Anyone with a 64GB Laptop?

[David Kuhn]

There seem to be a couple niche vendors selling Laptops supporting up to 64gb ram... anyone using one? One of my guys has asked for a 64gb machine and before I say "No stick with first tier vendors" I'd like to know if anyone has one (and you guys are the most likely users for such machines). I suspect they're using desktop chipsets (I don't think there's a laptop chipset that supports >32GB) and that makes me think they'll be all sorts of quirky/unreliable power hogs.

Damn things are very expensive too... you can get a very fast Z820 for the same price.

 

[Jeff Kilgroe]

You are correct, they are using desktop chipsets. The down side to these systems is they're rarely a balanced system -- the CPU and other components usually are over-matched for the GPU. Battery life is usually measured in "minutes" and they should not be thought of as actual laptops. Some of them get too hot under load to comfortably rest them in your lap too. Not to mention that they're usually quite bulky. But that's subjective to an extent -- Today's desktop PC in 17" ~ 19" laptop form is no more bulky than the sexiest and most efficient laptops of the mid to late '90s. Hehehe

There are a couple options out there for 32GB on notebook or more mobile-oriented hardware. But that is the limitations of the hardware. Sad because I'd love 64GB in a notebook too... I haven't bought a new laptop since my retina MBP in 2012 and my 17" ZBook just before that. None of the newer systems have offered anything but minimal upgrades. Sure, Thunderbolt 2 and a slight tweak to the CPU line. That's it. And the 16GB RAM on both is the biggest limiting factor. If they would offer a 32GB model, I'd switch yesterday. I'd pay double or triple for a 64GB unit with an awesome GPU. And while that seems to put me into the market for the desktop laptop systems, I've never had good luck with those. Never had one that I couldn't overheat or cause other issues with when trying to do real work. And I'd rather put a real desktop PC in a rolling case than lug around one of those monsters in a "laptop" bag or backpack. Been there, done that. :/

 

[Grant H]

You are correct, they are using desktop chipsets. The down side to these systems is they're rarely a balanced system -- the CPU and other components usually are over-matched for the GPU. Battery life is usually measured in "minutes" and they should not be thought of as actual laptops. Some of them get too hot under load to comfortably rest them in your lap too. Not to mention that they're usually quite bulky. But that's subjective to an extent -- Today's desktop PC in 17" ~ 19" laptop form is no more bulky than the sexiest and most efficient laptops of the mid to late '90s. Hehehe

There are a couple options out there for 32GB on notebook or more mobile-oriented hardware. But that is the limitations of the hardware. Sad because I'd love 64GB in a notebook too... I haven't bought a new laptop since my retina MBP in 2012 and my 17" ZBook just before that. None of the newer systems have offered anything but minimal upgrades. Sure, Thunderbolt 2 and a slight tweak to the CPU line. That's it. And the 16GB RAM on both is the biggest limiting factor. If they would offer a 32GB model, I'd switch yesterday. I'd pay double or triple for a 64GB unit with an awesome GPU. And while that seems to put me into the market for the desktop laptop systems, I've never had good luck with those. Never had one that I couldn't overheat or cause other issues with when trying to do real work. And I'd rather put a real desktop PC in a rolling case than lug around one of those monsters in a "laptop" bag or backpack. Been there, done that. :/

Is there a reason to Apple's mobile 16gb limit? Shocked me that I showed them my credit card and they weren't offering anything past 16.

 

[Jeff Kilgroe]

It's not an Apple thing, it's an Intel and Computer Industry thing. To get 32GB on the current crop of mobile chipsets, a secondary memory controller needs to be added and this comes with a performance penalty. The maximum addressable RAM on the current crop of mobile chipsets is 32GB, but there is only two DIMM sockets or two channels available without the secondary controller. Current SO-DIMMs or the equivalent of soldered-on RAM in the MBP, tops out at 8GB per channel. This is changing for the better on the newer chipsets being released later this year. However, the next issue is the move to DDR4 memory and so far capacities are lower and the memory is still more expensive. So we're not likely to see 32GB in initial top-tier Broadwell and Skylake mobile equipped systems, but the platforms technically support up to 64GB of DDR4.

 

[Grant H]

It's not an Apple thing, it's an Intel and Computer Industry thing...

Good to know. You're always a source of great knowledge. Thanks, Jeff.

 

[L. Langer]

Is there a reason to Apple's mobile 16gb limit? Shocked me that I showed them my credit card and they weren't offering anything past 16.

All Intel and AMD mobile chipsets are dual-channel affairs because they are derived from the consumer desktop chipsets, which have on-die dual-channel memory controllers. Dual-channel has been the consumer standard for years now. Quad-channel controller designs are reserved for professional and enthusiast desktop use. The only reason it hasn't been implemented in mobile chipsets is because it never made sense for them to do so, given the power requirements and additional heat made by older DDR tech. However, future chipsets may have quad-channel designs as AMD and Intel can easily implement it. For example, AMD's latest APU has a quad-channel memory controller with two channels disabled, for unknown reasons. Once the new stacked memory tech begins to appear in SODIMM form - it's already been implemented in other memory sticks - you'll see higher capacity RAM available for the older dual-channel systems like what we have today.

 

[Jeff Kilgroe]

There is actually no good reason, other than the industry at large harboring the belief that no one needs more than 16GB in a laptop, as to why we can't buy bigger SODIMMs. There is no new technology coming along for DDR3 memory. DDR3 is over and everyone is shifting to DDR4 now. But there is absolutely zero reason why we can't buy 16GB DDR3 SODIMMs. However, I doubt we'll see them at this point.

We will see 16GB SODIMMs for DDR4, however they're several months away still, probably well into 2016. We're still not seeing 16GB DDR4 DIMMs for the desktop. Some of the 16GB RDIMMs are starting to trickle out, but the performance isn't great.

 

[Eric Bowen]

It really just comes down to demand. The Fabs cut and bin the dram chips based on what the customers ie the dimm manufacturers and oems are bidding for. Right now the Fabs are split in production between DDR4 and DDR3. This means there is far less availability for chips for both lines. Speed sells more than density right now so the higher grade chips are being used for speed versus density. Once the fabs move completely over to DDR4 next year when mobile and desktop move to DDR4 then you will start seeing higher density dimms.

 

[David Kuhn]

While it would be great if there were fast 64GB laptops out there... the reality is that there just aren't that many customers for such a machine yet, we're likely to be stuck at 16gb for quite a while to come. At my company, IT's 'Premium CAD laptop' offering is a DUAL Core i7 system with 16gb... that's considered 'high end' (base laptop is a 13" i7 ultrabook with 8gb). The reality is... those machines are considered entirely adequate for the vast majority of users.

I didn't even realize there were any dual core processors for sale anymore.

 

[Brian Merlen]

i posted a link a year or so ago to a 32gb laptop...it was basically a 3 inch thick laptop, heavy, limited battery with one dedicated GPU, and no battery at all with 2 GPUs lol...it was in some respects not a laptop...but on par with a xeon, you could put a xeon in it.. like dual 8 cores on the high end its frankly insane specs even now...think i was looking at media workstations.net and another firm back then? titan or something? it was very impressive but i live in a prores mac os world and not worth it for me essentially, I'm happy on this platform

 

[David Kuhn]

I've had 32gb laptops for years (first a Dell then an HP) but they've always been expensive, big and heavy (with sub 2-hour battery life). These days I only carry one on the rare occasion that I actually need it (I'm in Orlando at a conference now - with a loaded rMBP and Surface Pro, which between them are still much smaller and lighter than my 17" hp).