Free Energy Mylow Magnet Motor

[Gavin Greenwalt]

gotcha, are you saying that you don't watch videos? Even built a new one from scratch on camera, that somehow you still don't believe it?

I can come up with a clever system that would fake it and would be completely concealed.

That being said. I can plausibly believe that it actually works. The question is even scaled up will it generate more than negligible energy. And I suspect that even more powerful magnets would produce almost no additional energy.

Either way. If he (unlike the millions of other hoaxes out there) is real then I'll be seeing it pop up left and right before too long.

 

[Joseph Ward]

It's been done, you want me to start referencing patent numbers? Never mind that both Pike and Edison pioneered these wheeled designs for permanent magnet motors.

So Free Energy is real?

 

[MikeHedge]

Gavin. gotcha. ya. it will be a test to see if this could be attached to a generator and charge a battery or something.

Joesph. yes. of course. Free energy has been real for thousands of years...

peace.

 

[Gavin Greenwalt]

Well it's not necessarily free. Which is why I said it very well may be real. But they're ignoring some variable. Something might be consumed in the process. Also it took energy to magnetize the ore.

It's like the Water -> Hydrogen catalysts. You're effectively burning Aluminum to create hydrogen. If you just look at the Fuel Cell it appears to create more energy than is put into it but only if you ignore the fact that Aluminum is being consumed in the processs.

So even if it is actually working I would suspect in all likelihood something unknown in the system is being expended. Since these demonstrations are so tiny and small that unknown variable will take a very very long time to be transferred into kinetic energy. If it could light up a light bulb then the rate of consumption would very quickly reveal itself to be a true source of energy or just a new novel battery.

 

[Jeff Kilgroe]

So Free Energy is real?

Depends how you look at it. I was just saying that the spinning wheel with magnets as constructed by this Mylow guy is far from a new idea. I haven't seen anything in his videos that provides evidence of "free energy" or perpetual motion. Just a couple guys sitting in front of some ridiculously poor excuse for a rotating platform with magnets glued to it saying "it looks like it's accelerating...".

There are literally thousands of patents on this very concept and documentation of such devices dating back from now to over 150 years ago. Mylow hasn't invented anything.

 

[sander kamp]

There are literally thousands of patents on this very concept and documentation of such devices dating back from now to over 150 years ago. Mylow hasn't invented anything.

If that's the case why haven't I seen it before? And why are so many people desperately trying to build a magnet motor if it was such an obvious and easy thing to do?

Mylow has never said he invented this. He is replicating the work of Howard Johnson and his dearest wish is that everybody starts doing the same. He is not in it for the money, he makes the motors in his own house with off the shelve parts and posts unedited videos on the internet where he shows his face and where cats walk around and birds make noises in the back. I think you have to give the guy some credit for being very genuine and for taking the big risk of being burned down.

 

[MikeHedge]

Jeff, not sure if you know, but Mylow was visited by the Black Ops.

anyways. life is gonna be exciting. I'd love to see other people building these.

 

[Gavin Greenwalt]

Mylow was supposedly visited.

By people who would have nothing to gain or lose by his existance or work. The black ops is a dead give away that he's a crackpot.

I bet he was visited by the illuminati as well. I'm sure they're also threatened by a little spinning wheel.

 

[Wayne Morellini]

Even though I love to spend time on these sorts of arguments, I am a little busy to spend too much time, but I will answer a few things. hmm.. I just remembered an engineering principle that might could help achieve these affects.

http://xkcd.com/373/

Statistically, I could make an experiment to virtually refute anything (maybe even it's own existence) so experiments are only as good and objective as they, and their creators, are. Unnaturally we are here, because the existence of this system implies existence outside of the system, as the system is not self creating from no seed (a contradiction in physics).

It isn't cynicism. It's practicality. If every nutjob on youtube warranted our attention we would spend our entire lives disproving them. Instead we assume they're

If we just ignore all the cynical skeptic fans trying to pull a con job because they believe it can't be true, and those just plain mistaken, then we would have a lot lot less to look at, would that not be so. No objective person does these sorts of things because he is skeptical.

If we spend our time denying things could be true, we are liable to spend our time denying things that are true as well.

I came up with an apt way of saying it yesterday, or today, but unfortunately I have forgotten the wording, but it goes something like this: As long as we are caught between the 'couldn't be's ' and the 'must be's ' (or 'could be' or 'can be') extremes, objectivity will suffer. One side has faith in physics and views anything that challenges that with suspicion, the other side believes in their cause and views the first side with suspicion. The side that believes in physics acts like it is a religion and they are the priests of it. One side is very closed to the possibility, and the other very closed to the impossibility. I am not saying that we do not need some people that are a bit could not be, and some a bit must be, to challenge us and peer deeper, as we reach the conclusion as to wherever it: is, is not, maybe, or likely to be, one or the other.

If they aren't nut jobs they'll be on the cover of newsweek by the end of the year. [/
quote]

Are we sure of that? How many valid things have failed dismally because of cynicism and skepticism, and just a little industrial espionage, in times past.

It's not good use of your time. Especially considering if it's true then it'll be easy to prove.

How long have they been trying to unify the laws of physics, with countless billions and not worked. Even if it does trick energy out of space, it could take a lot fo effort to detect, perfect, or even repeat such a trick (please note, vacuum energy sails, and other was to exploit vacuum energy, are of interest to even NASA from memory).

"Oh I also have a fusion reactor in my garage. But I won't let anyone into my garage to verify this claim.

Is this about the fusion break through announcement on the news a few weeks ago? I didn't get to see if it was a normal fusion device or one of these backyard fusion things again.

 

[Wayne Morellini]

I currently rank Steorn on the same level as last year's "quantum computer". Steorn has all sorts of BS on their site about licensing, blah, blah, blah, yet nothing tangible yet. Of course, the proof is in the pudding. They're nobody until they can repeatedly demonstrate a functional unit.

We know that for patent reasons you can't disclose either, and for licensing reasons other things can be kept secret indefinitely. Not that it offers any validity, but also offers an excuse to hide. I thought that the patent office refuses patents on free energy and anti-gravitational devices these days (which also removes commercial incentive).

As for the magnetic wheel motor... Been there, seen it, done it. Call me when it's more than a lazy-suzan with some bench magnets glued to it. He hasn't even progressed it to the level of various kits that were available in the 70s-80s that also used switching electromagnets or movable drive magnets to time the repulsive and attractive forces with the magnet clusters on the disk.

That sounds a little close to the idea I had when I was thirteen.

Shin-Etsu Chemical, Ltd. has re-patented their version of this concept many times over the years, the past few times in '06 and just October of last year.

Jeff, is this the bunch that was doing the research I heard about years ago, about deriving energy from transformations to atom nucleus's, or so forth?

I can come up with a clever system that would fake it and would be completely concealed.

Just stick a electromagnet nearby or under the table, or have a mechanism in the machine powered by inductance from a electro-magnet under the table (avoids the wobbles but more likely to be found under close scrutiny of the device itself).

Jeff, not sure if you know, but Mylow was visited by the Black Ops.

I and a few of my friends could dress up as blackops, and the only way he would know that we were not would be because of my fat stomach .

The problem is, this sort of thing can attract (apart from lying and excluding industrial espionage) skeptical cynics to pretend to be black op's just to stir things up for a joke.

Now the question needs to be asked, why hasn't many of the other people that do this, as Jeff points out, been visited? You would expect many more stories. If it was true, the best option would be to lay low till you have proven or disproven something (so that it can be recreated by others in this case), then announce it across the board.

 

[Jeff Kilgroe]

If that's the case why haven't I seen it before? And why are so many people desperately trying to build a magnet motor if it was such an obvious and easy thing to do?

Not sure why you haven't seen them before... Seriously. There have been kits / plans, whatever available in the back of magazines like Popular Science, etc.. for decades. Why are such "motors" not mainstream? Because people build them and most don't work as advertised. The few that do seem to work, do so with other intervention to the system or other trade-offs or internal consumptions within the motor system. I never said it was easy, I never said it would even work. I'm just saying that the concept is a dead horse, beaten to a bloody pulp.

Here's two patent numbers I pulled just by searching for names of those who I know have legitimate patents on similar permanent magnet motors. But if you do any extensive searching, you will find so many, that it will make your head spin.

6,433,452
7,531,933

The design is not new to me, I've seen tons of magnet "motors" over the years that look just like what Mylow has built. Some built on Johnson's concepts, others from other sources. Not sure why it's such a revelation now. Some of them seem to work, some of them don't work. It's a concept that's been pounded on for well over a century and no one has yet conjured up any miraculous free energy machine.

Mylow has never said he invented this.

Fair enough. But others are incorrectly claiming that he has invented it.

He is replicating the work of Howard Johnson and his dearest wish is that everybody starts doing the same. He is not in it for the money, he makes the motors in his own house with off the shelve parts and posts unedited videos on the internet where he shows his face and where cats walk around and birds make noises in the back. I think you have to give the guy some credit for being very genuine and for taking the big risk of being burned down.

If that is indeed the case, then kudos to him. This is just my not so humble opinion, but I don't think Mylow's "motor" is legit. Even with all the video "proof". I've built similar magnet motors myself, only way they ever worked, without forcibly starting the rotation, is to run a powered electromagnet as the stationary drive magnet. Permanent drive magnets wroked too, just as Mylow's motor is doing, but needed a nudge to get going and they could sometimes spin for a while, even give the illusion of accelerating due to the irregular motion. But in the end, they were nothing more than a magnetically-assisted lazy-susan or turn table that would run for a bit, then fizzle out. Anyway, I'm not going to beat this into the ground any more. If Mylow has discovered some secret placement or magnet arrangement that he is not yet disclosing, then great. Otherwise, he'll eventually be put on the spot (or his motor will be) and it will either work or it will be BS.

We know that for patent reasons you can't disclose either, and for licensing reasons other things can be kept secret indefinitely. Not that it offers any validity, but also offers an excuse to hide. I thought that the patent office refuses patents on free energy and anti-gravitational devices these days (which also removes commercial incentive).

Who can say about patents / Steorn... If they release a real product then great, otherwise they'll fade away. Hopefully they're not already taking money for licensing fees, etc.. Kinda seems as they are from their site, but it's a bit vague.

The USPTO currently turns away any device that claims to provide "free energy" or operate "over unity". Also anything that is "anti gravity", a "transporter" or "teleporter" and a bunch of other devices that people have been dreaming about for decades and beyond. Not so much because they believe that such devices can't exist, but because they're broad topics, popularized in popular culture and the flood of bogus submissions clogs up the patent office. People will seek to patent such concepts, even if completely bogus, just so they can claim they have a patent as a way to add legitimacy to their scam. Anyone who is seriously building such a device will patent individual components anyway and then group all subsequent patents under one final application.

Jeff, is this the bunch that was doing the research I heard about years ago, about deriving energy from transformations to atom nucleus's, or so forth?

I don't know about that. But this group currently holds the majority of patents on the best current magnet material designs and magnetizing processes and they're legit -- produce a large number of the superconductive magnets on the market.

Just stick a electromagnet nearby or under the table, or have a mechanism in the machine powered by inductance from a electro-magnet under the table (avoids the wobbles but more likely to be found under close scrutiny of the device itself).

Exactly. The videos prove nothing. If he's serious and wants to be taken seriously, all he has to do is post a specific list of parts he's using and provide direct instructions or diagrams to build it.

The problem is, this sort of thing can attract (apart from lying and excluding industrial espionage) skeptical cynics to pretend to be black op's just to stir things up for a joke.

Hehe.

Now the question needs to be asked, why hasn't many of the other people that do this, as Jeff points out, been visited? You would expect many more stories. If it was true, the best option would be to lay low till you have proven or disproven something (so that it can be recreated by others in this case), then announce it across the board.

Exactly. And why is it that only rural townsfolk from the southern USA seem to be the ones predominantly abducted by aliens?

 

[David Rasberry]

Until 2005, a methematically coherent understanding of the physics that make motors like this possible was not available. The underlying physics are just now being developed to practical predictable engineering level equations that can be computer modelled.

Mylow is just playing around with designs based on an expired patent that was demonstrated by Johnson to work, but without a coherent and mathematically accurate physics, it is very much a tricky hit or miss proposition to make one work. They do conform to the laws of physics, including conservation of energy.

The key change in physics have come from recent developments in relativity theory that view the spacetime continuum as a source of primordial charge density that drives all energetic phenomena. Under this model a permanent magnet array is not the source of the driving force, but acts as a lens to focus and move primordial charge to do work through resonant coupling. Every electric generator or motor works this way, it is just that we have always done it with brute force from heat engines rather than accessing it directly through resonant coupling. Traditional thermodynamics apply to heat engines, not to this kind of technology.

You are going to see many more such devices emerging in the next few years. Nano generators using this kind of technology will probably replace batteries for many applications, like cell phones and laptops that stay charged for life. These are already in engineering development.

 

[Brandon Fraley]

Now the question needs to be asked, why hasn't many of the other people that do this, as Jeff points out, been visited? You would expect many more stories. If it was true, the best option would be to lay low till you have proven or disproven something (so that it can be recreated by others in this case), then announce it across the board.

I suppose I'll ask it again: Where are the copycats? I can't find a single other video of a working motor. Like everyone else has pointed out, it should be easy enough to fake. Why is no one else in the WORLD faking it? I have to admit, subconsciously, the fact that there are no other fakers out there makes mylow seem more legit to me.

If I had even an ounce of machining talent, I'd build a fake motor in a second and put up a video on youtube proclaiming to be the "second" person to successfully build a working Howard Johnson motor! I'm stunned no one has done this.

 

[David Rasberry]

I have played with some simple models developed using current mag field modelling software ( now obsolete). I was just trying to get a steel ball to roll around a track in a complete circle, not necessarily round, to demonstrate the principles. It was possible to get it 2/3rds of the way with relative ease, but when the arrays were extended to close the circle, field interference between opposite sides would cancel out the motive force.
Been too busy to try with some antisymetric field arrays, but I have had some fun and learned a lot in the process.

 

[Jeff Kilgroe]

I'm stunned no one has done this.

You're joking, right? I could spend all day watching magnet motor videos on YouTube.

http://www.youtube.com/results?search_type=&search_query=magnet+motor&aq=f
:couch:

 

[Gavin Greenwalt]

http://www.nuscam.com/perendev.htm

The results were always the same: they all run down. Under load, they
run down very quickly. It doesn't take very long for magnets to lose
their magnetism when they are constantly being put in opposition to one
another.

As I said before. It's easy to make a device which doesn't appear to consume any sort of fuel when it produces almost no energy.

His little lazy susan would go for decades perhaps without needing the magnet to be replaced. But it still consumes energy.

 

[Steven Caesare]

Until 2005, a methematically coherent understanding of the physics that make motors like this possible was not available. The underlying physics are just now being developed to practical predictable engineering level equations that can be computer modelled.

Mylow is just playing around with designs based on an expired patent that was demonstrated by Johnson to work, but without a coherent and mathematically accurate physics, it is very much a tricky hit or miss proposition to make one work. They do conform to the laws of physics, including conservation of energy.

The key change in physics have come from recent developments in relativity theory that view the spacetime continuum as a source of primordial charge density that drives all energetic phenomena. Under this model a permanent magnet array is not the source of the driving force, but acts as a lens to focus and move primordial charge to do work through resonant coupling. Every electric generator or motor works this way, it is just that we have always done it with brute force from heat engines rather than accessing it directly through resonant coupling. Traditional thermodynamics apply to heat engines, not to this kind of technology.

You are going to see many more such devices emerging in the next few years. Nano generators using this kind of technology will probably replace batteries for many applications, like cell phones and laptops that stay charged for life. These are already in engineering development.

If only we could power a motor with buzzwords...

-sc

 

[Wayne Morellini]

If only we could power a motor with buzzwords...

-sc

Wouldn't that be like "Hot Air"?

I am not going to knock what was said though, because it sort of goes with what I was saying, and I can see sense in it and was my point about technique to transfer energy from outside the system. If something comes from nothing, then what is to stop more coming from nothing. Not that I am implying that there was nothing, nothing is paradoxical to existence. I usually argue that the natural state of things is something (existence) rather than nothing (so there always must have been something) except the concept does not agree (paradoxical) with our system of physical laws that require that nothing can come from nothing, and that there must be something for us to be here. But yet we are here, but because we are here 'nothing' could not have existed, so I came up with the philosophical argument to answer this years ago. But taking the philosophical argument further (been up all night so I will short cut to the conclusions) there must be unlimited energy (see previouse post), and further to, there is no reason for the laws of physics or any structure, or limits to the amount of the universe, particularly given unlimited energy (think singularity) therefor existence must be intelligent (and you know the rest, as a cold chill sets through the minds of Skeptics everywhere ).

Having another look, the natural laws have no basis unless formed by something above the natural, outside from it.

Anyway, it continues on to discuss a new hypothesis of how the universe can be made this way and has a ironic turn to it.

 

[Wayne Morellini]

Exactly. And why is it that only rural townsfolk from the southern USA seem to be the ones predominantly abducted by aliens?

Isn't that where you come from Jeff

I'll tell you a good one Jeff. I have a friend that argued that a perfect orbit was continuous and therefore a perpetual motion machine, and also a ray of light going across the universe (which would require a universe without end), but I suppose, applied to the big bang theory a continuously repeating Big Bang could also be viewed in such a way. Admittedly, he also told me that the reason the Earth was heating up (global warming) was because people were pumping the oil out of the ground that lubricates the Earth in it's orbit around the sun. He also used to think the "news of the world" was true, which was another real eye opener.

 

[David Rasberry]

If only we could power a motor with buzzwords...

-sc

www.atomicprecision.com

Pretty big dustup in the theoretical physics world been going on for about 5 years now. Dr. Evans has won the mathematical and experimental proofs arguments though. As with Einstein, it will probably be another ten to twenty years before the last of the academic holdouts for the standard model bite the dust. Who was it that said new ideas in academia aren't accepted through persuasion but because the people who hold the old ideas finally die off?
But when you have senior research physicists for companies like Siemens, or government agencies like DARPA and the US navy actively participating in developing engineering applications of a major new theoretical paradigm, its past the academic stage.
I have followed this story for about 3 years now, and the dirty politics and soap opera emotions surrounding this are as interesting as the science. Its quite amusing to see Nobel laureates and other major award winning scientists at the tops of their profession calling each other crackpots and pseudo scientists while quibbling over the derivations and values of known universal constants out to the 17th decimal place.