7D - get tack sharpness out of your head

[Matthew Bennett]

Been shooting the 7D since I got it a few months ago - and I've now fully realized that I can never actually be in focus on anything in the frame.

This is a bizarre headspace to get into - but now that I've trained myself (when shooting wides, wide dollies, etc.) to just go slightly off focus during all shots, the results are actually pretty good once you go all the way down the post path...

My (and many others from what I've read) main problem is repeating BG patterns like bricks, fine screens, etc. The red/blue color moire is just plain painful to look at after a while. It really draws the eye.

I did a test which I'll attempt to post here:

shot 1: tack focus on the BG bricks
shot 2: just off focus on the BG bricks

both shots downsampled to 720p, with unsharp mask added to the second to give the impression of sharpness...

Sharp focus through 10x bump-in

Slightly off:

 

[Jeff Kilgroe]

Have to agree here. Everyone thinks they need to be razor sharp and go for the L glass. I'm getting much better results with the softer EF-S 15-85 zoom and a couple of my Sigma lenses than with Canon L glass. For stills, sharp is the way to go, for line-skipping crappy H.264 video, a bit soft is a good thing. Hides some of that aliasing...

 

[Sarah C.]

hey question.. since I'm not a 7D shooter.. yet.

Is there any in-camera/pre-compression sharpening that is user-changable?

~s

 

[Roberto Lequeux]

Just contrast, and it won't fix the issues.

 

[Liam Hall]

Just contrast, and it won't fix the issues.

Sharpness is user defineable along with saturation, hue and a couple of other basic parameters. Sadly, moire and aliasing are not.

 

[Liam Hall]

I turn off sharpness and set contrast to zero for video. I also knock back the saturation a couple of clicks which seems to help a lot.

 

[Sanjin Jukic]

Picture Style: How Do You Choose?

Picture Style: How Do You Choose?

LINK>>>

 

[Liam Hall]

Sanjin, to get more dynamic range you need to knock that contrast setting down - you can always put it back in later

 

[Sanjin Jukic]

Sanjin, to get more dynamic range you need to knock that contrast setting down - you can always put it back in later

Thanks Liam,

now I'm experimenting with it.

Also btw., did you try out with this profile?

Canon 7d picture style with cine-gamma (s) curve – free download>>>

 

[Liam Hall]

Thanks Liam,

now I'm experimenting with it.

Also btw., did you try out with this profile?

Canon 7d picture style with cine-gamma (s) curve – free download>>>

No, not yet, but it's exactly the way to go. I was going to make my own S-curve, so that's great. I'll give it go

 

[Rob Ruffo]

This is exactly why I think the 5D/7D are excellent experimentation tools, excellent film school tools (truly, truly awesome for that), and 100% awful crappy garbage pro tools that could end your career.

To think that some people said these were "Red Killers". That's really funny.

 

[Liam Hall]

This is exactly why I think the 5D/7D are excellent experimentation tools, excellent film school tools (truly, truly awesome for that), and 100% awful crappy garbage pro tools that could end your career.

To think that some people said these were "Red Killers". That's really funny.

Good luck with that attitude Rob, you'll need it.

These DSLR's fill a gap, before Scarlet hits the street. They are just a tool. To demean users of these tools in the way you do is as pointless as it is rude.

I'm off to Thailand next week with a 7D and an EX1 tucked in my carry-on and after twenty-five years in this business I'm pretty sure it won't be a career ending decision.

 

[Rick Presas]

I'm off to Thailand next week with a 7D and an EX1 tucked in my carry-on and after twenty-five years in this business I'm pretty sure it won't be a career ending decision.

Hey Liam, how does footage from the EX and the 7D compare? I'd imagine that even though its a cmos sensor the EX doesnt have the aliasing and moire issues?

 

[Liam Hall]

Hey Liam, how does footage from the EX and the 7D compare? I'd imagine that even though its a cmos sensor the EX doesnt have the aliasing and moire issues?

If you play to the strengths of each camera they compare very favorably. EX1 is a good work horse, whilst the 7D can get you those 'X' factor shots.

They cut together fine. You need to grade carefully, but so far so good. Both produce very clean images with lots of detail and good dynamic range.

I've even used the 7D with digi-beta, which whilst challenging still proved very effective. I might be able to post an example later this week, if the client approves the film.

 

[Jon Chema]

Have you guys messed with any of the scene files that you can download? ie.) Superflat, Panalog (sp?), and Marvel

I've gotten great results with SuperFlat. Basically records a very RAW-esc image that allows a lot of play in post.

 

[Rick Presas]

EX1 is a good work horse, whilst the 7D can get you those 'X' factor shots.

Do elaborate?

 

[Rob Ruffo]

Good luck with that attitude Rob, you'll need it.

These DSLR's fill a gap, before Scarlet hits the street. They are just a tool. To demean users of these tools in the way you do is as pointless as it is rude.

I'm off to Thailand next week with a 7D and an EX1 tucked in my carry-on and after twenty-five years in this business I'm pretty sure it won't be a career ending decision.

I was talking about cameras, not people. People are not their cameras.

I stand behind the claim that people are much better off with a cheaper HD camcorder and a good 35mm adapter. It won't cost much more.

Why? Real resolution, better codec, and MOIRE, which destroys so many shots it's not even funny. 5D/7D are fine if you're learning and a student - superb - but my clients would fire me for handing in footage with the problems so much 5D video has.

 

[Rob Ruffo]

Hey Liam, how does footage from the EX and the 7D compare? I'd imagine that even though its a cmos sensor the EX doesnt have the aliasing and moire issues?

No, the EX does not have aliasing isssues. You can shoot Venetian blinds with it at any distance (I've tried).

Many have measured actual resolution on both cams, and the EX1 has roughly 3x as much, being REAL full 1080p. The 7D is somewhere between 480p and 720p, same goes for the 5D.

CMOS does not cause aliasing - the Red is cmos - bad cam design does (or rather cam design optimized for stills not video).

CMSO does have a skew/jello problem, although the EX has roughly 2x teh read speed of a 5D and thsu 1/2 the jello. In real life this is not often a problem unless you do long whip pans and really poorly doen handheld and even then the audince will rarely notice. Aliasing is always at least somewhat of a problem - even in-focus skin is alised, casuing pores to look odd - as is softish resolution.

 

[Michael Hastings]

I stand behind the claim that people are much better off with a cheaper HD camcorder and a good 35mm adapter. It won't cost much more.

The point I think you are missing is that the 7D IS a good 35mm adapter - for $1700. And oh by the way is a pretty good still camera and buying one and using it for 9 mos to a year and then selling will probably only cost you a few hundred dollars. Doing the same with an EX1 will probably cost you $1500 or more and still won't have S35 DOF (oops, coulda bought a 7D). So for shots that need that shallow DOF it is probably fine and moire isn't likely to be a big issue. For those critical moire-inducing shots use a video camera - maybe a good prosumer one like the EX1, but in reality probably no one could be sure if you shot it with a Canon HF20 (on sale now for $549.00 - 1080P 24Mbps H.264).

And for those higher end clients that can't tolerate the foibles of working with these systems - rent a RED1 - there's 7000 of them and rent cheap and they are going to get even cheaper in the next 6 months to a year.