can slide all the way under the plate.
The same applies to the stage above, and the dovetail small plate for the handgrips.
That means that you can put a front heavy set up for DSLRs to heavy weigh cams balanced on your shoulder.
It has been designed with simplicity.
I also take balance very seriously and control operation so leverage is a very important factor specially with heavy set ups.
And an Epic with good glass , ff, mattebox, filters, battery, modules, and or motors wont be that light, perhaps a couple of kg lighter but still.
One last trick.
I intent to also make use of the patented rotational pan cradle of the Machine in a motorized version, so when you have a light camera on, you can use this feature too.
Use it when you like and take it off if not.
I still believe this is a very powerfull tool if used correctly.
And more gadgets around this .
Thanks again

 

[Tim Naylor]

Depends....

Depends....

By "run and gun", what type of shooting do you mean? For some here, it's more doc style work and others, that term may mean low low budget narrative or music videos. In eithercase, the "ideal" package would be different. Gibby uses still zooms as it sounds he does alot of unscripted in remote locations. So focus ques and marks may not be as big an issue. But if you're mostly focused on narrative, your ideal lens choice would be something different than Nikon still zooms, perhaps some ZF's instead. Or for instance, if I do the type of work that requires me to shoot for very long takes, all day on my shoulder, then a Mantis or EZ RIG (especially for event work) would fit the bill. If it's your average narrative with short takes, I prefer a lower CG and shorter handles than the Mantis for what I consider more direct/responsive control.

For narrative work, I use Moose Bars and then I made a simple rig with Manfrotto plates drilled into a knee pad, so I have a quick release shoulder pad. It doesn't raise the camera more than 3/8" and the weight is negligible. For rods, I use ET's 15mm lightweight set up. I prefer ET's to screw in rods as it's just quicker on/off. For an MB, I have a Chrosziel 450-1. Light, well build and simple. I've toyed with the O'Conner O'Grips and think they're genius. They allows the operator to adjust the rods with one hand while still holding the camera. The lock down and build are unbeatable and weigh alot less than Mantis set up. My only complaint is that I do wish they offered some type offset bracket, since the camera rests on the right shoulder. Moose Bars have a cotton wheel offset option. What I love about MB's is the simplicity and ruggedness of the design. Extremely small and lightweight.

For sticks, I really love my Miller 55 for run/gun stuff. Aside from their heavy duty carbon legs (which aren't that heavy), I always carry a set of VJ Solo legs. These substitute for baby legs and in many cases a hi hat. But you can also get them into places standard sticks just won't fit. The Miller head, while it could be more rugged, it's fluid action is really one of the best, only upended (not by much) by the much heavier and more expensive O'Conner offerings.