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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Peter and the Primes

I'll take a shot of the insides a bit.. they come with custom labels to stick on the foam to call out the focal lengths, and each hole is adjustable so you can carry any combination of primes including the 18mm or the 300mm.

They are really sturdy.. almost every piece is a notch up from the standard Innerspace cases with lots of exclusive features. $650 for the case.

Ill start a new thread about the cases in a bit, I don't want to hijack this thread, thanks all.
 
Thanks for the explanations guys. Shawn, that makes a lot of sense when you put it that way. Are there NDs with IR coating out there? What would be the best way to cut light and prevent bouncing IR when using RPPs?

I imagine we might have to stack NDs quite often, on top of the Polarizer which might be a permanent thing for the snow... so what would be the best way to get the iris open in sunny days? Four stages? IR in the front, ND, ND, Pola?

Though I guess the added stops will help us get a rich R1 image even when slightly overexposed. :)
 
Roberto, better to not stack NDs and just use the strength you need. I already have them in .6, .9, 1.2 and 1.5. Since they are now suggesting that the RPPs don't need IR, then 2 stage is fine, circ pola on the front then ND in the back. When would you possibly need more light knocked down then what a circ pola+1.5ND can do?
 
I don't have a MB and filters of my own so I haven't played around enough to know what would be the case.

I guess the worst case scenario would be if we wanted to use f/1.8 for a few inserts of skis, a shovel and other objects stabbing into the snow. Not likely, but it a Pola + 1.5 ND were enough for mid day sun with no clouds then there is no issue.

However I guess the best case scenario would be if the Pola in the front had IR treatment, correct?
 
Paul Leeming said:
It's a lens property. Just so no one thinks this makes the RPPs somehow inferior, Arri Ultra-Primes exhibit the same type of bokeh:

Karuta_Japonica_PV_K001_C048_080602_0000.jpg


HTH

Paul
Click to expand...

I don't see it in my UPs, and I don't see it your image. Can you clarify?

M
 
I see it all over that image. Look around the third to the right, and more visible with the column behind it.

I wonder what makes it more visible? Could it be the wall as opposed to green on green like on Viscera's grab? And distance to the foreground object?
 
Paul Leeming said:
It's a lens property. Just so no one thinks this makes the RPPs somehow inferior, Arri Ultra-Primes exhibit the same type of bokeh
Click to expand...

Thanks, Paul.
I understand that it's a lens property. I just never saw it that explicitly.
:skep:
 
I think what we are talking about is the strange multiple parallel out of focus lines that seem to surround the branches--not the general quality of the bokah itself...

I'm assuming it's from the branch moving in the breeze during exposure....and maybe the texture of the wall or compression artifacts or all of the above.

But it caught my eye when I saw it. It made me wonder if there is an unusual optical effect induced as the element move and the image goes out of focus. I don't see this on other RPP shots, nor have I seen it with UPs, so I assume it's not an issue. In general I love the look of the RPPs.

M

View attachment 12758
 
Mark you see this same effect happening in the Master prime shot that was posted as well.

Here's my weak attempt to explain this: What is happening is the out of focus branch is actually acting like an optical element in the light path. So it's "bending" (diffracting) the out of focus light entering the lens. By doing this it actually changes the point at which that light focuses. So even though the branch is 2 feet away, it's bending the light coming from something 15 feet away to make it apear to the lens like it's 11 feet away (made up highly untechnical numbers).

Similar to how the Iris in a lens bends the light a little and creates shapes in the specular highlights in the out of focus region of the lens. Depending on the number and style of optical elements (I tend to see this more with aspherics) the effect can be exaggerated by some lenses (see Voigtlander 40mm f1.4 M mount lens)
 
Mike is right, this has nothing to do with a "movement of the branch during exposure". It always happens with narrow objects in the light-path that are out of focus...
This in reality is Bokeh (or more precisely one of its variations/effects)...

:) Peter
 
Blue fringing on RPPS

Blue fringing on RPPS

The only thing that worries me (and it really does worry me) is the blue fringing/ aberations clearly evident on the highlights of the car bonnets in the car yard. They are also evident in the pink flowers seen in the "RPP vs my vintage glass" thread, which was shot on the 300mm RPP.

I was playing with that lens on a RED ONE in Red's store in LA a few weeks ago, and the blue fringing was there around a correctly-exposed white computer mouse I shot on the desk. Had to close down a stop or two from wide open to get rid of it.

I'm sure someone will reply "that's easily fixable in post" but in the real world, that doesn't happen.
 
Mark Pedersen said:
I think what we are talking about is the strange multiple parallel out of focus lines that seem to surround the branches--not the general quality of the bokah itself...

I'm assuming it's from the branch moving in the breeze during exposure....and maybe the texture of the wall or compression artifacts or all of the above.

But it caught my eye when I saw it. It made me wonder if there is an unusual optical effect induced as the element move and the image goes out of focus. I don't see this on other RPP shots, nor have I seen it with UPs, so I assume it's not an issue. In general I love the look of the RPPs.

M

View attachment 12758
Click to expand...

Yeah, bokeh is a very complex thing but often people only look at certain types of bokeh. Object shape, transparency, distance, focus distance, aperture, location in frame, etc. all create different effects. Some lenses that produce one type of bokeh known can produce a completely different type of bokeh depending on the circumstances.
 
Mike Prevette said:
Mark you see this same effect happening in the Master prime shot that was posted as well.

Here's my weak attempt to explain this: What is happening is the out of focus branch is actually acting like an optical element in the light path. So it's "bending" (diffracting) the out of focus light entering the lens. By doing this it actually changes the point at which that light focuses. So even though the branch is 2 feet away, it's bending the light coming from something 15 feet away to make it apear to the lens like it's 11 feet away (made up highly untechnical numbers).

Similar to how the Iris in a lens bends the light a little and creates shapes in the specular highlights in the out of focus region of the lens. Depending on the number and style of optical elements (I tend to see this more with aspherics) the effect can be exaggerated by some lenses (see Voigtlander 40mm f1.4 M mount lens)
Click to expand...


Mike, that makes sense. You actually did a good job of explaining what I thought may be going on optically when I first looked at that shot. It would also explain why it wasn't apparent in other shots.

This is all taking me back to physics class and ripple tanks ;)

I'll put something up similar to this and see if I can reproduce with an UP.

M
 
Mark Pugh said:
The only thing that worries me (and it really does worry me) is the blue fringing/ aberations clearly evident on the highlights of the car bonnets in the car yard. They are also evident in the pink flowers seen in the "RPP vs my vintage glass" thread, which was shot on the 300mm RPP.

I was playing with that lens on a RED ONE in Red's store in LA a few weeks ago, and the blue fringing was there around a correctly-exposed white computer mouse I shot on the desk. Had to close down a stop or two from wide open to get rid of it.

I'm sure someone will reply "that's easily fixable in post" but in the real world, that doesn't happen.
Click to expand...
Mark, were you seeing that fringing during the live shot or in post? And if in post, which app were you using to process images? I think some of this could be related to processing.
 
Anyone at Red can walk into the store, point the camera at the mouse, open the iris, and see it. Comments from Red are welcome, given that the RPPs are carefully designed to avoid chromatic aberation on the Red. Can anyone clarify the cause of blue fringing?
 
Mark, which color space were you viewing in just out of curiosity? I'm not trying to infer that it's not there, it might very well be. CA is a tricky problem. But I'm curious what view you saw it in.
 
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