Bailout Alternative???

[Priyesh P.]

Doesn't matter if shoes are $2 a pair from China if too many people here are bankrupt with no hope for good work.

But it`s not only boots. Big parts and equipment of aircrafts, cars and everything else that the army requires are made outside of the USA. And let`s not forget, the army is not the only area where public money is spent, what about buildings and all sorts of ordinay stuff that is built/acquired by the government? If you would try to keep 80% of the public spendings in the country (and don`t forget, chinese workers earn only a few dollars a day) then, yeah, quite some tax increases, I bet...

 

[Jeff Kilgroe]

Actually a barrel of oil is about 42 gallons and produces about 19.5 gallons of gas

It's late and I need to find some sleep, but it's actually supposed to be 31 gallons out of 55, not 3.1. At least that seems to be what the general consensus is in the oil and gas industry -- about a 55% yield at the pump from most crude production...

If you want to get really pedantic about it, the 42 gallon barrel is a unit of measure and has not been used as a transportation volume since the early 1960s. When talking cost of oil or as oil is traded on the commodities exchange, it is measured in 42 gallon barrels.

When being refined or stored, oil is referred to simply in terms of gallons or "drums". Drums are 55 US gallons, 44 metric gallons or 200 litres.

As for the amount of gasoline derived from a given amount of oil, this depends on the type of oil being refined. Some of the best oil in the world is that found in the south western USA - typically called Texas Crude and has the rich black color. It has a a yield of nearly 33% of crude into gasoline through hydrocracking and a vacuum distillation process. Arabian oil is similar, but has conversion rates in the high 20% range. Other crude oil types, like "green" or "sweet" crude, yield far less. South American or Venezuelan green usually has a yield of less than 5%. These are straight-run yeilds.

With today's strict environmental restrictions on lead, ethanol additives and octane levels, gasoline derived from crude oil is refined and diluted multiple times before it reaches the pump. And we actually see gasoline stretched beyond straight-run yields by way of alcohol additives and ethanol derived from other sources, like distilling corn oil.

As for the diesels running hemp oil. I think you are right on that, historically. But today's diesels are different animals. I suppose it is still possible though as hemp oil wouldn't be a whole lot different than running some forms of biodiesel and the various vegetable oil conversions out there. From what I've seen of biodiesel and corn / canola oil offerings is they work OK for pickups and smaller diesel vehicles. As long as they're not the higher-reving engines we're starting to see for some applications. And as long as the driver doesn't regularly place heavy strain by pulling heavy loads. These conversions typically require a separate heater to pre-heat the fuel and don't give as much power by volume. Most biodiesels don't have enough octane and/or the flash combustion index changes radically with volume meaning larger engines need increasingly more heat and/or compression. That isn't necessary with conventional high-grade diesel. I have no idea how hemp oil would compare, I am just guessing it would be similar.

Legalization of cultivating hemp is a whole other can of worms. But if we can get the public at large to look beyond the drug stigma associated with it, there are plenty of valid, non-narcotic uses for the plant. Unfortunately most of the arguments for, such as fibers for papers, rope, clothing, etc.. are already being fulfilled through low-cost hemp imports or can be met with synthetic products. But if we consider it for production of fuel, I'm guessing that there is nowhere near enough hemp out there and it would be more cost-effective to grow within our borders.

Ultimately, I think the best approach in regards to slowing oil consumption is to get practical electric, hydrogen and fuel-cell vehicles in the hands of consumers. Arguably the majority of vehicles on our roads are private commuter vehicles. If we can convert half of them to renewable sources within the next 10 to 12 years, that will have a serious impact on oil consumption. And even if larger commercial vehicles and heavy equipment still consume fossil fuels, that will be the least of our worries at that point, if no new consumer / commuter vehicles being sold burn a petroleum product.

 

[Jeff Kilgroe]

Right now too many people don't have jobs.

I think the media has it wrong when they talk about unemployment. Historically speaking, the unemployment rate has always hovered around 5 to 5.5 percent, real close to where it is now. The real exceptions being the great depression and the two world wars. We saw higher unemployment rates in the economic slump of the '70s than what we have now.

What I think the media needs to focus on more is the "under-employment" phenomenon. It's not that people don't have jobs or that there are not jobs out there to be had, if they really look. It's that the types of jobs and wages available have not kept up with inflation and taxation. And we have a huge number of "under-employed". I'm talking about the computer tech who was laid off from a consulting firm, who now works in the tool department of Home Depot for less than half of what he made 2 years ago. Many of these people lost their jobs to outsourcing, carry-overs from the dot-com crash, poorly run companies, etc.. Unfortunately, the vast majority of available jobs are in the service and retail industries. And if everything continues on it's present course, I wonder how long those jobs will be there... If the economy continues to slide and people stop spending money, restaurants are going to close up or cut back hours, same with retail stores and other luxuries of our times. That is when we'll really see the unemployment rate start a truly nasty climb toward double digits.

I'm convinced people have been living on credit and the income from refinanced homes for the past 6 years because the labor market has been weak for years. It's finally caught up with us.

Yep.

 

[number6]

You`re drifting off-topic - in the beginning it was about protecting the familiy from the brother in law, which, in my definition is duty of the police (or you`re just opening the gates for all types of self justice - politicians are role models and should act accordingly, otherwise people will ask themselves how they can bend reality in order to justify wrong behaviour). Now you`re justifying a useless action.

Have to say I disagree with your assessment. The two are totally related. That is, as a husband Todd Palin was not only within his rights to protect his family, but was duty bound to do so. HE is the one primarily being blamed for lobbying for the trooper to be fired. And I would say that the matter was attempted to be handed over to the police when the leader of the police (shouldn't the state's first family be allowed to deal directly with the leader of the police?) was asked to handle the matter. Just wonder if the commissioner in question would have fired the trooper if he had threatened his oun (the commissioner's) family?

As to your second point, I haven't seen a rash of news reports of Alaskans becoming "Citizens Gone Wild" after this non-story broke. Besides, the public puts politicians in general at the same low level as news media, late night show hosts, and "any lawyer other than their oun". I don't think Alaskans follow (and I only conclude this after analyzing your assumptions) the European model of "citizen see, citizen do."

But to answer your question. Of course I would not like to work with someone I don`t want to associate with, but I did and still do if he or she has good skills - and I always try to stay objective and challenge my own decisions - but there`s a difference - I`m not in service of the public. If I was, I have to put my personal views aside, I`m serving the country, in a wider sense. Let`s for example say I`m racist and fire the brilliant afro-american or indian or corean supervisor and instead choose someone who is less skilled or something. This action may be totally right, but does it serve the community that elected me?

Personal views aside? Are you a computer? There is no putting of personal views aside in human behaviour! It is like not thinking... you simply cannot do it.

Like when Obama chose... what's his name, instead of Hillary. Was that for the good of the country or because he was afraid if he chose Hillary, some wild woman might assassinate him so they could have the first woman president? Was it self serving of him to choose... what's his name, because it insured he was no longer in danger because if anyone tried to harm him, millions of Americans would jump in front to take the bullet because they don't want... what's his name, as President?

Besides, this country was founded on personal views. It was when those personal views became an amalgum that we were born.

I bet it does, as long as he is republican...or Sarah Palin :spidy:

Need to leave your contact information on a post here. Our ABC, NBC, CBS networks may want to interview you. They are often looking for examples of this POV to balance their coverage.

 

[Priyesh P.]

What I think the media needs to focus on more is the "under-employment" phenomenon.

As the rate of unemployment fell due to stricter regulations in social welfare, german politicians praised themselves for it. Unfortunately, even combined income AND welfare does barely cover costs of living for these people. More and more of them rely on soup kitchens...

 

[Matthew Rogers]

Growing crops is NOT going to be a viable future for energy. The current situation with growing corn is stupid. Corn prices have skyrocketed, we are subsidizing the crap out of it (which means you are actually paying more per gallon than you realize here in the US), and ethanol produces less gas mileage AND causes to you to actually use more OIL per gallon of gas than before.

Wind is not really viable because it just doesn't produce enough power. Solar, once we get more efficient panels will be great. Nuclear should also be pushed more. Battery tech also has to improve for all of this to work also. Something that we can put in a car and charge in a minutes or two at a "station."

Matthew

 

[Joel Kaye]

But it`s not only boots. Big parts and equipment of aircrafts, cars and everything else that the army requires are made outside of the USA. And let`s not forget, the army is not the only area where public money is spent, what about buildings and all sorts of ordinay stuff that is built/acquired by the government? If you would try to keep 80% of the public spendings in the country (and don`t forget, chinese workers earn only a few dollars a day) then, yeah, quite some tax increases, I bet...

You perfectly describe exactly why we're in trouble. We don't make anything anymore. The solution is to start making a lot of stuff again. Right now our biggest industry is FINANCIAL SERVICES. It just failed.

You also described that Gov't is far too big.

I think I read a stat that said something like half of all dollars spent goes through the Gov't somehow. Maybe that's not accurate, but Gov't is far too big, controls too much and I'd argue much of it is pork barrel defense spending. When you spend more than the rest of the world combined you're spending too much IMHO.

I'm with my libertarian friends on the budget. A gov't with less money to dole out is less corrupt. But I think social stability (education, job training, energy investment etc.) is a far better national defense than another $50 million dollar bomber.

@Jeff

I agree with you overall. Unemployment numbers are tough to determine because the calculation has changed over the years. However, underemployment is a VERY good point. Yes people have jobs, but not the really good one. I certainly know many people that were making 80k plus as programmers, lost their jobs and now the same job pays half that or they are eLancing. There are a lot of people down at Starbucks with good college degrees. Even engineering is outsourced.

Also, it has long been a strategy of many companies to hire more part time workers so they can eliminate insurance benefits. And how much does health insurance cost? A fortune. How easy is it to lose your benefit? Easy. I bet every one of us knows someone that is not insurable. Add up all the insurance you pay... and then look at how profitable those companies are. The executives make out like thieves.

Also, we have a tradition in America of living beyond our means. I sometimes look at all the stuff people have and wonder where the hell the money is coming from. Well, I'm now hearing a lot of real world stories of people going bankrupt or stopping their spending or selling off stuff etc.

 

[Joel Kaye]

Wind is not really viable because it just doesn't produce enough power.

You might want to let this guy know:
http://www.pickensplan.com/theplan/

I think we all agree that R&D in all these areas are a good idea. There is one crop that might work - algea.
http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/earth/4213775.html

 

[number6]

Growing crops is NOT going to be a viable future for energy. The current situation with growing corn is stupid. Corn prices have skyrocketed, we are subsidizing the crap out of it (which means you are actually paying more per gallon than you realize here in the US), and ethanol produces less gas mileage AND causes to you to actually use more OIL per gallon of gas than before.

Wind is not really viable because it just doesn't produce enough power. Solar, once we get more efficient panels will be great. Nuclear should also be pushed more. Battery tech also has to improve for all of this to work also. Something that we can put in a car and charge in a minutes or two at a "station."

Matthew

Maybe taken as a single solution the things you mention are not viable, but as parts of the whole each of them are indispensable.

Forget about Texas oil... those windmills that are going up all over the landscape are better than having oil wells because outside af a little maintenance, once they are "drilled" they never go dry. (The wind is an almost constant companion here on the Southern High Plains). The need is for infrastructure to get the wind energy from the windy states (boy, is that an opening for someone who is adversarial to jump on:help: ) to the wind challenged, yet energy deficient ones.

And like Joel alluded to, the algae path seems very promising for biodeisel. Plus there are many new discoveries being pursued for changing corn stover, switchgrass,... weeds...into sugars convertible into ethanol.

Pickens has a good idea for converting transportation over to CNG (compressed natural gas). It is safe, burns cleanly, and is abundant here at home. Does not have to be transported to here from around the world so saves some ocean traffic and therefore, some ocean and air pollution.

Everything is changing and it has nothing to do with politicians jumping in front of the parade and claiming they are the leaders of the change. The change is pervasive through out the world and we all are causing it while at the same time contributing to it. We are probably not aware of the scope of it and will only recognize what we've done when it's over. All that's left now is to decide which parties in all the governments get to be the stewards for the change, or if left to its oun design, claim un-earned responsibility for it.

 

[Priyesh P.]

Personal views aside? Are you a computer? There is no putting of personal views aside in human behaviour! It is like not thinking... you simply cannot do it.

On my last project there were two guys I presonally disliked, both of them loudmouths. But I didn`t care, because they did their duties excellently.
It´s what I call professional behaviour. If I would kick asses each time I dislike someone`s nose I`ll be in trouble really soon - for nothing.

If you`re different, fine. Suum cuique, as I say.