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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Attitude adjustment...

Look its just a thought.. there seems to be a lot of people out there who appear to be very upset by this price reduction. The only apparent "winners" being the people who have placed an order in the thirty days prior to the price drop or those that have placed an order since the price drop. I recall a massive price drop in Europe of Sony digibeta cameras where owners operators had no choice but to accept the loss and press on regardless. Not even a sniff from Sony of cashback or regret. It appears to me that what people are talking about is the RED revolution in marketing strategy and that at the moment may benefit some but not the early adopters. What if Red were able to restore the faith of the original adopters by introducing a similar price reduction in lenses and accessories for a limited time only and only available to owner operators that purchased and completed prior to the price reduction. This sentiment may have been expressed in the last few pages so apologies if it has. If it hasn't then maybe its a thought Jim?
 
Brent@RED said:
Two quick points...

1, it is more than "changing the name", it also gives you the opportunity to get the RED Re-Certified Warranty on that camera.

2, we listen. Effective tomorrow, for all brains the transfer of ownership / RED Re-Certified Warranty fee is $500. There is still the $100 eval fee. Hope that helps...

BC
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This is very nice, I am very sure that all the guys/girls I Brokered cameras for, will be happy to save $250 during the Transfer of Ownership, thank you in their behalf Brent... ;)
 
Jim / Jarred -

I'm over on another forum somewhere discussing the future of 4k and pointed out that eventually I suspect RED will be giving cameras away for FREE and start licensing software through the cloud in order to make use of the FREE hardware (cameras).

Yes, I'm a bit of a shit disturber. But any thoughts on that, anything you can either confirm or deny?
 
There goes our day jobs. And please don't tell me talent trumps all...
 
Dennis Hingsberg said:
Jim / Jarred -

I'm over on another forum somewhere discussing the future of 4k and pointed out that eventually I suspect RED will be giving cameras away for FREE and start licensing software through the cloud in order to make use of the FREE hardware (cameras).

Yes, I'm a bit of a shit disturber. But any thoughts on that, anything you can either confirm or deny?
Click to expand...

Why would you think that? They don't charge at all for their software now, what makes you think they want to become a software company? It is surely more succeptable to piracy than the hardware business.
 
shashbugu said:
There goes our day jobs. And please don't tell me talent trumps all...
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Chin up, it's not that bad... Talent doesn't trump all, but crap is crap and people will only pay bottom dollar for so long. What this does do is keep no-talent people who own an expensive camera from getting gigs based on the gear and NOT the talent. The IT world went through this a few years ago when everyone decided to offshore development. It was a huge cost savings at first, until it was realized that you get what you pay for. Now, very few companies offshore because they know they are wasting money. Besides, if 25K price difference is enough to cost you your job, you have bigger problems. What about all the support gear that surrounds that little brick? That didn't change price. Your rates don't change.

I am happy to finally afford a camera I have wanted since Red announced the intentions of making a camera - I have been following RED that long. I finally ordered an R1. I will not be competition to you (or anyone else) as I have only the desire to tell stories - my own stories.

Even if you represent a rental house, buy lenses and all the other support gear for the people, like me, who can afford the body but not the kit - I'll need to get that over time and have to rent in the mean time.
 
Those who are experiencing problems with clients wanting a lower rate, if it were me in their shoes I would tell those clients that I have xx rate for 4k, xx rate for 1080p (drag that old DSLR out of the closet) and xx rate for those who want 4k that downscales to 1080p. No need to even mention the camera brand unless they ask.
 
Does anyone have any ideas on how we might have competition in a quickly developing tech, and stable prices? I can't see how this trend can be stopped, it would take the concerted effort of the industry. A price fixing type of scenario. Even then a dark horse could come out of nowhere and clean up. Prices will continue to fall as naturally as rain. Some areas might be a little dryer than others, but… ( :
 
Dennis Hingsberg said:
Jim / Jarred -

I'm over on another forum somewhere discussing the future of 4k and pointed out that eventually I suspect RED will be giving cameras away for FREE and start licensing software through the cloud in order to make use of the FREE hardware (cameras).

Yes, I'm a bit of a shit disturber. But any thoughts on that, anything you can either confirm or deny?
Click to expand...

Scott Crawley said:
Why would you think that? They don't charge at all for their software now, what makes you think they want to become a software company? It is surely more succeptable to piracy than the hardware business.
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Scott I think this is the future. Adobe is moving to cloud based software, and although Apple makes decent money off its hardware its the software that brings in residual income. If RED wants to win this game then I can only see this as the next logicial move.

FREE RED cameras for everyone, and licensing fees through "use".

Only a company like RED could pull this off. Other companies are too mutli-tiered, invest a lot of money in R&D, release too many "similar" models with different features. Look what happend to GM. Just wait until you see what RED does next.

RED = game changers. Let's not any of us ever forget that.
 
Dennis Hingsberg said:
If RED wants to win this game then I can only see this as the next logicial move.
Click to expand...

Could not disagree more with your assessment as the companies you list all have X factor more people to monetize that type of business model...

You bragged about liking to stir shit up but making broadstroke comments like this are hard to respect... you sound more like a troll to be honest.

May I request you at least start a new thread for this please... this one has been hijacked enough, yes? :) Thank you.



and seriously?
 
Jannard said:
As I said before, everything in the electronics world changes... usually for the better, cheaper and faster. EPIC and Scarlet just did. Right now.

We have built an incredibly efficient factory in Irvine, California and over time learned how to make EPICs in quantity, lowered our assembly costs, found better suppliers and fully paid off our NRE. When we assembled the 1st EPIC camera in Stage 6 at RED Studios Hollywood it took our team 12 hours. It took two more days to de-bug. Today we can assemble an EPIC in 13 minutes and 95+% need no re-work after diagnostics and testing. It is a testament to our manufacturing team and supply chain teams.

Since our costs are now significantly lower we are re-pricing our cameras as of now.

For those of you that purchased a new Scarlet ( not battle tested ) or EPIC brain on or after Oct. 1st 2012, the next time you order accessories from RED you will receive a discount to use towards that purchase. $1000 for Scarlet and $4000 for EPIC. Talk to your Bomb Squad representative when you are ready to use this discount.

Now… here is the new pricing:

5K EPIC-X Brain- $19,000

5K EPIC-X Monochrome Brain- $20,000

5K EPIC-M Brain- $24,000

5K/4K Scarlet Brain- $7,950

4.5K RED ONE M-X Battle Tested- $4000 (includes SSD recording module). The RED ONE is End of Life. Battle tested is all that will be available from here on out.

Due to high anticipated volumes, plan on extended response and processing times.

Dragon sensor upgrade is not included for any EPIC system purchased at the new pricing going forward. It will be a $6K upgrade.

Pricing is being updated on www.red.com as I post this.

Jim
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In case people forgot what this thread was about after nearly 100 pages...
 
I think the upset people should all remember the past...

Did we all forget about the $230K SONY F23 ---- Gathering dust.. worth what ever you can get for it.
The $220k Sony F35... Know body uses that anymore... the f65 made quick work of that... so worth what ever you can get for it. and soon the f65 will get a hammering by its little baby sisters with the f5 & 55....
Lets not forget about the $250k + Arri D21 - worth nothing, literally ! I know a guy with 2 of them sitting dead now for 2 years on a shelf sitting next to a F23 and a F35 on the same shelf... Not a single hire.
And Watch this space... The Arri Alexa is about to get super seeded any day now... so who knows how low that will fall once a cheaper, better 4k version hits the stands...
I was offered and fully setup Alexa for 35k only a week ago, people can already see the death of it coming quickly...

All this ... And people are worried about the drop on price on a already 1/2 price camera in the EPIC X... ? ... Don't be getting into other brand names, you will loose a shit load more money over time, because they cost a shit load more in the first place (for what they do) and you have to replace the whole camera out when super seeded instead of a cheap sensor swap out.

Consider this... you loose half of 40k - it's 20k? for a 5k RAW camera that shoots 120 fps and fits in the palm of your hand... Who else offers that for 40k? let alone 20k.???

With all these other brands you're going to loose a lot more than that over the next 12 months...

You can now own 4x 5k RAW EPICS for the price of 1 ( HD ONLY ) ALEXA...

i personally would have dribbled the price down over 12 months or more, instead of one great whack. Just to save the head ache of people thinking they have been ripped off...
... but hey, I don't own RED. :)

All food for thought.
 
Tim Whitcomb said:
Could not disagree more with your assessment as the companies you list all have X factor more people to monetize that type of business model...

You bragged about liking to stir shit up but making broadstroke comments like this are hard to respect... you sound more like a troll to be honest.

May I request you at least start a new thread for this please... this one has been hijacked enough, yes? :) Thank you.
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I suggest you take a screen shot of my post and look at again in 10 years and see. If you follow technology you would realize the idea is neither novel nor that far fetched.

FYI: New posts can not be created in RECON and my post is on-topic with Jim's statment that "everything in the electronics world changes" as it relates to camera pricing.
 
Thanks

Thanks

I was offered and fully setup Alexa for 35k only a week ago, people can already see the death of it coming quickly..
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Same here......

We started with one RED ONE , Then got our second RED ONE, got them Mxed,went for STAGE II and III.Got another EPIC two months ago before the price and next one is on the way . In the meantime we had two DI suits,Three Ultra Prime sets,Allura Zooms..had I had to buy a new camera everytime I would not have been able to sustain ....

RED is a game changer for me and a lifechanger...

Harcharan
 
Elsie N said:
Those who are experiencing problems with clients wanting a lower rate, if it were me in their shoes I would tell those clients that I have xx rate for 4k, xx rate for 1080p (drag that old DSLR out of the closet) and xx rate for those who want 4k that downscales to 1080p. No need to even mention the camera brand unless they ask.
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I don't see any problem with clients asking for a lower rate. Just say 'yes' and end the conversation right there. Boom! Is that so hard? Well I don't run a rental house so...

Your idea is a good one. You could even charge more for the 5DII because it's apparently a 'legend'. Yes, it was outdated before it was released but damn, some people wouldn't know any better!
 
Dennis Hingsberg said:
I suggest you take a screen shot of my post and look at again in 10 years and see. If you follow technology you would realize the idea is neither novel nor that far fetched.

FYI: New posts can not be created in RECON and my post is on-topic with Jim's statment that "everything in the electronics world changes" as it relates to camera pricing.
Click to expand...

The only thing worth remembering about what you are saying in 10 years, is your awesome signature... the rest is just noise imho and I reserve my right to disagree with your conclusions. :)
 
Creative Cow had a great article several years ago about "grinders" the worst most disloyal clients on earth. Learning to say "no" is also a great way to keep your rates up. In my experience, clients arguing rate end up being nightmares who are never happy no matter how low you go. Whereas more often than not my best clients who pay full rates and are also among my happiest. Jut say no to Grinders. they will never come back with that "big budget next time" that they always promise... my two cents.
 
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