New Zeiss Compact Primes preview...

[Greg M]

So out of all of these new PL-mount lenses coming out, only the Zeiss Compact Primes cover FF35 (36mm x 24mm)?

So are the Red Pro Primes not FF35?

 

[david farland]

So are the Red Pro Primes not FF35?

FAQs- New RED Pro Prime set.

1. RPPs are "RED-centric", which means that the light path is optimized for maximum resolution and consistent illumination, with minimum breathing for the Mysterium sensor family. Patent Pending.
2. T-stop range is 1.8-22.
3. Image diagonal- > 32mm.
4. Extra low dispersion (ELD), Super Low Dispersion (SLD) and anomalous dispersion glass for maximum chromatic aberration correction.
5. Center resolution is greater than 100 (lines pairs/mm). Edge (5K) is greater than 63 (lines pairs/mm). (You will see Wed. how much greater)
6. Close focus from lens front (from sensor) is:
25mm- 4" (12")
35mm- 4" (12")
50mm- 6" (12")
85mm- 18" (24")
100mm- 24" (30")
7. High relative illumination from center to edge of field (5K).
8. Uniform Spectral correction to accommodate any light source.
9. Internal Focus and Unit Focus designs.
10. Consistent 110mm front diameter.
11. RPPs will work with film cameras.

Full Specification Matrix to be posted on Wed.

Jim

Only the Red 300mm covers FF35 frame.

D

 

[Evin Grant]

So out of all of these new PL-mount lenses coming out, only the Zeiss Compact Primes cover FF35 (36mm x 24mm)?

Yes, they are the only cinema specific set.

Take a look at these speck sheets for the current Contax 85mm 1.4 and the ZF The optical groups are very different.

http://www.contaxcameras.co.uk/assets/pdf/Planar1.4_85_e_09-09-02.pdf

http://www.zeiss.com/C12567A8003B8B6F/EmbedTitelIntern/Planar_1-4_85_ZFen/$File/P1_4_85ZF_EN.pdf

The ZF is based on the MF 85mm f1.4 Contax which is not the same as the Contax "N" autofocus design.

Contax MF

Zeiss ZF

Where did you hear that, and why on earth would the coatings be any different? Cheers, Nick

When ZFs were first announced the product literature had dome details about coating technology derived from the Master Primes which helped reduce flaring. ghosting and made them more color matched than previous lenses. I know the 100mm is a new design but the others are taken whole hog from the Contax line.

 

[Nicholas Shields]

At the risk of sounding sarcastic, is the mere inclusion of the Zeiss name make the re-housing of still lenses at a cost of approx. $35K make these lenses desirable? I am well aware of the Zeiss quality but these lenses are relatively slow when compared to the other offerings are they not?

 

[Evin Grant]

These lenses do not cost $35K because of the name alone. The mechanics are superb. The kind of mechanics you only get from hand assembled, cinema grade manufacturing and tolerances not attainable in mass production (except by Red). The speed of these lenses may seem an issue for S35mm photography but for full frame cinematography it's no issue because the 28mm (which is 16mm in S35) is a T2.1.

 

[Roberto Lequeux]

the 28mm (which is 16mm in S35) is a T2.1.

I thought it was FF35 25mm = S35 18mm

 

[rod bradley]

I believe Roberto is right, and Evin had a dislexic lens moment -- we're talking field of view, I believe.

 

[Ariana]

I'd completely forgotten that the Zeiss ZF/ZM's are made by Cosina in Japan.

So the CompactPrimes are made in Germany but use the ZFs which are made in Japan?

 

[Evin Grant]

I thought it was FF35 25mm = S35 18mm

I'm talking compared to the Red One active horizontal angle of view.
True S35 would be 16mm=26mm, 18mm=30mm.

So the CompactPrimes are made in Germany but use the ZFs which are made in Japan?

I believe the Compact primes are made in Germany but the Optical elements themselves still come from Japan, but are hand selected for quality and consistency.

 

[Roberto Lequeux]

I'm talking compared to the Red One active horizontal angle of view.
True S35 would be 16mm=26mm, 18mm=30mm.

Oh, cool, thanks for posting this.

What about Mysterium-X 5k? And will 4k on M-X be true S35?

I would love to know exact numbers.

This sounds like marketing to me. I'll bet they throw away the bad ones, right?

I suppose Zeiss ZF manual still DLSR lenses will continue to be produced. They may get better coatings now..?

 

[Grady Wilson]

I believe the Compact primes are made in Germany but the Optical elements themselves still come from Japan, but are hand selected for quality and consistency.

This would not surprise me if Germany was looking to Japan for optics, and If that is true good for them for having the balls to swallow their ego.
Japanese optics are clearly long past what the Germans are capable of.

Someone said it earlier, but the whole "Made in Germany" marketing speak really holds no value anymore.

 

[Evin Grant]

Japanese optics are clearly long past what the Germans are capable of.

In general I agree with you, that said I'd take any Leica lens over just about any other optic on the planet... but at what price?

 

[David Mullen ASC]

Oh, cool, thanks for posting this.

What about Mysterium-X 5k? And will 4k on M-X be true S35?

I would love to know exact numbers.

I'm not sure why you need exact numbers for cameras that don't exist yet, but it's basic math if you know the dimensions.

S35 is 24mm wide. FF35 is 36mm wide. Divide 36 by 24 and you get 1.5, the magnification factor for conversion.

So to match FOV, you'd use a 27mm lens on a FF35 camera to match an 18mm on a Super-35 camera.

Of course, the recorded RED sensor area in 4K mode isn't 24mm wide, it's more like 22mm wide. And we don't know what area of the FF35 sensor will get recorded in different modes either, given that there's a certain amount of "lookaround" area allotted from the sensor not used in the recording. So even if the FF35 sensor is 36mm wide, perhaps you're recording 34mm, who knows.

When we all learn the dimensions of 4K on the Mysterium-X sensor, we can figure it all out -- though I thought the Mysterium-X was the same size and pixel dimensions of the Mysterium sensor. Same goes for the Monstro sensor, we need to know the actual dimensions of the recorded areas to be perfectly precise in these calculations -- though I don't know why it matters.

Unless you shoot with a zoom lens, it doesn't do you a lot of good to know the exact focal length for matching field of view of the math gives you a figure like, I don't know, 55.5mm let's say -- you're still probably going to reach for a 50mm lens, whatever is closest.

I don't really understand the need for a lot of conversion calculation -- you get a set of prime lenses from wide-angle to telephoto and you compose a shot with them. You don't make conversions from one format to another -- it's a meaningless waste of mental effort. If you are shooting in Super-35, you're probably going to get a prime lens set that starts at an 18mm and maybe goes to 100mm. So if you are shooting in FF35, you're probably going to get a prime lens set that starts at a 27mm and goes to a 150mm. And so what if it's not exactly a match in FOV to the equivalent lenses in Super-35? So what if your math says you need a 68mm and all you can get is a 75mm prime? You line up the shot with your 75mm prime.

Once you start shooting a movie, you learn what the FOV of your lens set is and you never make conversion calculations again.

So what's the point in all of these precise conversion calculations??? Why can't general ones be enough to work with?

The only reason I can see for the need for exact focal length figures is if you are using one of those storyboard / set building programs where you have to input a lot of figures before you can fly the camera around in 3D, whatever. And even then, you can input approximate figures for now, change them when you get more precise figures.

 

[Grady Wilson]

In general I agree with you, that said I'd take any Leica lens over just about any other optic on the planet... but at what price?

Hate to break it to you man, but alot of Leica lenses are made in Japan by Kyocera, old Minolta, and even Sigma.

You gotta be careful when you bring up Leica now adays. the M lenses are like no other, but currently, 90% of product that carries a Leica badge now is manufactured in Japan, specially given the relationship with Panasonic.

 

[Sanjin Jukic]

Hate to break it to you man, but alot of Leica lenses are made in Japan by Kyocera, old Minolta, and even Sigma.

You gotta be careful when you bring up Leica now adays. the M lenses are like no other, but currently, 90% of product that carries a Leica badge now is manufactured in Japan, specially given the relationship with Panasonic.

Let you know that first that Leica professional lenses are all Made in Germany (Solms), then some of them were Made in Canada (Elcan) and some of Leica consumer lenses still are Made in Japan (a deal with Panasonic).

 

[Grady Wilson]

Let you know that first that Leica professional lenses are all Made in Germany (Solms), then some of them were Made in Canada (Elcan) and some of Leica consumer lenses still are Made in Japan (a deal with Panasonic).

Almost True. Most of the Vario-Elmarit-R zooms are made in Japan. And a few of the other R lenses.. not just the consumer stuff my friend Sanjin.

 

[Ariana]

Almost True. Most of the Vario-Elmarit-R zooms are made in Japan. And a few of the other R lenses.. not just the consumer stuff my friend Sanjin.

It doesn't matter how great their lenses are if Leica is continuously sinking into further and further debt. How's super special 50th editions cameras can they keep making to keep things afloat while they struggle to make a marginally competitive digital camera.

While their older lenses rocked, their newer lenses have gotten less and less interesting.

 

[Sanjin Jukic]

Made in Japan doesn't mean anything bad if you say Leica, for example I have

the newest Leica D-Lux 4 compact point & shoot photo camera and it is PERFECT.

 

[Ariana]

Made in Japan doesn't mean anything bad if you say Leica, for example I have

the newest Leica D-Lux 4 compact point & shoot photo camera and it is PERFECT.

Why does the Dlux4 cost almost twice as much as the Panasonic DMC-LX3?
The D-Lux is a Panasonic with a panasonic lens designed by leica although I've heard that they don't do much of the lens design for those cameras.

 

[Grady Wilson]

It doesn't matter how great their lenses are if Leica is continuously sinking into further and further debt. How's super special 50th editions cameras can they keep making to keep things afloat while they struggle to make a marginally competitive digital camera.

While their older lenses rocked, their newer lenses have gotten less and less interesting.

Didnt they just re-release the M8 as the same as before but with a coat of white paint?