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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

So has streak flaring been resolved?

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Van Royko

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I just battled through two days of this. Mattebox can only do so much. Never had anything like this in any other situation. Overhead directional lights are the worst. With a fat french flag the Epic was still picking up flares.
Definitely a design issue that needs resolution.... I surprised it didn't come up in testing because it has happened very frequently for me.
 
Julio Quintana said:
I was wondering when someone was going to bring this up again. There have been two threads raising this issue. One was mysteriously closed and the other ignored by the RED team.

I don't know why RED refuses to address this explicitly since it seems like it could be a simple fix.
Click to expand...

Apple gets criticised for this too, but they're probably doing this:

1. Listen to the feedback
2. Don't make a rash response that may end up being wrong
3. Consider all the info, test, devise the best solution
4. Respond once you have it sorted

We all know RED well enough to know that we can safely assume they're dealing with it.
 
Stephen Gentle said:
We all know RED well enough to know that we can safely assume they're dealing with it.
Click to expand...

We active Redusers know RED, but the wider cinematography community may not. I think it's important for RED to explicitly address the issue before this turns into a "Red one overheats" fiasco.
 
If this is the red-dot issue related to the low-pass filter reflecting onto the back of the lens, it's a very serious issue that I hope is being taken seriously. Last I heard, this may require a new, redesigned OLPF. If so, I hope this being designed now. I have gotten burned on this issue many times shooting into the sun. 90% of what I shoot is backlit, so it's a continual, ongoing problem for me.

If this happened to a crew on a major film with actors, etc, it would be a huge problem.
 
The red circles have killed plenty of shots for me too, and there's no way around it. Missed a fantastic opportunistic cloudscape from an aerial shoot just a few days ago... However I think we're referring to the gate flares that the EPIC is so fond of producing.

I know the argument is that you should be able to flag them out, and sure you can any time they occur, but that's not the point in my opinion. We've seen them crop up plenty on Mr Hutson's footage shooting with Canon lenses, and you can bet your bottom dollar those gate flares would have not existed to the same degree shooting stills with the same glass on a DSLR. I shoot a lot of documentary style material and irritatingly very often the little patch of serendipitous light I find to place a subject in comes complete with unexpected flares. I barely have time in these circumstances to frame a shot and hit record and the flares are an extra bit of work I don't need.
 
Tom Lowe said:
If this is the red-dot issue related to the low-pass filter reflecting onto the back of the lens, it's a very serious issue that I hope is being taken seriously. Last I heard, this may require a new, redesigned OLPF. If so, I hope this being designed now. I have gotten burned on this issue many times shooting into the sun. 90% of what I shoot is backlit, so it's a continual, ongoing problem for me.

If this happened to a crew on a major film with actors, etc, it would be a huge problem.
Click to expand...

This one is different. It's gate flare that is being discussed. Light being relfected off the metal insode the OLFP. The RED dot you are talking about goes back to the REDONE, where the reflective OLFP was shooting light back to the rear of the lens, then back into the sensor.

This is different.
 
OK since I started the original thread I will talk about the micro surgery i performed this week.

I bought some self adhesive flock from a telescope shop in the USA that apparently sells this shit to NASA.
Got it friday of last week.

I spoke to Brent and Deanan at RED about removing the metal bit around the OLPF and Brent said that what ever I dismantle on my EPIC would now be void of warranty which is fair enough.

SO.......

I didn't dismantle anything except i removed the 4 screws that hold the PL mount in place and I then meticulously stuck the black flock around the sensor and had enough overhang to cover the PL mount once screwed back in.

So effectively my PL mount now has no warranty which I am fine with.

The results........

The really bad streak flaring doesn't really exist any more and I am happy... There still is some streak flaring but I believe this is coming from the OLPF gap to the sensor and is bouncing around that.

END RESULT........

I have reduced the streak flaring enough for me to be able to fly my EPIC on my steadicam in most situations...

SO.........


I am happy now and I have still kept my warranty on my EPIC and the flock cost me bugger all!

Maybe Deanan has a better fix but for the moment my one works well
 
OK I will post some tomorrow when I am back in the office.. I have been shooting 10 hours of steadicam today and I am F#$Ked and I just got home. So i promise I will post some tomorrow. Its 7pm in Australia right now
 
Thanks for pioneering Adam. And although I can't speak for the addition of the flocking, I'm sure that removing the PL mount by its four screws is a 'user' operation that Red are fine with, just like swapping the side handle and blanking plate, (bear in mind the new Canon mount) or changing out the side SSD / blanking plate. I know I've been instructed to do that in the course of troubleshooting, and in future one would expect to do so when other SSD modules arrive.
 
Hey Adam, would you mind sharing where you got the material used in your fix? Thanks for posting.

EDIT: Beat me to it :)
 
Michael Mayda is the champion here. http://www.protostar.biz/hitack.htm
It took ages to get a sheet of this and I had to jump through a few hoops in customs as I think they thought i was going to line the casing of a bomb or something, but eventually Australian customs released the product.

Works like a charm...All you need to do is remove the PL mount (ONLY) and cut some small bits of flock and stick it on. Make sure you cut over the join of the shiny metal but and wear a light weight cloth glove when applying. Then there is no chance of damaging the OLPF part of the sensor and you dont have to remove the OLPF mount.

I will post photos tomorrow.
 
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I've had results that are just fine with self-adhesive black foam, but I'm sure Adam's results are even more effective.
It's not light bouncing off shiny metal that causes the flare issue, though it might as well be. It's light bouncing off the soft plastic/ rubber item that mounts the OLPF in place, and simply has the wrong texture/ light bouncing properties for the job.
 
I met with Doug Underdaul today, and he has a non-invasive solution that seems to work great. I'm not at liberty to say any more because this is Doug's baby, but based on today's testing I feel that he'll soon have a clean and easy fix that eliminates the objectionable flare.
 
Thanks for the props, Adam. I used the astro-flock on my M and have had no real issues with the flare. Looking forward to Doug's fix...

Mike
 
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