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«5D Mark III outperforms Scarlet»

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Mike P. said:
The only reason for blowing up the 1080p-2k downscale to 400% is to show that the deliverables (Scarlet 2k downscaled to 1080p vs. 5Dmk3 at "1080p") look about the same. Which makes sense, since anything more than 1080p is NOT in the average household and not realistically available via streaming (yet). Granted, 4k downscaled to 1080p would presumably look much better (which is why it wasn't included)...

I get REDuser being defensive when things like this come up, but you have to look at it for what it is: trying to encourage 5D users by saying they get somewhat comparable results (to varying degrees) with the only camera they can afford (in this case, the 5Dmk3.) There's no point getting bent out of shape over it. Obligatory car analogy: If someone claims on the road their civic and your ferrari go the same max speed, it's technically true (going past the speed limit is illegal, right?) You wouldn't get pissed off, you'd smile/laugh at the irony (but still love the fact that you have a ferrari.) Currently the speed limit is 1080p, and more often than not, compressed 1080p, so the results can be comparable... of course you'd have to ignore 13+ stops, HDRx, and r3d RAW, but ignorance is bliss.

The real reason people should be upset is why this is even posted here... You wouldn't go to an Alexa forum/page to look up RED information, right?
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I understand what you mean Mike and this is not an attack to you but 1080p is not the limit when you can finish and deliver in 4k and 2k. Digital cinema camera used to mean something around here.
 
I wonder if he can test the reason I bought a RED camera: how much work it gets me. It's not worth my time looking at that test because I know the Scarlet will move me faster. Period.

As long as every producer wants to shoot with RED (even if only a fraction of them can say why), it was the right choice for me even if the 5D is 10 times better. I look forward to the time when I have the luxury to choose the camera. Until then it's this one.
 
Finishing a test to 1080P is fine if that's your intended market, but I don't understand the legitimacy of the test if they are starting out by shooting 2K cropped mode on the Scarlet before conversion to 1080P. Particularly compared to a full-frame sensor image like from the Canon 5D, the depth of field is going to be radically different compared to the 2K area of the Scarlet sensor. To be fair, he should have also cropped the Canon image in half and then converted it to 1080P.
 
The 2k test is fatally flawed by suffering from some obscene Chromatic Aberration. A significant amount of the RED resolution is being lost to that.

That being said, I think the 4k -> 1080p -> 4k test vs 1080p -> 4k test isn't a bad one since it actually demonstrates well in that shot how much better the RED is... even as a 4k camera. The 5D MkIII is softer in the first test--showing off why you want to supersample.

In a slightly unrelated comment... it would appear that the 5D has a stronger UV filter.
 
This test is ridiculous. No one is going to shoot a Scarlet a 2k if not to get a longer telephoto shot with a lens or to get slow motion at 60fps. If the intent is to shoot slow motion, the comparison should be Scarlet at 2k 60fps vs 5D at 720 60p. To compare the 1080p output of these cameras the test should be Scarlet at its full resolution the. Downscale to 1080p vs the 5D, which is using its full sensor downscaled to 1080p.

Really disappointed with cinema 5d.
 
I agree with Sergio... and following this train of thought (full 5DMkIII sensor vs Scarlet full sensor) - wouldn't the HDMI/SDI output via a Pix (or similar) have been a better test?

It's so weird to have these tests - all to crank up hits on the interweb... and really only serving to confuse people.
 
Ok here is a test. I took the 5D Mk3 footage. Match graded the Scarlet-X footage (RG3/RC3). Downscaled the Scarlet-X 4k footage to 1080p using 'Bicubic Sharper' and then sharpened the 5D as well. Even with the 4k -> HD conversion the Scarlet maintains noticeably more resolution. Especially before sharpening the 5D MK3

Scarletv5DMk3.png


More proof that even if you only ever use Scarlet as an HD camera. It's still beating out the alternatives.
 
LOL, well it's a nice little test pointed in one direction and not moving around. I like all of the little tests that go up against the RED cameras... the GH2, and others that use a single 5-10 second clip pointed in one direction and not moving at all, and then the sheeple saying oh you can't tell the difference, lol. People are always going to do stuff like this, but you know what.... It doesn't make it true.
The SEAL pieces shot on ACT of VALOR were pretty amazing (on the 5dMII), but were also talking about millions of dollars in budget, hollywood post production, lighting that could ignite a WMD, and directors with many years of experience, and the rest of the movie was shot on film, Alexa I believe. I say let em say whatever their going to say about whatever camera they want, doesn't mean I'm going to throw my RED camera away, or my dreams to posses many RED cameras.
 
Well at least he pulled his "5D defeats Scarlet" title. :lol:

It is most likely just a publicity stunt as said. But unfortunately that doesn't mitigate the fact that such misleading and poorly conceived tests engender a new generation
of arguments. Already enough people who talk shit about RED and have absoluutely no idea what they're talking about. And then we cop the "Fan boys" slur if we choose to respond.

I guess if your blogs called Cinema 5D, and the new 5D has been getting pretty slammed around the traps, you'd need to try and engender a positive article.
But there is so much positive about good images at these kind of price points, that I find this tact a disappointing one.

Personally, i think tests against the old 5D, D800, GH2, and the Fs100 would be the clearly the most relevant and valuable. As that's what I would be very interested in if I was buying my camera around the lower end price points. Instead this just comes off as a pretty cheap and nasty stunt and unfortunately lowers my opinion of Cinema 5D.
 
Sascha Rossier said:
Another sweet little comparison.
http://www.cinema5d.com/news/?p=10288
;-)
Do they ignore the H264-compression vs. RAW Power on purpose in all these tests?



I vote for another ultra-relevant criteria in those comparisons:
The Drop Test. RED "The Tank" Scarlet would outperform them all ;-))
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The website is called CINEMA 5D and has links at the bottom of that article to an affiliate 5D sales program with B and H, adorama and amazon...

When there is any financial interest at stake you can throw out the window any premise of "fair comparison"... whether its politics or cameras... So of course they are gonna try to upsell their main source of income... they would be stupid not to ;)
 
a better compare is 4k

a better compare is 4k

I didn't even bother going to the site to see the stupid test.
But if someone does ( and they eventually will ) compare the five thousand dollar JVC four K camera with the Scarlet, then I'll take a look. If you sniff around, you can find stills from it on flicker.
I don't dare post a link, the last time I did the thread was unceremoniously closed within 5 min.
But 5D talk and c300 talk is allowed all day long. I want to understand.


Gavin Greenwalt said:
Ok here is a test. I took the 5D Mk3 footage. Match graded the Scarlet-X footage (RG3/RC3). Downscaled the Scarlet-X 4k footage to 1080p using 'Bicubic Sharper' and then sharpened the 5D as well. Even with the 4k -> HD conversion the Scarlet maintains noticeably more resolution. Especially before sharpening the 5D MK3

Scarletv5DMk3.png


More proof that even if you only ever use Scarlet as an HD camera. It's still beating out the alternatives.
Click to expand...
 
I saw this a few days ago. This test seems a bit irrelevant. Raw 2K, 3K, 4K and 5K is obviously higher end than h.264 1080p. I don't think you can really compare the two. In my opinion HDSLRs for motion right now are prosumer tools at best that work well for many pro applications. I'm sure that most people on here can bet better results out of a Scarlet at 2K than a MkIII any day. I own a 7D, a few EX1s, and a Scarlet, and IMO they are all different animals and none of them are really perfect for all situations.
 
Les Dittert said:
I don't dare post a link, the last time I did the thread was unceremoniously closed within 5 min.
But 5D talk and c300 talk is allowed all day long. I want to understand.
Click to expand...
I think the difference is a Red Camera is involved in the Test. You can do comparisons as long as Red footage is involved.
 
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