Testing Zeiss Master Primes vs Ultra Primes

[Ketch Rossi]

Andrew, you make me light headed when you post this circles.:usd:


Vignetting, the way I see it, it is in this margins a very pleasing and intended effect of the lens design and, again I absolutely and most positively believe that no one is going to seat on front of a screen, and look at the very edges of the imagery in search of ... O Vignetting!

If this is to really get technical specs and lab results about each individual lens, I understand completely, and good work, but other then that, seriously, if any viewer including any EXEC. or Studio or paying Movie Goer is looking at nothing else then the images for their content and story, (even so image quality is very important) then I think something is very wrong, and it isn't the Vignetting produced by the lens.

ciao

 

[Andrew M.]

Ketch, and what do you think I am using for the important shots?
Master Primes!

I will use MPs just for the fact that it is so perfect mechanically.
Smooooooth, like Graeme’s REDRAW, no mechanical aliasing of any kind
And I am bit of snob, well I drive the Mercedes.

Though I have heard good things about 18-85 RED, Jims favorites.
But this one will be going against Optimo Rouge not MP.

I am just curious what other lenses do have this vignetting on RED, anybody has cooke lenses handy to shot white flat surface?

 

[Ketch Rossi]

Ketch, and what do you think I am using for the important shots?
Master Primes!

I will use MPs just for the fact that it is so perfect mechanically.
Smooooooth, like Graeme’s REDRAW, no mechanical aliasing of any kind
And I am bit of snob, well I drive the Mercedes.

Though I have heard good things about 18-85 RED, Jims favorites.
But this one will be going against Optimo Rouge not MP.

I am just curious what other lenses do have this vignetting on RED, anybody has cooke lenses handy to shot white flat surface?

I tough so Andrew.

BTW, I might call upon you soon for a day shoot of a couple of scenes of my first project, as I need a second camera and MP's.


The problem is that one of the scenes is in a "Strip club" filming a half naked twisting twirling duo of girls, in little to no light, could you do it?


ciao

 

[Andrew M.]

With pleasure and I can bring some girls too.
We can go infrared, green
Do we need much colors?

 

[Ketch Rossi]

With pleasure and I can bring some girls too.
We can go infrared, green
Do we need much colors?

Girls are always welcome, even so there will be many of them already.:sarcasm:

The strip club scene is of two dancers coming together from their individual show and they end up making out on stage, with total disregard to the viewing costumers? The fill has to be extremely sensual, and I like it to be Film Noir, yet have the reachness and Vivid coloration, CSI MIami style, yeah, I know ...


ciao

 

[Andrew M.]

If you have good talents they can give you the look and feel of dim light behavior even if you use normal or even bright light.
Then you make it looking like low light in post.
Unless if you shoot real life staged documentary type of scene.

 

[Bang WOW Bang]

Something odd though about the cheapest digital cine camera needing the most expensive 35mm cine lenses ever built to go on it... What sort of indie filmmaker revolution is that, if you feel you need to buy $100,000 or more in optics to put on a $17,500 body?

I love Master Primes too, but even I can't afford them most of the time. And this is on features budgeted over 10-million dollars... I can justify the cost for select night scenes, but it's hard to get production to pay for them for an entire show.

No I put Digitprime on my JVC HD251E with uncompressed HD 4:2:2 format as well. Always Optics > Sensor > Codec > Storage device are the key factors of the D-Camera.

Rent a MP lens is cheap though just USD 150.00 per day from me in HKG
( You can keep it in 24 hours shooting ) !!!

Cheers,
Stewart
WOW Holdings
HKG

 

[Ketch Rossi]

I'll be looking for an Organic fill with a Film Noir style, Shoulder mounted cams and will do ramping in post, the lighting will remain pretty much almost as is in the club, with few LEDz BRUTE 6 ( not out yet, RED special edition) on camera to hit the talent in a come and go motion, as both talent and camera will be on the move.

ciao

 

[Júlio Taubkin]

Okay, just barging in, but that's a HELL lot of vignetting! Sure it's soft, but it's a lot of light we're loosing there no?

Wow, the other option is to wait for the RED primes? Or use T2 (and beyond) lenses?

 

[Pawel Achtel]

one stop from the center to the side and about 1 1/2 stop all the way to the the corner at 2:1
16:9 will be bit more, maybe 1.7 stop.
It is for 65mm Master Prime.

Check it yourself by scanning edges and then center in PS or any other color editing program that reads values for RGB. 110 the lowest 240 higest number I am reading.

and test setup here:

http://www.reduser.net/forum/showpost.php?p=191917&postcount=2

You can see vignetting right in the LCD there.
This is 16mm MP I am about to test there, the picture of chart above comes from 65mm test.
Yet, as you see on the test setup picture the light was very even and dispersed.

I didn't post test of 16 mm MP lenses chart because I set the distance from the chart to the camera wrong, I measured from the chart to the focus hook. I forgot that for 10 times magnification you have to measure from the chart to the lenses focal node or 11 times distance to the focus hook.
Sure enough if you make such mistake you get much better readings since the camera is closer.

Hi Andrew,

I am sorry to say but, your test was flawed. The taletell is in the picture of the setup (http://www.reduser.net/forum/showpost.php?p=191917&postcount=2
) .

I can see the "vignetting" even before it entered the lens. When I take the picture into Photoshop and sample colour, the centre of the chart is significantly brighter than either edge of the chart!

You didn't lit the chart evenly.

To remove any doubt that the picture of the setup is vignetted too, please notice that the chart is framed such the left edge of the chart is in the midle of your shot and it is still darker than the centre of the chart, which is away from the centre of the picture of the setup. Thus, eliminating the possibility of vignetting in the picture of the setup. Thus, it confirms beyond doubt that the chart was not evenly lit.

Sorry for shooting your findings down, no bad intentions here :bleh:, just scientific peer review :innocent:

Your report did sound strange to me at first and certainly did not add up with perfectly even skies in the pictures that Evin Grant posted in his outstanding lens comparisons:

http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=7696
http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=7593

FYI, to measure or test vignetting it is best to use proper backlit chart.