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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Philosophy change...

Mark L. Pederson said:
The "APPLE" strategy of not announcing products in development and planned feature specs until shipping - or immediately before shipping - seems to be working okay for them ....
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Today, sure. But they went through 20 years of very modest growth (even some years of negative profit) before they arrived where they are now. Stock value didn't even begin to explode off the charts until 2007 - 30 years after they incorporated.

Every company is different, but certainly RED would not be the kind of company they are today without their unique approach to business from the start. I think Kujtim is spot on; that sense of community and fostering of ideas is what gave them soul, and now with an absolute industry-changing product in their hands (and another waiting in the wings), it's a completely appropriate time to shift gears. Jim is one smart guy.
 
Pawel Achtel said:
I think providing future release information and setting expectations was, in large part, the reason of RED's success and the following.

By saying what you were "going to do" you could obtain early feedback and allow the customers to plan ahead. It also alerts the competition and, in case you also communicated the delivery date, a likely delay. There are pros and cons of either approach. But, perhaps there is some balance in letting customers know what to expect and better manage equipment acquisition. If you announce when it is available you are running a higher risk of missing expectations and the demand may not be as good because it is unexpected and many people would have possibly bought an alternative monitor, camera, lens or other piece of kit.

I think feeding relevant and useful information allowing planning and feedback can benefit everyone if done properly. Of course, there will always be some dissatisfied posters but, I think, the benefits can not be easily ignored.
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But things have changed...

At the beginning RED needed access to "us" for feedback and buildiing a customerbase.
It made sense.
Now, as much of the development is geared more towards larger and more NDA oriented operations, the needs of feedback from smaller and less experienced machines has understandably gone down.

The shift came pretty much with Pirates/RedLogFilm last fall

What Jim states now, is basically a confirmation of a pracsis that has been in place for at least a year and a half.

By and large...

And it was easy to predict...

RED is more similar companies in that respect than what they initially were.
And they have more ground to protect and fight for.

No issues with that.

The timing: When Epic-x finally is being delivered - is a logical one. Actually Jim stated pretty much the same once they started building the M's. This is just re-stating ehat has been pracsise for a while.

Fantastic that they still interact with us to the degree they do!

Thanks!

G
 
I agree, Gunleik :)
I personally hope that the teasing will diminish a bit, too. ;)
 
Big, big change. So by definition, not without some risk. M
 
Mark L. Pederson said:
The "APPLE" strategy of not announcing products in development and planned feature specs until shipping - or immediately before shipping - seems to be working okay for them ....
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Technically that's most companies strategy.

Mostly because they are public companies and cannot speak outside the boundaries of a given quarter legally.

RED of course can do anything they want as a private company, but Jim's move is the right one.

Manage information and you can manage expectation. I'm sure everyone here, while missing the 'on the leading edge of info' that RED is always giving, would much rather not stress over when something might ship or be ready and just hit the BUY NOW button in the store the moment there's a sweet announcement a new piece is ready and able to be purchased.

Kudos Jim.
 
This is the death of Reduser Recon.

Even though it seems like a wise decision, I cannot help but thinking the Scarlet-people have once again been neglected, just before some fulfilling announcement.
 
Maybe when something is in beta, an early headsup when something is coming ? By then industrial spies will have passed on the particulars to the competition so the time advantage will already be locked in.

It's just that many of us are willing buyers if we have time to shift priorities to make funds available. RED products aren't inexpensive gadgets like Apple or some other secretive company sells; therefore, to get that initial sales bounce we customers need some prior knowledge.
 
Jesper Sichlau said:
This is the death of Reduser Recon.

Even though it seems like a wise decision, I cannot help but thinking the Scarlet-people have once again been neglected, just before some fulfilling announcement.
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I am not so sure about that, extrapolating from what was said this spring about "Scarlet being hot on the heels after epic-x release", we will probably see the Scarlet fixed in no time. If we dont I am fully confident the RedTeam wants it out more than we do, well worth the wait for us.

We are going to have so much new details to figure out about the things released already, it wont matter with rumors anymore.

Wise decision Jim & co, perfect timing, and THANK YOU for giving us a few glipmses into the real world of tech innovation and production.
 
Mark L. Pederson said:
The "APPLE" strategy of not announcing products in development and planned feature specs until shipping - or immediately before shipping - seems to be working okay for them ....
Click to expand...

yes, exactly. The most lead you'll get on their products in the way of an announcement will be a month and then it'll be released. But i think its probably already done by then, it just hasnt been made in big enough quantities.
 
Jim, would you tell us you guys were not making something? (Epic-S for example)

If for whatever reason, it got too expensive or it wasnt a good financial decision to make them, would you be able to tell us that?

(last question i'll ask about it haha)
 
Kinda disappointing that this philosophy change comes just before getting to know more about the Scarlet. It seems that's always the way. We find out about the EPIC and other products, but when it comes to the Scarlet, we just get silence.

I guess that's down to all the bitching in the past. But it would be good to get updates regarding the tech that has already been mapped out and reserve the new philosophy for upcoming tech that has not been mentioned yet, IMO.
 
I think this new change in philosophy is great and though its nice to chat about Scarlet ad infinitem, I think this is better.

A simple thought: -- a little direction on the "process of releasing information" would help (though I am thinking Scarlet, this could apply to other products too)

Since Red seems to have become a big niche company (wasn't there 8,000 people hitting refresh the other night?) then maybe if we had the following it would be very cool for us. (and I could be out of my place for suggesting) but if we all knew the process of release of info through till to receipt of goods.

Suggested steps: (via emails, and summary page and the normal forms, twitter too)

1. Announce a new thing is being considered
2. small announcements as the product is in development, as appropriate (Scarlet waypoint info has been very helpful to me deciding to wait for a Scarlet)
3. announcement of final schedule (like Apple, "we will be announcing something related to "X" on such and such a date, usually one week out) so those that care can start to pay attention and plan payments (the cinex-pro announcement, has I known it was just cool software, not a hardware announcement, I would have needed less caffeine yesterday...)
4. Full announcement and product unveil, broadcast via a quicktime akaimia streamed video to the potential 8,000+ viewers. It would be very "communal" and get us all fired up - plus it would really give you guys a chance to show off the product and let the Red Team take an appropriate bow.
5. At that announcement, also set the release date for actual purchase. So we can get our financial items in order and then, like Apple does with their iPhone/iPads we can all try to hit "submit" at 3amEST..
4. Shipment and further developments
5. again, a straight summary page; like a wiki, would really help. I have to read through pages and pages of "go Red" to get the good info on whats going on with the company, products and services.

Just my two cents.
 
This is an evolutionary move .... RED is now in the SONY Panasonic league.
RED must utilize it's Executive talent more economically ... maybe let them sleep, once in a while.
The Epic (with upgrades/modifications) gives us all the equipment to make movies for the next five years.
We should all now concentrate on workflow/computers etc. We have the camera!
On the Scarlet front .... What about all these Battle Tested R1's with MX upgrades?
Young Low budget Indie filmmakers should snap up the R1's with MX .... and blow HOLLYWOOD out of the water.
 
Okay,

this is what I see and why I posted what I posted on my first reply here in this thread...

Jim loves 4k... And so do we...

Jim has been pushing for 4k as a new standard from the beginning, while no one else was listening...

Jim now has sold close to 9000 RED ONE cameras, and over 1000 EPIC M, with the result of literally every Major 3D movie and many of non 3D shooting EPIC to get a 4k finish full blast...

Now every one else capable in off is turning around and pushing forward what they had pushed back till yesterday... 4K!!

So, now that every one else is paying attention and pushing 4k Jim, I am sure that is a very happy man... However, now that every one else is paying attention and introducing competing products...

Well, I believe Jim must have tough, guess what, its time to stop giving the competition the heads up on what we are coming out with next year and the year after that...

After all, RED is an innovative company, and Jim sure is in my book a Visionary, but also a Business Man, and every Business Man, must think about the future of his company, Jim is doing just that!!


DO I wish to continue to have up to date info on what RED is doing for the future of my Movie making? Hell Yeah!!

But do I also wish for RED to stay on top of the game? Hell Yeah!!

Then I must accept that in order to also give them an extra edge, RED chooses to no longer tell the world their secrets, and instead be ahed of the curb by introducing gear literally ahed of times,
not allowing other companies to be aware of what is to come till it hits them hard in the face on its release date... ;)


Oh, and frankly I am getting tired of hearing "yeah but RED is always late in shipping things" It really got hold now as most do not understand
what RED is doing and Jim's decision on his transparency rule, so its just about time that this stopped and RED assumed this position now finally announced by Jim,
and it of course has my full support!!
 
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