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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Heat the EVF?! WTF?!

Mike Prevette said:
If you want to use your camera in the cold it's going to cost more. Period. It's always been that way. Back in the day you would have to get your Camera movement and tripod head regreased for the cold, and you paid tech to do it. It's just the way it is.

Look at this price list for aftermarket eyepiece heaters: http://www.cinetechonline.com/d.html

And those are about $1000 less than what Arri would charge you.

You bitch about the EVF costing you $3000!? I think the Arri Viewfinders for the 435 were like $11,000 for a metal tube with some optics in it and no heater.

So quit bitching about it and fix it! There are lots of fine, professional looking solutions out there that will work great.

Google "Eyepiece heater" and you will find a ton designed for telescopes, buy one shave of the original plug and ad a USB plug and be done with it.
Click to expand...

I do not agree with your position on this Mike. I work on F900s, no problems there, Varicams, no problems there, gensis, Viper, I can go on.

So this is the way it is? They are not going to fix it? Fine if this is the case I should have been informed in advance. Also it's worth noting that the RED body DOES work in the cold.

I am now in contact with RED about this. I will try to get this resolved.
Jay
 
I had some EVF issues on New Year's Day in northern Wisconsin, 31 degrees Farenheit without windchill. Annoying but nothing that prevented us from working. All other components worked flawlessly, including the the LCDs and Red drives.

But since I'm going back next month for a four-week shoot, I got me a pair of these for my A-Camera:

http://usbgeek.com/prod_detail.php?prod_id=0751

I figure one for the EVF, one for the battery. B-Camera will rock the chemical handwarmers and soft cloth.

Annoying, yes, but this is nothing new to cinema equipment, be it digital or not. Every piece of mainstream high-end gear needs to be protected from environmental extremes.
 
Hey Steven,

Oddly enough, I didn't have EVF problems even when perched up in that damn bucket truck! It seems as though the problem is more intermittent than I'd have thought.

Do you think there will be a problem running through batteries with the USB warmers?

~Spencer
 
Just to chime in here, I have never had an issue with my EVF in the cold until today. I was in NYC for New Years and shot some material around town, it was 20F and snowing and the camera still worked.. Today, in COLD BEIJING CHINA, 15F, the EVF went nuts. It solarized and everything was low contrast. The LCD worked fine so I just used that to operate... I don't like this either and wish RED would address this issue. I love Red but feel like there have been shoddy workmanship on some parts, with dumb workarounds to solve surface-simple issues. It's kinda frustrating because you pay all this money and you want your gear to work.. I would hate to see Red make the BOMB_EVF a million times better for the same price. Sometimes I feel like we're still in beta-land here//
 
I don't mean to be rude but this is what happens to tools of all kinds.

For example carbon fibre can easily shatter in the cold. So watch out for carbon fibre tripods and support rods when shooting in cold conditions.

If you're likely to be shooting in cold conditions with any camera then expect issues with batteries, lenses, tripod heads and electronics.

The most important thing one can do is to insulate gear against the cold... I haven't read from anyone who has posted about the EVF issues whether or not their gear was jacketed against the elements at the time or not. (maybe I missed it)
And remember, to equipment, cold is an objective term, not a subjective one based on your location's seasonal swings! Check the specs!!!

JohnF
 
The point is for the price it should work, the whole Canon GL-2 doesn't cost as much as the EVF and I did some cold weather testing out a few years back in -10 to -15F and it held up fine, hopefully there is a new model of EVF or a way to renovate the old one without putting it in a heating blanket. I have confidence in Red, they really seem on the ball with this kind of stuff.
 
Just a quick note that film cameras need to be winterized for cold weather shooting as well. In extreme low temperatures you need to replace the lubricants with low temperature variants, heat the camera movement, coat the internal wires with teflon etc.
 
Spencer Meffert said:
Hey Steven,

Oddly enough, I didn't have EVF problems even when perched up in that damn bucket truck! It seems as though the problem is more intermittent than I'd have thought.

Do you think there will be a problem running through batteries with the USB warmers?

~Spencer
Click to expand...

Hey Spencer--

The problem I had was similar to what Richard Darge describes, the EVF posterized and washed out, no good for focus so I operated off the LCD.

I am a bit concerned about battery life, but I'm hoping the 'Low' setting on the gloves won't be too much of a draw. If it is, then I'll switch to the handwarmers as well.

Hopefully we won't have too many frigid days!...
 
The Red EVF is basically an upgraded Accusceene viewfinder which had the same problems from about 5 degrees celsius. So maybe the technology that is used in the superb VF that Accusceene invented can't be made to handle cold weather.

Remember that the Accusceene VF was 5 times more expensive than the Red VF and was considered the best VF on the planet despite the cold weather flaw.

Maybe we have to choose, either we have the great color VF that this technology offers and find solutions for cold weather, or Red can make a color VF that is like Sony's, basically a small LCD with poor resolution, dynamic range and color reproduction.

Or maybe the next technology (Oled) can be made to handle cold weather.
I don't know but since the problem has been known for 3 or 4 years the solution can't be simple, if it was I'm pretty sure that Red would have fixed it already.

Jesper Holmstrom
Dagsljus Filmequipment
 
They need one like a viewfinder camera that is actual glass, but bends, would be nice.
 
The operating range of the RED EVF is 0 C (or 32 F) to 40 C (or 104 F). As many people in this thread have expressed, this is pretty consistent with most other industry monitors/viewfinders...and a lot of electronics in general.

If you experience any temperature-related RED EVF issues within that operating range, please contact RED tech support so we can get in your EVF for an eval.

Thanks, BC
 
Where can one read up those temperature specs?

They are not on the product's page in the store:
http://www.red.com/store/301001

They seem to differ from the LCD's, that appear to digest lower temperatures, because they heat themselves.
Is there an official operating range on those as well? I still wait for our proLCD's, but this knowledge certainly would be good for some planning.

...

Both of our EVFs have problems from 5C down. Sometimes, the posterizing starts at 10C, when wind is going. I do not think, they are both damaged, though, rather than the mentioned operating range is too optimistic.

If we sent in both EVFs for eval, we lose our ability to shoot entirely, and I somehow doubt, that even new first generation EVFs will work much better under the described conditions.
 
Brent@RED said:
The operating range of the RED EVF is 0 C (or 32 F) to 40 C (or 104 F). As many people in this thread have expressed, this is pretty consistent with most other industry monitors/viewfinders...and a lot of electronics in general.

If you experience any temperature-related RED EVF issues within that operating range, please contact RED tech support so we can get in your EVF for an eval.

Thanks, BC
Click to expand...

This is extremely dissappointing and frustrating. Tell me something Brent, do you expect this same issue with the next EVF? It looks like I may need to Ebay this one to recover some of my losses.

I'll rent, apply the solutions stated here, and when a more cold-tolerant EVF comes out, then I will buy that. (As "normal" as this seems, I'll bet $5 the next EVF will not suffer from the same problem).

I'm not real happy about this.

Jay
 
I also experience the posterizing at temperatures from +5°C and down. It seems as if the effect is more in the unfocused areas. If it is a professional VF it should work fine at -10°C. That's my humble opinion. If the electronics can't work under these conditions there should be a build in heater function, everything else is below good.
 
Brent@RED said:
The operating range of the RED EVF is 0 C (or 32 F) to 40 C (or 104 F). As many people in this thread have expressed, this is pretty consistent with most other industry monitors/viewfinders...and a lot of electronics in general.

If you experience any temperature-related RED EVF issues within that operating range, please contact RED tech support so we can get in your EVF for an eval.

Thanks, BC
Click to expand...
I've had the banding in an EVF once before and it wasn't close to 0 C Brent. It was cold but not significantly cold and we were outside early December. Admittedly after about an hour it'd warmed up enough internally that it disappeared though.

Where the rotational part of the EVF meets the static section is where the LCD screen is positioned, as such the LCD albeit secure is closer to the cold air than one might think. Insulating this gap ought to help keep the LCD warm and stop cold getting to it a little more. One of those beer can holders ought to work quite well for moderate temperatures :)

Paul
 
Paul and Pict,

Feel free to contact myself (bfair@red.com) or tech support to see if we can resolve some of these issues.

Thanks,
Brian
 
Good news

Good news

I've just been informed that someone is making a custom cover for the EVF, apparently it will be designed to both protect the EVF from abuse, protect against accidental pushing of the buttons, AND provide a battery powered heat source inside to keep the EVF warm.

An NDA keeps me from providing more details than that. I did ask about cost and was told between $250 - $450 depending on how many "goodies are provided and how far they want to go in keeping it working in EXTREME temps).

I was told it will be black and have a look that do the rig proud!

Thank god.. Now all we need is for it to come out!

I'm getting one...

Jay
 
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