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Best FCP workflow including transcoded ProRes files from RedRushes?

XiaoSu Han

XiaoSu Han

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I have a project with quite a bit of footage, around 600 minutes, in front of me, shot in 4K 2:1 and am looking for the best workflow involving transcoded ProRes files from RedRushes.

Why not native directly? I am using a Macbook Pro and can't play any of the proxies in real time, not even the _P files. If FCP plays them, it's a bit blurry and you can't really cut using those files.

So my plan would be to transcode all the clips using RedRushes into ProRes 1K, use them to create a rough cut, then use clipfinder to online to FCP, send to Color and do native CC on the R3D files.

It's just really hard to find exact information on the board as it's scattered around everywhere and it's mostly only bits and pieces of experiences.

So my question would be: Is such a workflow possible? Any downfalls I might expect along the way?

Thanks and Happy Holidays
 
Yes, good workflow, as long as your computer can play back the 1k prores files perfectly.

Keep in mind, though, that with the FCP loading the R3D files natvely, you'll only have 2k in your project. However, that really should be good for everything unless you're going to film.
 
transcoding time...

transcoding time...

Remember to account for the time it takes to transcode those files to prores. Even on an 8 core it can take a lot of hours.
Rob Gardner
 
Thanks for the clarification!

Yeah, 1K ProRes plays perfectly fine and it looks good too.

Regarding the rendering time, we've started already, almost got 10% after 5 hours so I'm letting the computer run for 2 days and it should be done ;)

Regards, Xax
 
Ryan Patch said:
Keep in mind, though, that with the FCP loading the R3D files natvely, you'll only have 2k in your project. However, that really should be good for everything unless you're going to film.
Click to expand...

2K is fine for going to film. The vast, vast bulk of digital intermediate work - even for studio pictures - is done at 2K, regardless of origination format (film or digital). Why so many people here seem to think that 4K is some kind of starting point for film recording is something I don't understand.
 
1K ProRes transcodes are my preferred way of cutting. As long as you don't rename the underlying quicktimes (you can rename clips in the FCP bins), you can reconnect to wrapped R3D QT files for your online conform.

The beautiful thing about 1K on an 8-core is that when rendering using quarter-debayer, you're getting almost realtime transcoding. Anything higher than quarter debayer is not necessary with 1K.
 
Sounds like a good workflow. I'm going to be using something similar, with the exception of going to Shake before Color (chroma keying).
Is there some instruction of this workflow somewhere, especially about using Clipfinder and Log&Transfer to connect the offline clips to online clips?

Thanks, and happy Christmas!
 
Do this and it will help you get your project into Color using all the power of 12 bit RAW using this non-documented method I found.

1. After all your files are transcoded to ProRes, add an _H.mov to the end of the file name of each clip. This will not make your file a proxy file but it will Trick Color later on. If you don't add this extension the following will NOT work.

2. Import, edit etc. When your finished with your edit, kick everything down in the timeline to Video Track 1 and remove any dissolves, effects etc, and export a standard EDL, default settings from FCP. (Make sure its just the standard ProRes Clips you are exporting in the EDL, no jpgs, etc).

3. Open Color, Create a new project. File import the EDL. The EDL Import Settings dialogue box will appear.
Project Frame Rate - Set ie 23.98 or whatever your project frame rate in FCP
EDL Frame Rate - Set ie 23.98 or whatever your project frame rate in FCP
Source Frame Rate - Set ie 23.98 or whatever your project frame rate in FCP
Project Resolution = Choose Whatever your master file will be up to 2K or below in resolution. Color will import at any of your chosen resolutions up to 2048x1152.
Source Directory - IMPORTANT - Click "Browse" and navigate to the folder where all your original R3D's are for your project. If they are in multiple folders on the drive, just select the drive.

4. After step 3 above, click import. Color will build your FCP timeline and you will have access to the RED Tab using all 12bits of the RAW information like if you did the L&T 'Native' workflow. Also, it bypasses having to go into media manager etc.

This is my favorite new workflow to date. Luca found this workflow with the proxies. I don't like working with the Proxies so I tried it with the ProRes Files and it works great with a few small tweaks.

NOTES:
1. You can have your ProRes offline files on a different drive than your R3D's without any problems. You don't have to replace each file into its respective RDC folder. You are later going to tell Color where to locate the original R3D's that match the name of the offline ProRes clips.
2. Again, you must put a _H.mov at the end of your ProRes clips ie A003_C001_1222N3_H.mov
3. On a large project, break it up into pieces when sending to Color, like 10-15minutes a shot.

If you have any issues send me a pm. I have done this workflow successfully many times now and it works for large and small projects.
Enjoy!
 
Thanks very much for the comprehensive breakdown!

I'll try that, it's probably also working if I added _P instead of _H?

I ask because I've already started editing with the _P files and now want to replace them with the offline ProRes files of course.

Thanks again, regards Xax

PS: When would I add dissolves, slugs and text inserts? After Color?
 
You can use _P.mov if you wish or _M.mov.
You will add all your dissolves etc back in FCP. I usually render everything in Color to 10bit Uncompressed files to avoid the gamma shift the ProRes files have. Then send back to FCP and finish.
Cheers!
 
Looks like a perfect workflow for HDTV or other electronic media! I'd like to add that there are excellent freeware tools for the Mac to do the renaming, like R-Name or Renamer4Mac.
 
mmost said:
2K is fine for going to film. The vast, vast bulk of digital intermediate work - even for studio pictures - is done at 2K, regardless of origination format (film or digital). Why so many people here seem to think that 4K is some kind of starting point for film recording is something I don't understand.
Click to expand...

I think they would be even more shocked to learn that back in the day, a lot of filmouts were 2k 8bit, when 2k 10bit was considered a luxury.
 
anyone experienced playback with prores to be still frames only when in full screen?

I can hear sound, but can only see one frame, when I stop and start again, I see the frame it's supposed to be at. Play back fine in a small screen.
 
mikeburton said:
Do this and it will help you get your project into Color using all the power of 12 bit RAW using this non-documented method I found.

1. After all your files are transcoded to ProRes, add an _H.mov to the end of the file name of each clip. This will not make your file a proxy file but it will Trick Color later on. If you don't add this extension the following will NOT work.

2. Import, edit etc. When your finished with your edit, kick everything down in the timeline to Video Track 1 and remove any dissolves, effects etc, and export a standard EDL, default settings from FCP. (Make sure its just the standard ProRes Clips you are exporting in the EDL, no jpgs, etc).

3. Open Color, Create a new project. File import the EDL. The EDL Import Settings dialogue box will appear.
Project Frame Rate - Set ie 23.98 or whatever your project frame rate in FCP
EDL Frame Rate - Set ie 23.98 or whatever your project frame rate in FCP
Source Frame Rate - Set ie 23.98 or whatever your project frame rate in FCP
Project Resolution = Choose Whatever your master file will be up to 2K or below in resolution. Color will import at any of your chosen resolutions up to 2048x1152.
Source Directory - IMPORTANT - Click "Browse" and navigate to the folder where all your original R3D's are for your project. If they are in multiple folders on the drive, just select the drive.

4. After step 3 above, click import. Color will build your FCP timeline and you will have access to the RED Tab using all 12bits of the RAW information like if you did the L&T 'Native' workflow. Also, it bypasses having to go into media manager etc.

This is my favorite new workflow to date. Luca found this workflow with the proxies. I don't like working with the Proxies so I tried it with the ProRes Files and it works great with a few small tweaks.

NOTES:
1. You can have your ProRes offline files on a different drive than your R3D's without any problems. You don't have to replace each file into its respective RDC folder. You are later going to tell Color where to locate the original R3D's that match the name of the offline ProRes clips.
2. Again, you must put a _H.mov at the end of your ProRes clips ie A003_C001_1222N3_H.mov
3. On a large project, break it up into pieces when sending to Color, like 10-15minutes a shot.

If you have any issues send me a pm. I have done this workflow successfully many times now and it works for large and small projects.
Enjoy!
Click to expand...

Adding an H it's a very smart trick! Good find Mike.
 
Does Clipfinder do what Crimson and MonkeyExtract does? Conforming only clips used in timeline so that I can batch render clip frames only used locked cut. Do I have to send the clip into RedCine to render DPX?
 
I can´t get the "adding _H.mov" thing to work......I´ve tried exporting 1/2 debayer, adding _H.mov; exporting 1/4 debayer from redrushes, adding _M.mov; exporting 1/4 or 1/8 debayer, rescaling to 1024x2048 and adding _H.mov...I export to the parent directory, within which the .RDM is, export the EDL to the same folder, import the EDL in Color...the clip is there, but the RED Tab is empty....what am i doing wrong ?.....the Luca's proxy-EDL method works fine, but I'd rather edit with prores files cause I can´t get the proxies to play realtime in my mac book pro....pleae help to sort this out
thanks
 
amourgues said:
I can´t get the "adding _H.mov" thing to work......I´ve tried exporting 1/2 debayer, adding _H.mov; exporting 1/4 debayer from redrushes, adding _M.mov; exporting 1/4 or 1/8 debayer, rescaling to 1024x2048 and adding _H.mov...I export to the parent directory, within which the .RDM is, export the EDL to the same folder, import the EDL in Color...the clip is there, but the RED Tab is empty....what am i doing wrong ?.....the Luca's proxy-EDL method works fine, but I'd rather edit with prores files cause I can´t get the proxies to play realtime in my mac book pro....pleae help to sort this out
thanks
Click to expand...
Did you import prores files in color?
 
How so ?...I just imported the EDL list just exported from FCP......need anything else ?
 
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