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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Avid DNxHD QT codec now posted!

36 is mainly used for offline but has been screened on 40 foot screen for reviews. it holds up very well qualty wise and is roughly 18 hours on a 300GB drive.

Michael
 
Cool cool cool! The last pieces of the puzzle are finally falling into place, yaay...

Quick question - is the lack of DNxHD36 output a RedCine issue or an Avid issue? RedCine doesn't seem to use a standard Quicktime output dialog box so I am assuming they screwed something up there?

I just shot 600gb of footage that needs to be transcoded to DNxHD36 as quickly as possible so we can start editing - so this is not an idle question ;)

Using the current workflow, I guess I'll need to run some tests and figure out whether it would be faster/better to:

1. output RedCine -> DNxHD175 and then transcode to DNxHD36 on import

or

2. output RedCine -> JPEG image sequence (image sequences seem to go faster than Quicktime in general on RedCine) and transcode to DNxHD36 on import

Thanks again MichaelP - and if possible please give us a hint if the DNxHD36 issue is something you might have working in beta or whether I should be submitting that as a RedCine feature request.

BTW, DNxHD36 absolutely rocks. A great example of a feature that separates Avid from FCP. I can never go back... Michael Tronick (Hairspray, Mr & Mrs Smith, etc) used it on the Hannah Montana 3D concert film a year ago and when I got footage from him I kept having to remind myself it was offline. It makes the whole offline -> online process so much easier for VFX because you are getting full-raster imagery from the get go. So all of your effects that use pixel values (blur radius etc) don't need to be translated when you get the online footage. You can take your project and edit happily in 1080p off an internal laptop drive. I can't believe RedCine seems like the only Win/Mac app on the planet that can't output it yet ;)

Bruce Allen
www.boacinema.com
 
The lack of alternate DNxHD rates is something that RED needs to implement into REDrushes and REDCINE, REDline, etc. We are working with them to make this happen but because it does not address the codecs via the MoviePlayer interface, it cannot use the codec's list of data rates. Hopefully they will hit a breakthrough on this since it is a key element to making offline dailies in HD.

If you need quick turnaround for 36, I would suggest REDrushes to QT references and ALE (see updated workflow guide for the +1 step when using ALE's from REDrushes) and process the QT ref in either Compressor or MPEG Streamclip. I have found MPEG Streamclip to be quite fast but have not figured out a way to preserve width for the 2:1 aspect ratio. If shooting 16:9, it's fine. Also, QT refs do not carry over any changes in the color if manipulated.

A user on this forum found REDRushes to DVCPRO to be a fairly quick render. In that scenario I would use REDrushes to create the .mov with look and burn-in if needed but the ALE would need to be done in MetaCheater since MetaCheater can do the 30fps representation of the file. 720p in the NTSC world is a 59.94p format with a 30fps SMPTE addressable timecode so it looks a lot like NTSC as far as workflows are concerned. The ALE from MetaCheater would need to be tweaked in the header to work. DVCPRO would take up 2x more storage compared to DNxHD36 at a smaller raster size, but could be a useful workflow for some productions.

Michael
 
MichaelP said:
The lack of alternate DNxHD rates is something that RED needs to implement into REDrushes and REDCINE, REDline, etc. We are working with them to make this happen but because it does not address the codecs via the MoviePlayer interface, it cannot use the codec's list of data rates. Hopefully they will hit a breakthrough on this since it is a key element to making offline dailies in HD.
Click to expand...

Gotcha. Thanks Michael.

Thank you for the good interim workflow suggestions for 36. Unfortunately I am on PC. Anyway, am just delighted by 175 working...

Bruce Allen
www.boacinema.com
 
Hopefully we will have better PC solutions in the future...

Michael
 
Bruce,

If you want to stay on a completely PC workflow you could.

R3d to Cineform, then Cineform to DNxHD via mpeg streamclip, then fast import into Avid.

I have no idea how fast this workflow is and what metadata is saved or not, but it is a way to get where you want to go, until Avid and Red decide to let us PC users into the game.

Chris
 
Thank you for all the help and encouragement!

Good news so far - Avid seems to be really fast at making DNxHD36 media from DNxHD175 media. Even on my *very cheap* PC.

I bought another 1TB drive for $140 or so, and am rendering everything out of RedCine to DNxHD175.

Then I import into Avid at DNxHD36. So far all metadata etc seems to come across.

Next feature request (or maybe it has been done already?): have all RedCine clip color settings come across so when I do the online I can work off of my 1-light. If nobody has fixed this by the time I online I think I could write a little program:
1. user gives the program the old RedCine project (used for dailies / 1-light), plus the new RedCine project (made from EDL)
2. the program goes through the new RedCine project shot by shot and copies over color settings from the corresponding shot in the old RedCine project

Maybe this has already been done - I just haven't gotten there yet... Doesn't seem to much of a worry in any case.

Bruce Allen
www.boacinema.com
 
We would pass it along if it were passed along in the original XML to ALE. We do get the color parameters passed to us from REDrushes, so it is possible. It is more a matter of ensuring the parameters are consistent.

Michael
 
Similar to the ASC CDL values that Avid already carries through the post process, even a BLOB as you suggest can already be managed by Avid in the LUT column on a per event basis. This can be handed back to REDCINE, or Scratch for that matter as a starting point for the next step in the process.

Michael
 
Fast import

Fast import

Hi Michael,

other question:
We have been there back in 2002 with OMFI and Meridien etc. - it was a "copy" - when you say next major release it clenches somewhere in my back.
Do you mean MC4.0 ?

Cheers

MichaelP said:
A lot of the "slowness" of fast import is also on the Media Composer side in the way we optimize during the process. Work is being done specifically to this area for the next major release to make this much faster - basically "a copy".

Michael
Click to expand...
 
I never know what the actual release will be called until it is released, but if I were to hazard a guess, we are at 3.0.5 right now, I would think it won't be a 4.0. I hope the back feels better. ;)

Michael
 
based on your proposed vesion #, I'd say 3.2 as it is not in the very next point release.

Michael
 
Good Job MP, great PDF !
 
what sort of speed hit are we talking about when importing DNxHD files generated by REDCine?

Is it not quicker or the same speed ingesting QT uncompressed (not working about file sizes)
 
Hi,

Is it possible to export DNxHD footage out of REDCINE without purchase of any AVID products?
 
You can create DnxHD quicktimes out from RedCine, RedAlert or RedRushes. Althought, you are confined to 175.
 
You just need to have the Avid QT codecs installed on the system creating the media, not the Media Composer application - these can be downloaded from avid.com/red via the resources tab - Mac and PC.

Michael
 
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