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Brook Willard
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[thread split]
I guess the more that I think about it, the more that I realize that the S35 models are kind of... out of place. Here's my reasoning.
The RED ONE can do 4K@30p, 3K@60p and 2K@120p.
The S35 Scarlet can do 4K [which is the S35mm area] at 30p and 2K@72p. It also has the 5K@72p burst mode for the occasional high-speed shot. It has more dynamic range than a stock RED ONE and a larger sensor [so you can shoot real super 35mm instead of Academy]. It can record REDCODE 80, which one can only guess is about twice as good as RC36. It has timelapse functionality, but probably not ramping [a rarely used feature]. It is smaller, lighter and more configurable than the RED ONE. It has HD-SDI out [likely superior to the RED ONE's] as well as timecode and audio support with the appropriate module. You can choose custom recording areas, but it can't desqueeze anamorphic [something that the RED ONE didn't do for a year and we all got used to]. Since its sensor is bigger, it is closer to four-perf anyways... so it's actually superior for anamorphic shooting. It also ships first.
So to me, the S35 Scarlet is the RED ONE replacement. Sure you lose a few features... but you gain a few as well. Since the features you lose aren't used by 80% of productions anyway, the S35 Scarlet has that market cornered.
Ignoring discounts, we're talking about a $7,000 camera here.
So that essentially turns the S35 Epic at $28,000 into a high-speed camera. Yes it has a few extra features and a higher quality recording mode... but these aren't features that get used on every shoot and the RC80 mode available on the Scarlet is already better than the RED ONE. That lowered compression will probably result in a 1/3-1/2 stop of dynamic range in the shadows.
I honestly think that many shoots aren't going to bother renting an Epic for 400% more money because of a few features. The Scarlet is going to kill the S35 Epic.
When the Monstro cameras start to ship, the same problem will happen with the FF35 models. I know that frame rates and features cost money and I'm personally willing to pay for it. But the shoots that don't need high frame rates and the shoots that are willing to deal with the Scarlet's shortcomings [which are in many cases better than the shortcomings of the RED ONE that they'll have been dealing with for a year and a half] won't bother to rent the Epic.
So now you have a $10,000 camera eating a $33,000 camera's lunch. That was really awesome when the RED ONE came along and ate all of Sony's and Panasonic's lunch... but now it's cannibalism to me.
If somebody outfits a Scarlet package in a professional manner, they will be poised to take 80% of the jobs from Epic owners.
I'm not talking about the guy with a Scarlet, a tiny tripod and a Red Rock matte box. I'm talking about the kind of person who slots a Scarlet body into a nice Arri/O'Connor/Ronford/Element Technica/Anton Bauer/all-the-trimmings camera package.
Now anybody thinking about buying these cameras should already have a built-in client base. Those clients will always rent from you because you're you. That's no problem. The camera will eventually earn itself into the green and everybody will be happy. I'm not trying to doom & gloom that Epic owners are going to sit around staring at their unrented camera.
So looking at my original question, I get that a 645 package is going to rent for the same as an Epic FF35 package... except on those jobs that need the 6 x 4.5 sensor. That's cool.
But I really think that Epic owners will find themselves losing a lot of jobs to the soccer mom camera.
Now there's one solution: buy a Scarlet and a 645. Seems like a great deal. The Scarlet is only $7,000, it'll pay for itself in no time.
But the FF35 is only $3,000 more. Oh, but it comes out later! So I'll start with the S35 Scarlet so I can be the first guy on the block to have one of the new cameras. When the FF35 ships, I'll pick one of those up as well. That way I can serve all of my potential clients. I'll just work those cameras until the 645 ships and then I'll buy that... because that's the one I really want.
Now I'm a rental house.
So the solution is to buy the cameras and sell them when the new hotness comes out. Buy an S35 Scarlet, ROI it, sell it and buy an FF35 Scarlet, ROI it, keep it around when you pick up the 645 and be set up to serve all clients properly.
That's the solution. And there is a solution for camera owners. Once again, I'm not trying to proclaim this as the end of the world.
There will always be the productions that demand the best and only the best. When you show up with a Scarlet, they'll say "get that thing out of here and get me the real camera." That's fine, there will always be those productions.
I'm also not saying that RED should change their lineup and I'm not trying to get them to cripple Scarlet.
I'm just saying that - all else equal - I don't see a compelling reason for anybody to rent an Epic unless they specifically need higher frame rates or can't live without certain niceties... the niceties that they're mostly living without right now.
The perfect world for rentals would be if all Scarlet models had the Mysterium-X and all Epic models had the Monstro. Then you'd have an undeniable benefit to the Epic line that everybody would want. Sure the Scarlets would have higher resolution [5.4µm vs. 6.0µm pixels], but the Epics would have an extra 2+ stops of dynamic range! Now that's the way to do it. That way everybody wins. That way there's a clear separation between the product lines.
I dunno. I'm just about out of ideas. That's my film-industry-apocalypse-stream-of-consciousness rant that'll probably get me in trouble.
I guess the more that I think about it, the more that I realize that the S35 models are kind of... out of place. Here's my reasoning.
The RED ONE can do 4K@30p, 3K@60p and 2K@120p.
The S35 Scarlet can do 4K [which is the S35mm area] at 30p and 2K@72p. It also has the 5K@72p burst mode for the occasional high-speed shot. It has more dynamic range than a stock RED ONE and a larger sensor [so you can shoot real super 35mm instead of Academy]. It can record REDCODE 80, which one can only guess is about twice as good as RC36. It has timelapse functionality, but probably not ramping [a rarely used feature]. It is smaller, lighter and more configurable than the RED ONE. It has HD-SDI out [likely superior to the RED ONE's] as well as timecode and audio support with the appropriate module. You can choose custom recording areas, but it can't desqueeze anamorphic [something that the RED ONE didn't do for a year and we all got used to]. Since its sensor is bigger, it is closer to four-perf anyways... so it's actually superior for anamorphic shooting. It also ships first.
So to me, the S35 Scarlet is the RED ONE replacement. Sure you lose a few features... but you gain a few as well. Since the features you lose aren't used by 80% of productions anyway, the S35 Scarlet has that market cornered.
Ignoring discounts, we're talking about a $7,000 camera here.
So that essentially turns the S35 Epic at $28,000 into a high-speed camera. Yes it has a few extra features and a higher quality recording mode... but these aren't features that get used on every shoot and the RC80 mode available on the Scarlet is already better than the RED ONE. That lowered compression will probably result in a 1/3-1/2 stop of dynamic range in the shadows.
I honestly think that many shoots aren't going to bother renting an Epic for 400% more money because of a few features. The Scarlet is going to kill the S35 Epic.
When the Monstro cameras start to ship, the same problem will happen with the FF35 models. I know that frame rates and features cost money and I'm personally willing to pay for it. But the shoots that don't need high frame rates and the shoots that are willing to deal with the Scarlet's shortcomings [which are in many cases better than the shortcomings of the RED ONE that they'll have been dealing with for a year and a half] won't bother to rent the Epic.
So now you have a $10,000 camera eating a $33,000 camera's lunch. That was really awesome when the RED ONE came along and ate all of Sony's and Panasonic's lunch... but now it's cannibalism to me.
If somebody outfits a Scarlet package in a professional manner, they will be poised to take 80% of the jobs from Epic owners.
I'm not talking about the guy with a Scarlet, a tiny tripod and a Red Rock matte box. I'm talking about the kind of person who slots a Scarlet body into a nice Arri/O'Connor/Ronford/Element Technica/Anton Bauer/all-the-trimmings camera package.
Now anybody thinking about buying these cameras should already have a built-in client base. Those clients will always rent from you because you're you. That's no problem. The camera will eventually earn itself into the green and everybody will be happy. I'm not trying to doom & gloom that Epic owners are going to sit around staring at their unrented camera.
So looking at my original question, I get that a 645 package is going to rent for the same as an Epic FF35 package... except on those jobs that need the 6 x 4.5 sensor. That's cool.
But I really think that Epic owners will find themselves losing a lot of jobs to the soccer mom camera.
Now there's one solution: buy a Scarlet and a 645. Seems like a great deal. The Scarlet is only $7,000, it'll pay for itself in no time.
But the FF35 is only $3,000 more. Oh, but it comes out later! So I'll start with the S35 Scarlet so I can be the first guy on the block to have one of the new cameras. When the FF35 ships, I'll pick one of those up as well. That way I can serve all of my potential clients. I'll just work those cameras until the 645 ships and then I'll buy that... because that's the one I really want.
Now I'm a rental house.
So the solution is to buy the cameras and sell them when the new hotness comes out. Buy an S35 Scarlet, ROI it, sell it and buy an FF35 Scarlet, ROI it, keep it around when you pick up the 645 and be set up to serve all clients properly.
That's the solution. And there is a solution for camera owners. Once again, I'm not trying to proclaim this as the end of the world.
There will always be the productions that demand the best and only the best. When you show up with a Scarlet, they'll say "get that thing out of here and get me the real camera." That's fine, there will always be those productions.
I'm also not saying that RED should change their lineup and I'm not trying to get them to cripple Scarlet.
I'm just saying that - all else equal - I don't see a compelling reason for anybody to rent an Epic unless they specifically need higher frame rates or can't live without certain niceties... the niceties that they're mostly living without right now.
The perfect world for rentals would be if all Scarlet models had the Mysterium-X and all Epic models had the Monstro. Then you'd have an undeniable benefit to the Epic line that everybody would want. Sure the Scarlets would have higher resolution [5.4µm vs. 6.0µm pixels], but the Epics would have an extra 2+ stops of dynamic range! Now that's the way to do it. That way everybody wins. That way there's a clear separation between the product lines.
I dunno. I'm just about out of ideas. That's my film-industry-apocalypse-stream-of-consciousness rant that'll probably get me in trouble.
