6G SDI on future RED Camera?

[Patrick Lavaud]

Is there any plan to have a 6G SDI (or 12G SDI) on future RED weapon camera ? (the 8K one maybe?)
I guess everything will have to follow, like 6G SDI wireless transmitter from Teradek for example, where are we on this technology development ? Can we expect it anytime soon ?

 

[Blair S. Paulsen]

That's not as simple a question as it appears. Last I checked, neither 6G or 12G SDI is a proper SMPTE standard - they were propagated by BlackMagic Design alone. For starters, SDI cabling is not designed for more than 3G due to technical issues with signal integrity and cable run limitations.

FWIW, I see the future of professional interconnect standards moving to tactical optical fiber with locking ports. In the meantime, most high bandwidth applications are using multi-cable solutions like 1.5G SDI x4 or 3G SDI x2 for UHD/4K signal transport.

Cheers - #19

 

[Christopher*Seguine]

6G SDI = SMPTE ST-2081
12G SDI = SMPTE ST-2082
24G SDI = SMPTE ST-2083

Both optical and coax interfaces are defined.

BM was just one of the first to use it. ARRI uses 6g as well.
Sony F55 uses quad 3G but also has 4k output on the body via HDMI 2.0, FS7/FS5 have 4k output viia HDMI 2.0

Red One having HDMI in addition to HDSDI was pretty forward thinking back in 2007, but going on 10 years later and the same outputs...

 

[Blair S. Paulsen]

Thanks for the notes Christopher. If modern, single cable SDI implementations can reliably carry 6, 12 or even 24G that's great news - it's not like I enjoy pulling 4 cables instead of 1. I haven't been on a show yet that used anything beyond 3G, but that could be more about infrastructure upgrades being expensive rather than technical limitations.

If anyone knows of any studios in SoCal that have migrated to 6G or higher SDI, facility wide, please share. Last time the subject came up at a SMPTE gathering, most of the chuckles were about how "perfect" the signal chain would have to be for reliable 6G runs greater than 50' over coax - followed by guffaws over how soon their bosses might spend the coin to upgrade to optical fiber...

NAB 2016 - lots of 6G SDI products?!?

Cheers - #19

 

[Christopher*Seguine]

No I don't see much need for higher than 3G in facilities/studio distribution (unless your NHK) , everything is data centric now so IP is the better choice.

For live productions, hybrid fiber is the logical choice - supports up to 40g, the Ikegami 8k cameras use this now.

For local device interconnects is where 6G/12G/24G make sense. Arri has been using 6G forever to send raw data to a codex.

No 4k monitoring output from the body on a 6k/8k weapon is a pretty significant omission, could have at least done 4k via hdmi, even toy cameras have that.

 

[Blair S. Paulsen]

(snip) No 4k monitoring output from the body on a 6k/8k weapon is a pretty significant omission, could have at least done 4k via hdmi, even toy cameras have that.

I can imagine that RED was concerned that some folks would use that color decimated UHD/4K HDMI signal for recording or live switches, thereby damaging their reputation. Even HDMI2.0 has limited bandwidth, let alone HDMI1.4a, that dictates color under sampling at 2160 rasters. Yes, UHD/4K over HDMI would be useful for driving on set monitors - but once that horse is out of the barn, how do you prevent people from recording that weak sauce?

A RedCast module for DSMC2 that can spit out 2160P with 12bit, 4:4:4 color (or at least 10bit, 4:2:2) is expected to drop at NAB. As a reference, the DSMC1 RedCast model is $7K and suitable for live switches at UHD resolution (not DCI 4K) at up to 59.94fps.

FWIW, a next generation RedCast module that can meet the requirements of UHD broadcast infrastructure - and allow live recording of video signal (vs data over ethernet tether) - is much desired. That said, it's overkill if you just want to have a UHD monitor tap and don't need the rest.

Perhaps a "pro" expander that includes an HDMI2.0 monitor tap, legit TC, XLRs, etc...

Cheers - #!9