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Advice for new PC build for Redcine-X, CS5, etc

Tom Lowe

Tom Lowe

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If I was looking to build a new PC -- leaving the Red Rocket aside -- what are the most important components for fast demosaicing and rendering with R3D files? CPU? Will 6-core vs 4-core matter with Redcine-X? Is RAM more important? How about video card?

CS5 is suppossed to use CUDA acceleration, right?

I guess the bottom line is, should I wait for the new 6-core Gulftown i7? Will 24gb RAM be useful to me vs 12gb?

Thanks!
 
CPU does make a difference and we'll be improving that on RCX so it uses the cores more efficiently.

Memory is useful for buffering frames for playback but not until RCX is 64bit (hopefully soon also)

8 or 12GB is a good starting point.

CS5 uses ALOT of CUDA.
 
My 2c: Dell has already announced the 6-cores will be in their upcoming workstations. It's very likely Apple will announce new 6-core Mac Pros next Tues, etc.

To me, there are two ways to go:

CHEAP CPU: Buy a cheap i7 PC under $1000 and overclock it to 3.6ghz or so... it'd probably be the fastest RedCine-X machine you can buy right now. Faster than the 2.26 8-core Mac Pro at my work for sure. That is, until RedCine-X goes multithreaded.

EXPENSIVE CPU: If you want to go crazy, get a 6-core or 12-core Xeon-based Mac Pro for $3000 - $6000. Once you're buying $1000 CPUs, you might as well get a Mac Pro.

Mac Pros are actually good value - the only problem is that they don't make versions with the cheap high performance $300 CPUs.

I've historically gone the cheap CPU route and it's been great for me - lots of film outs done from renders on my $500 "Craigslist Special" PC.

This time I might get a Mac Pro simply because the timing is right:
1. I have some feature film grading and noise reduction work to render my way through on a pretty tight deadline - and I have apps that actually can use all of the cores
2. I have a friend who I've promised to help out with 3D rendering for his awesome short by lending him my computer - and he REALLY needs the cores
3. It'll be right after the Apple announcement (of you're going to buy a Mac, either get a refurb or buy it soon after they're announced, because they don't drop prices mid-cycle)
4. I'm writing some apps that XCode is handy for

Will do dual-boot of course.

Bruce Allen
www.boacinema.com
 
With CS5's mercury playback engine being CUDA dependant, you will want to wait on buying a video card untill Nvidia Launches their FERMI based cards on March 26th

The rumor is that they are 3x faster than the current top of the line NVIDIA GPU in CUDA operations.

There is going to be some awesome RT abilities in CS5, but I would hold off buying your super PC untill CS5 actually launches so you can get all compatibile hardware (and the latest hardware)

Also Intel's 6 core CPU will be another speed boost.
 
I'm thinking along the lines of a mid-range I7 CPU, gobs of ram, and Cuda GPU with CS5 as the ticket to an economical solution. LGA1156 setup with I7 870, as much ram as will fit and on board 4TB RAID 5 for footy with a 2TB system drive and a 2TB hot swap cartridge drive for backups. Add a decent midrangeCUDA card and the whole thing is around $2500.00 + software and monitors.
 
Doug Pasley said:
While this doesn't answer any questions about demosaicing and rendering with R3D files, I did run across this link for a PC editing system . . . .

http://www.videoguys.com/Guide/C/DI...re+i7/0xe07f65920351fbf3ed8f9892355dfda0.aspx

If you do go with Bruce's cheap CPU idea, make sure it has plenty of cooling.
Click to expand...

Been looking for something like this. Looks like a nice set up. Although unfortunately I know nothing about overclocking or cooling. Know what they are but not how to do it properly...needless to say, I wouldn't do it myself.
 
Yes guys! Been thinking, researching along these lines as well and for a CS5 PC only build, screw MAC and I own five of the over priced buggers. For cooling, the Zalman Z machine LQ 1000 is not cheap but reported as a quality value for a single chip ATX build. I love the sensors right there on the front of the unit. That's quality!
 
Premiere Pro CS5 loves Macs and PCs equally well.

CPU : For RED workflows CPU helps --- we do the R3D demosaic, decompress etc on the CPU today. Z800 with 16 core (or equivalent Mac) happily tackled 4 x R3D 4K at 2K to HD monitor. We haven't done a detailed test for 24 core with 4K full res (for rendering out for example) --- but I'm going to bet already that if you put in the extra cores we'll find good use for them.
I would definitely get dual socket for the extra system bandwidth, so I would go dual socket and lower per CPU clock rate if you're looking to save money.


GPU : GeForce 285 can get a lot done, but has a couple of drawbacks .... first is that it can get very hot if you run it hard all day (eg long edit and render sessions). So I think for RED I would go Quadro. If you can afford the 5800 we use the extra memory really well.

Memory : Minimum of 12GB for RED worfklows --- I prefer 16GB, and up that to 24GB or 32GB if you're wanting to flip around PS and AE a lot at the same time. AE scales very well with memory (eg for RAM Previews, layer caches etc) --- so if you're pushing AE really hard we expect that more is better ---- potentially much, much more.

We are seeing great early results with Fermi --- and should have an update for the GeForce 480 in the near future. We also hope to get Quadro Fermi support in place pretty promptly.

Before we get the CUDA optimization update turned on, CS5 should still work in normal mode --- so you if you're buying a new system today you can buy GeForce 480 and get "good" performance on day 1, and not be left waiting too long to get the full CUDA "wow" experience.
 
I just bought my i7 Build yesterday. I wanted to wait till scarlet was released but current projects forced me to speed up my render que. I bought a i7 930 on a gigibyte motherboard, 6gb of ddr 3 ram- soon to be 12. and a ati 5850. i know il be able to get a good price for 5850 if i need to sell it due to cs5's massive use of cuda. What i can tell you guys is HOLY CRAP. Im upgrading to from a Q6600 (2.4ghz quad oced to 3.4) and the diffence in the speed is unbelievable. The new cpu turned a 15 hour render on the old comp to 4.5 on the new! THEN I OVERCLOCKED IT TO 3.8ghz(stock = 2.8) And the number got halved! i went from 15 hours to 2.5 hours!!!!!! im in amazement. best 1600 bucks i ever spent. and that graphics card.... Holy crap can it ever pull its weight
 
A friend of mine is helping me build a 6-core Gulftown PC right now... i7 980X. He's gonna overclock it. 12 GB 1600mhz RAM. Some kind of super-fast Intel SDD for OS. I ordered a GTX 285, just because I could not find the 480 Fermi cards anywhere. Once those drop, the 285 is off to eBay.

Thanks to my friend's help, the cost of building this box is half of what I would have paid at Alienware, and the parts are actually superior to what I would have gotten from Alienware (much better SSD).
 
No, ATI cards can't be used sorry. Right now, the cheapest option is the GTX285 which works very well!

Tom, your PC is going to rock :)

HTH

Paul
 
Tom Lowe said:
A friend of mine is helping me build a 6-core Gulftown PC right now... i7 980X. He's gonna overclock it. 12 GB 1600mhz RAM. Some kind of super-fast Intel SDD for OS. I ordered a GTX 285, just because I could not find the 480 Fermi cards anywhere. Once those drop, the 285 is off to eBay.

Thanks to my friend's help, the cost of building this box is half of what I would have paid at Alienware, and the parts are actually superior to what I would have gotten from Alienware (much better SSD).
Click to expand...

Tom, when your up and running shoot us your parts list!
I'd love a Quadro-Plex but running lower-cost dual/quad/280s in the separate enclosure.
Upgrade as time goes on at a reasonable price point. Dare to dream.
 
Tom.Wong said:
i believe they said that SLI is not supported for mercury playback or cuda acceleration at this time. (key words, at this time) we might be seeing QUAD SLI systems soon enough enhancing your NLE's

http://www.maximumpc.com/article/news/evga_launches_4way_sli_motherboard



can you feel the POWAH?
Click to expand...

Actually SLI is where I have had my latest (nervous?) break down as well guys. I have finally decided (almost/Kind of) that I will go back to the drawing board basing a (virtual) build around the Supermicro SC747TG case which really is a 747 among cases! The problem is deciding whether or not to go SLI which leads me to even question INTEL vs. AMD for a dual CPU board. I feel like a dog chasing his tail. Woof!
 
I just built a i7 with 12 gigs of ram. windows 7 Pro SSD for the OS, Atto raid with 4 1.5 TB HD's, Raid 0, Quadro FX 4800, Red Rocket, CS4, waiting on 5.
 
Grant Goss said:
I just built a i7 with 12 gigs of ram. windows 7 Pro SSD for the OS, Atto raid with 4 1.5 TB HD's, Raid 0, Quadro FX 4800, RED Rocket™™™, CS4, waiting on 5.
Click to expand...

Hey Grant, this is very interesting to me especially since you chose to go Quadro FX4800 (but not two cards for an SLI set up because it's even more expensive right?) and included the RED Rocket™™. Which i7 did you settle on?

I had been basing my build decisions around a Supermicro MBD-X8DAH LGA 1366 because even though I knew I'd be stuck using 1300 Ram, the board had 18 DIMM Slots. With a 6 x 4 Patriot configuration I figured I could save money on a pair of E5530 Xeon 2.4, use one NVIDIA QuadroFX1700 for basics and have a pretty viable and expandable system since the board will also take the six core Xeons when the price point becomes more favorable.

Now some may think this is still an OK build but this board supports crossfire but not SLI... This is what gives me pause when AMD already has six core chips and a board that supports SLI... Unfortunately I've read a lot of AMD tech complaints so I worry about going this route.

I feel like my problem is that I want to be able to upload, playback, edit and down convert from DPX but I do want to run and do some advanced 3d using 3d max or C4d besides the CS5. We seem to be at a cross roads in tech where we have any number of solutions which will provide (various) degrees of success. The SLI can (possibly) advance rendering by close to 50% so it is a serious consideration combined with 1300 vs 1600 Ram and six vs. quad core/Intel vs. AMD... This is a great site for gaining insight...
 
I had been basing my build decisions around a Supermicro MBD-X8DAH LGA 1366 because even though I knew I'd be stuck using 1300 Ram, the board had 18 DIMM Slots.
Click to expand...

I built my machine using the same MB. Be aware that it is larger than an E-ATX MB. You will need a case from Supermicro to hold it. It is about 1.5" wider.

I have a pair of 6-core CPUs. (X5680s) I have 24 GB of DDR3 ECC RAM, the NVIDIA FX5800 with SDI, an Intel SSD and an ioXtreme SSD. I have been using the Adaptec 5085 SAS/RAID card but am looking to move to the upcoming ATTO 6 GBps R680 SAS/RAID card. I also have a RR and a 1394b/eSATA PCIe card.

Right now I run SCRATCH on the machine. I will install CS5 as soon as it ships.
 
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