1888 x 1062 WTF???

[Bruce Allen]

So once again, I find myself in FCP land, helping a friend out with his RED feature so we can make Vancouver film fest.

We're trying to output a ProRes444 Quicktime (1920x1080, 23.98 fps) to HDCAM tape (PsF).

I get a call - "hey we can't output the file - it is 1888x1062".

What the hell? So I look at the Quicktime and lo and behold in resolution it says: 1920x1080 (1888 x 1062)

If I go into Properties on the Quicktime there is a "Conform Aperture to:" setting which I can change - it's set to "Clean" and when I change it to "Classic" I then see more of the picture.

A quick Google reveals this 1888x1062 thing is part of some kind of new Quicktime 7.1 "feature" that hides stuff out of title safe.

In FCP it still sees it as 1920x1080 no matter what the Conform Aperture setting. But there's a yellow render bar.

I'm confused as heck - anyone hit this before?

I'm doing a 3-pronged attack over the weekend:
1. render out a ProRes422 file from this one and hope the re-render fixes it
2. load up the FCP project with the yellow render bar and render it
3. make an Avid DNxHD file so I can use Media Composer to output it (which I never have problems with)

Any other suggestions? I think Apple heard me cursing them.

Bruce Allen
www.boacinema.com

 

[Nick Shaw]

Quicktime 'lies' about image sizes. Similar to the way it will say a widescreen MPEG file is 720x404, so as to pretend it has square pixels for apps that don't understand non-square.

FCP tags files to be shown in QuickTime player the same way they would be seen on a consumer TV, ie. with the over-scan cut off. Personally I think in a digital world over-scan should be confined to the dustbin of history, as 'dirty' analogue edges should be a thing of the past!

I suspect somebody may have hit 'save' in QuickTime player after changing settings. There should be no problem opening a 1920x1080 QuickTime in FCP, if it is an original file exported from FCP. If it has been adjusted and saved in QuickTime player there are often issues. Was it generated from an FCP time-line, and if so can you re-export?

 

[James T Mather]

Yet another terrific hidden extra that no-one wants. Like the way quicktime makes pictures muddy due to it's odd processing of the alpha channel or itunes takes up tons of drive space with hidden files. Genius

 

[Jonas Rejman]

Can you check, if the project AND/OR the clips in the timeline are possible on fieldsettings "upper" ? You do this via rightclick + "item properties"

I had the exact same problem. FCP interpreted the progressive footage as interlaced and exported it into quicktimes that showed as 1920x1080 (1888x1062) in info.

You have to change every clip from "odd" to "none" and the best thing is, that FCP cannot do this in a batch!!

To fix this in a whole timeline, you have to export the timeline into an XML.
Then, in a texteditor find and replace the fieldsettings from "upper" (or "even") to "none".

Then, import the xml again, you should have no fields in the timeline, and no fields in any clip inside the timeline and the export should be again only 1920x1080 without the brackets.

I loved this "feature" ... ;-D

 

[Nick Shaw]

…FCP interpreted the progressive footage as interlaced and exported it into quicktimes that showed as 1920x1080 (1888x1062) in info.

That shouldn't be possible with 23.98fps footage like Bruce has. FCP defaults to assuming interlaced for 25fps for 29.97fps, which can cause issues, but 23.98 and 24fps can only be progressive.

 

[Ben Brainerd]

That shouldn't be possible with 23.98fps footage like Bruce has. FCP defaults to assuming interlaced for 25fps for 29.97fps, which can cause issues, but 23.98 and 24fps can only be progressive.

Yes, but this is *FCP* we're talking about. I've had it do things to footage that you would never think possible. (Betcha didn't think it was possible to play 30p back at 24p with no speedup/pulldown/whatever? Yeah, neither did I. And neither did the quicktime layer, which kernel-panicked right afterwards)

I had a similar problem a while back and to be honest, I think I just swore at it until it started working again.

Who's having the problem? If your post-house/whoever's dumping to take is trying to do it via QT Player, smack them upside the head. Jumping to Avid for the dump to tape might be a valid solution too.

 

[Alan Greene]

If you're using Compressor to export (either on its own, or when sending to Compressor from FCP), be sure to uncheck "Add clean aperture information" in the encoder tab. That will export it at the proper size and won't default to displaying the video with cropped edges.

Another option that should just go away forever.

 

[Bruce Allen]

THANK YOU so much, guys! I fought with this damn thing till 2AM then went to sleep. Woke up and saw all of these awesome comments.

BTW, over night I rendered a 422HQ ProRes file - which loads into FCP with no yellow bars, so I'm assuming that will work. Since we're only going to HDCAM, quality difference shouldn't be noticeable.

If you're using Compressor to export (either on its own, or when sending to Compressor from FCP), be sure to uncheck "Add clean aperture information" in the encoder tab. That will export it at the proper size and won't default to displaying the video with cropped edges.

I wasn't using Compressor (I was using FCP) - but will try simply sending the FCP output through Compressor with that "Add clean aperture information" unchecked to make another ProRes4444 master. We lose one generation of compression but that's worth it I think. Thank you.

I suspect somebody may have hit 'save' in QuickTime player after changing settings. There should be no problem opening a 1920x1080 QuickTime in FCP, if it is an original file exported from FCP. If it has been adjusted and saved in QuickTime player there are often issues. Was it generated from an FCP time-line, and if so can you re-export?

Yes, it was generated from a FCP timeline. All I was trying to do was bring a render from FCP (that played realtime on my system at 1920x1080) into their copy of FCP - and lay it off to tape.

Who's having the problem? If your post-house/whoever's dumping to take is trying to do it via QT Player, smack them upside the head.

It's a well-known output place in LA. They're trying to just play it out of FCP. They included their FCP project they made to output this on the drive I got back - it seems to be set up correctly.

I had a similar problem a while back and to be honest, I think I just swore at it until it started working again.

Yep, am trying that too

Jumping to Avid for the dump to tape might be a valid solution too.

Yep, that's my backup.

Bruce Allen
www.boacinema.com

 

[andrewhake]

Nothing anyone has mentioned hear is a feature/issue with QuickTime, it is user intervention or lack there of that has resulted in an issue. HDCAM isn't a square pixel format. | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-definition_television#Notation

 

[Bruce Allen]

Nothing anyone has mentioned hear is a feature/issue with QuickTime, it is user intervention or lack there of that has resulted in an issue. HDCAM isn't a square pixel format. | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-definition_television#Notation

I am fully aware of the resolution of HDCAM. But the deck does that conversion. You're supposed to feed it a full 1920x1080 signal. At least that's what I've done the last 15 times I've outputted a HDCAM. This particular 1888 x 1062 thing is some kind of new Quicktime / FCP screwup.

BTW, thanks again guys - I recompressed everything using "Clean Aperture OFF" Quicktime settings with Compressor and that seems to be fixing everything. FCP doesn't show yellow bars when I bring it in. No stupid 1888x1062 setings. Of course it added another generation of compression but hey, it works.

Bruce Allen
www.boacinema.com

 

[Sidney L. Plaut]

I think (because im not 100% sure) that when you choose Export "Quicktime conversion" in FCP - There is a difference when you select 1920x1080(HD) and 1920x1080 "16x9". one of them results in the "1880x..."

 

[Ben Brainerd]

I think (because im not 100% sure) that when you choose Export "Quicktime conversion" in FCP - There is a difference when you select 1920x1080(HD) and 1920x1080 "16x9". one of them results in the "1880x..."

Ooh, yeah. I think we have a winner here. I can almost guarantee you that's what I did back when I had the problem, forgetting the cardinal rule: Quicktime is for previews, Compressor is for finals.


Oh, and Andrew? It's *REALLY* bad form to wander in here and say "It's all your fault, you're doing it wrong" without any more backup than a Wikipedia article and, more importantly, a suggestion for a fix.