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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Anyone edited feature using r3d's

Peter Dmitriyev said:
Also, why is PPro 3 way color corrector not as powerful as Color Finesse? Just curious as I've never used Finesse, what makes it more "powerful" ? ? Thanks!
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Hi Peter,

Color Finesse will allow you to do a lot more because it's more than a 3 way color corrector. It will give you proper graph readouts of where colors are at. It will allow you adjust which portions of the image are regarded as Highlights, Mids, and Blacks. It will give you more tools for adjusting the color of the channels in these portions of the image. It will allow you to do secondary color corrections on particular areas of the image. + a huge amount of other stuff. The best way to understand the difference is to have a play with it. If you have a copy of After Effects, it is included for free :)

Interestingly, it is also available for purchase as a Premiere Pro plugin though I don't know of many people doing this.

Some people also like using After Effects because it does a very good quality final render. (Though I think the gap between AE and PPro has closed quite a bit in the past couple of years)
 
Brad Allen said:
Hi Peter,

Color Finesse will allow you to do a lot more because it's more than a 3 way color corrector. It will give you proper graph readouts of where colors are at. It will allow you adjust which portions of the image are regarded as Highlights, Mids, and Blacks. It will give you more tools for adjusting the color of the channels in these portions of the image. It will allow you to do secondary color corrections on particular areas of the image. + a huge amount of other stuff. The best way to understand the difference is to have a play with it. If you have a copy of After Effects, it is included for free :)

Interestingly, it is also available for purchase as a Premiere Pro plugin though I don't know of many people doing this.

Some people also like using After Effects because it does a very good quality final render. (Though I think the gap between AE and PPro has closed quite a bit in the past couple of years)
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wow that does sound powerful. So you can sort of target a person's face/skin tones by simple virtue of changing what the program sees as midtones and then color correct just the "mids" on the person's face without it necessarily then changing the color of background etc or something along those lines?
 
Peter Dmitriyev said:
wow that does sound powerful. So you can sort of target a person's face/skin tones by simple virtue of changing what the program sees as midtones and then color correct just the "mids" on the person's face without it necessarily then changing the color of background etc or something along those lines?
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Yeah that could possibly work, though usually many other things will also fall into that midtone value area. You would be better off using color finess to do a secondary color correction where you specifically select the skin tones (via hue, lightness, saturation) and then modifying those selected values to suit your needs. ie, you could desaturate those selected skin tones or push their hue towards something else.

Hope that helps :)
 
Another reason for doing some of the color correction in AE is because of all other the tools you have available....you can create and animate elaborate masks for example for certain secondary corrections...
 
You might also consider Magic Bullet Colorista II. It's a plug-in from Red Giant Software and a separate purchase. It now works quite well in both Premiere Pro CS 5.5 and AE CS 5.5. That would make advanced color grading within Premiere Pro quite viable.

- Oliver
 
Yes Colorista II is a must....simply my favorite plugin. It gets you 90% of the way there!
 
Yeah, I second Colorista II. Color Finesse is not really well integrated into AE and it's slooow.

If you need more than Colorista II and the other tools in AE can do for you, move the final edit to a serious grading system like DaVinci Resolve.
 
This is all fantastic news for me to read, and thank you for sharing! I've got an edited feature sitting in front of me right now, and I was wondering how complex I could let things get in CS5 before it either slowed to a crawl or became unstable. In my own experience, stability is rock-solid for the most part, but lag can be a concern.

I do have a few questions on points others have touched on here:

First, since others have stated it works for a project the size of a feature film, I'm thinking of doing dynamic link between my edit in PP and AE (replace with AE comp). Would it be better to put scenes into individual AE files, or have them all in one large AE project? I'll be doing a reasonable amount of VFX work and the usual grading (more on that below). Curious, as I've had very large AE projects that start to lag - in one particular instance when I trigger a RAM preview with multiple background instances of AE running, it takes a while for those background instances to load the project file and start rendering.

Second, for grading. I see two possibilities here:

1. Grade in AE using ColorFinesse, since it's a great tool, and AE has advantages over PP for grading with adjustment layers, etc. In this case, since ColorFinesse isn't color-managed (that I can tell...), how do I ensure an accurate end result? It also doesn't seem to play nicely with a linear working space in the AE project settings. What do y'all do to ensure accurate color when using it?

2. Grade in PP using the CUDA-accelerated color correction tools. This would obviously be nice and fast, assuming the linked AE comps are all pre-rendered once VFX is complete. Is the quality of the CUDA effects up to par, for a 32-bit float bitdepth? Has anyone tried this or similar CUDA-accelerated workflow on a large project and had good success? I'd like to produce the highest quality final render to create deliverables from.

Thanks for sharing any experiences you've had with these things. I've been following PP and AE for quite some time, and am incredibly impressed with the toolset. It's my go-to suite for most projects right now.

- Aaron
 
Hi Aaron,

If you employ the Dynamic Link, then you get timeline from PPro as a single composition into AE. However, if you use Import > Import Premiere Pro Project, you can import the individual R3D clips into AE as well enabling you to adjust the files individually.

What come to color grading, do you mean ColorFinesse did not allow color-management with R3D-files with linear working space? The reason to ask is, AE assigns automatically Rec. 709 to R3D files. For further information, see this

http://reduser.net/forum/showthread...lor-Management&p=787590&viewfull=1#post787590
 
Thanks for your input, Lauri!

Lauri Kettunen said:
Hi Aaron,
If you employ the Dynamic Link, then you get timeline from PPro as a single composition into AE. However, if you use Import > Import Premiere Pro Project, you can import the individual R3D clips into AE as well enabling you to adjust the files individually.
Click to expand...

Is it better to split the entire Premiere timeline across multiple AE projects, either with Dynamic Link or imported, to keep the AE project size smaller?

What come to color grading, do you mean ColorFinesse did not allow color-management with R3D-files with linear working space? The reason to ask is, AE assigns automatically Rec. 709 to R3D files. For further information, see this

http://reduser.net/forum/showthread...lor-Management&p=787590&viewfull=1#post787590
Click to expand...

So if I interpret this correctly, because the R3Ds are interpreted as Rec.709 coming in, as long as the display itself is calibrated it should display correctly, even though it's not going through any management in AE?
 
'Better' is subjective, but you once you have the whole thing you can always copy-paste the timeline in PPro into smaller parts to several timelines. Then you can import each timeline containing a smaller portion into AE. Another alternative, which might work out depending of the effects you use in AE, is to cut first say on a 2K timeline and import that into AE. Then copy-paste the 2K timeline into a 4K one, copy-paste the effects in AE to a 4K composition which is employed only to rendering and to export the output.

What comes to color management, that's my understanding. Though would be better if somebody from Adobe confirmed this.
 
Great info on the workflow, especially for color correction. I've been a long time FCP user about to start a feature that is very VFX heavy and considering switching to PP CS5.5 for the advantages of moving things back and forth easily with the VFX house - I'm more curious about deliverables - what are people's experiences having to deliver an offline cut to a post house for online/cc or outputting to HDCamSR or prepping for a theatrical film out - anyone used Premiere on this level yet?
 
Colorista II is quite good within PPro (CS5 and CS5.5). It uses some GPU acceleration, though it's no where near as fast as Adobe's native plugins. I don't think it uses CUDA acceleration. I usually leave throwing it on until the edit is complete as a result.

You should be able to grab a trial version from red giants website :)
 
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It works very well with PPro 5.5, but the GUI is very sluggish under CS 5 In PPro (but not in AE).
 
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