Shooting a television pilot with the Epic

[Eric Gustavo Petersen]

It's day two of five. Sadly, I can't discuss the particulars of the pilot other than it's based on a very popular YouTube series. However, I can talk plenty about the camera.

We're shooting the pilot with an Epic (firmware 1.4.9). I wish it was the latest firmware and likely would have if it had come out a week earlier. While we could have upgraded, I didn't want any potential complications if we had. Still I don't feel as if we're hamstrung as a result. We're shooting 5K 2:1 with a 16:9 extraction and protecting for 4:3. We're using Red Pro Primes as well as a set of Arri Macros. The camera is mounted mostly to a Weaver Steadman on a Chapman Dolly because I hate having tripods to move around and also because we have several FX shots of actors head-to-toe and the 3rd-axis feature seemed like a good choice to turn the camera on its side quickly. It's quite a rig with a somewhat diminutive camera attached. The producer came up to me today and asked, "Is this really the camera we're using? It's so small." I agreed and reminded him it's also shooting footage that's of higher quality than anything he's ever shot.

For those interested, our camera vendor is Digital Film Studios (http://www.digitalfilmstudios.com). They put together a fantastic package for us and helped to make sure we were well taken care of - my thanks to you Danny.

Caring for the camera is our DIT Eric Ulbrich, 1st AC Ron Elliot and 2nd AC Mishka Kornai. Thank you guys for an amazing job.

Here are some of my preliminary thoughts about the camera...

So what's gone wrong: Minor stuff really. Had a shot with a few dropped frames but fortunately it was something we could easily edit around and we also had other takes. The monitor on a handful of times would do this weird screen split thing but that was remedied with a reboot (that is super fast now). The biggest hiccup has been getting "battery spike" warning which we're forced to reboot. The inability to record sound or to playback footage makes my brain hurt.

And what's gone right: So much!

Perfect camera for a VFX heavy show. Nearly every shot we're doing is on blue or green screen. The footage has been keying and looking great. Having the huge range of compression choices has been extremely helpful.

We shot 48 fps on 5K today! As someone who has shot a bunch on the Red One, what an absolute joy it is to shoot high speed and not take a resolution hit.

Ten seconds to boot up! Seriously?! I used to die a little every time I needed to reboot the Red One. It's silly but now when we need to reboot, I almost welcome it just to see how fast the camera does it!

While this show will be shot entirely on a stage, I can't wait to shoot on location with this the Epic. I've loved shooting Canon 5D because of the size of the camera and how freeing it is. While the Epic is not light as a feather it is vastly smaller and lighter than the Red One which makes me look forward to shooting inside a car or small New York apartment.

Redmote… awesome. Touchscreen monitor… awesome. SSD download times… awesome.

I've shoot three feature on the Red One and a numerous commercial and yet I've never considered myself a "fan boy". Still don't. BUT… This experience has definitely strengthened my believe that this particular show will benefit and be able to grow with this camera as future firmware's reveal the wonderful capabilities of the Epic. As I work on more and bigger shows, I am often reminded that Red got it absolutely right in pushing for 4K (and now beyond). Kudos to everyone at Red for all the hard work - I'm not looking forward to Thursday when we're done shooting but do look forward to my next Epic show.

 

[Ketch Rossi]

Glad to hear you enjoyed EPIC Eric,

newest build 1.6.12 it will rock your world, and so will the new Redmote reboot...

As Steve and I were the second in the world to take delivery of an Epic M with M8 I am pleased to say that even so the camera has seen the world around (literally) tossed form bag to bag,
we never had such issues with battery s and or power spikes, I believe this can also be a issue with some batteries and or connections simply not been as good.

The split screen thing we did had one of those several months ago on the first build but never since the very first update.

We never use in camera Audio, even so we might for a future in August as a reference track, and I do believe it is in fact active,
as far as Playback, that is to come, but I would still not play back form original media, that is just me...

With options of H.264 pout form Teradek and LightIron's LivePlay capability to record H.664 on an iPad is really no need to play back form camera on original media,
again my preference.

To not forget of course is that this is still a Pre-Production camera, so I could not be more happy, and happier at every build update, of course this last one tops them all...

Happy shooting Eric!!

 

[paulherrin]

eric, if you want to update the firmware, you can always roll it back if you get worried about it. doesn't take long at all, and there's really not much risk involved. but it's up to you. i definitely understand leaving things the way they are if they're working... if it ain't broke don't fix it (as it were)

thanks for sharing, glad to hear you're enjoying the camera... have fun!

 

[Eric Ulbrich]

Hey Guys!
Just sitting at the DIT cart here today getting the day going for our "top secret" tv pilot. Camera has been fantastic and Im really happy to be working with Eric to get a great image for this show. Our client has seems thrilled and happy and it really seems like this is the camera for us to be doing a VFX heavy show on. Our Director has specifically noted how happy he is that he can push deep into shots. I have been getting offload speeds for a ful 128 GB ssd on my macpro tower in a little under 20 min with all footage being transcoded on the rocket in around 15 min as well, (sadly one of my offload drives is on FW 800) need a new estata card...I have to stress if you want to shoot EPIC your going to need a rocket, its the only way to fly and it flys beautifully!

With that said, some of the things im super happy w on camera:
The TC jam is so easy and quick and solid all day.
Blackshading holds really well all day,
Redmote is great for rolling when your blowing stuff up :w00t:


To answer some questions we stayed with build 1.4.9 because we stared shooting this literally the day after the camera came off another job, I would have loved to put the new build on, but as I knew this one was working great and had no time to test before the camera went out again. Im sure the new build is fine and im itching to get my hands on it, I just like consistency when im rolling from job to job, I have a music video coming up soon and will install the new build then.

Batteries and power:
Were using a hot-swap battery plate on the camera one of those shark fins and aaton bauer mount house of power batteries and they work great! Only a few power spikes and honestly when the camera takes only 10 sec to boot its not really an issue. Ive heard a few epic-M owners mention power spikes and im sure it will be solved in the not too distant future so honestly not worried here.

The "split screen effect"
Basically sometimes when we roll back and forth between highspeed mode and regular mode, parts of our monitoring get chunky, its a quick little thing that never shows up in the footage and a quick reboot will take care of it, so no stress there.

Ketch I understand what you mean but have to disagree with your comment about not playing back from source media. As a tester for teradek and the cube (i own and encoder, decoder and router a complete kit,) I love the proxy recording and wireless HD abilities but remember even if you record to an external source you cannot get playback in varispeed mode with the designated framerate. So if you shoot 120 FPS at a 23.98 timebase in camera you cannot play it back with the cube with the proper playback speed of 23.98, so you cannot review slow-motion...sad but a quick eject of the SSD over to my 30" cinema display and playback is done, no problem!

Obviously we all know the camera is still in dev mode and honestly Im thrilled with it so no complaints here, I think Eric our DOP has been thrilled too, we have all had a great time with the camera so no worries on our set, confidence all around!

PS Paul once you go to the new build my understanding is you cannot roll back, so that wasn't an option for us at the time.

Digital Film Studios is thrilled to have Eric shooting on our EPIC-M if you want more info about DFS and renting our EPIC-M for your production go to: http://www.digitalfilmstudios.com/

Im gonna see if I can get Eric to post a few photos of the camera sometime soon!

 

[Dan Kanes]

Re: Dropped Frames: Did a dropped frame warning come up on camera?

Thanks!

Dan

PS: I had the pleasure of working with Eric and #442 on a shoot - have to say I fell in love with the M!!!

 

[Greg McDonald]

Alright Eric P., well both Eric's actually, you're making me jealous! Can't wait to shoot something with the Epic with you.

Second the question on the dropped frames, haven't heard of anyone else having that problem. Did you get an error message, what were the circumstances?

 

[Eric Ulbrich]

Honestly guys I dont know. I wasn't around camera so I dont know if it gave a warning I only noticed it when I got a 2 frame error on frames 466 and 480 when transcoding to pro-res, No big issue.

were all aware here that were blazing trails with a dev camera, so dev issues are going to rise. Its the talented and diligent people around the camera making sure that it preforms its best that counts and allows for most of these issues to be really minor and not affect production.

I understand peoples need for information about issues but lets not make a big deal out of nothing ok? I dont want to have to worry about biting my tongue when I want to post something cool because people are going to dissect it into a discussion about the cameras problems. Its growing and getting better everyday, where its at now is already next level shit, so we should all be happy and look towards the future no?

 

[Stacey Spears]

Blackshading holds really well all day

Does blackshading actually work in 1.4.n? Its much different in 1.6.n.

 

[Dan Kanes]

Sorry - not trying to stir the pot - just hoping to find out how to resolve any dev issues that may arise - I'm working an epic job today too @ 300fps! Shit is DOPE!

 

[Eric Ulbrich]

Sorry - not trying to stir the pot - just hoping to find out how to resolve any dev issues that may arise - I'm working an epic job today too @ 300fps! Shit is DOPE!

No problem man! I totally understand. Seems like it was a power spike while rolling that caused it camera still let us cut No problem before we shut down. the drops just might be at the initial hit of the spike (just a conjecture)

 

[Greg McDonald]

Eric - that explains it. Thanks. Intentions get easily misinterpreted on a forum. It was brought up by the OP so I asked about it.

 

[Eric Ulbrich]

Eric - that explains it. Thanks. Intentions get easily misinterpreted on a forum. It was brought up by the OP so I asked about it.

Totally, one of the main reasons I dont post a ton here. I wish I could but I dont want to deal with all the BS of people who dont understand how to use and work with the camera. I feel as a M owner we have a responsibility to RED and the community to try and avoid what happened with the R1 and the bad PR FUD people gave it so quickly.

Smiles all around...

Back to the original thought of this thread. EPIC FOR TV IS GREAT AND THE WORKFLOW IS SUPER EASY!

I only wish I could tell you all what show this is for... its ridiculous

 

[Deanan]

Does blackshading actually work in 1.4.n? Its much different in 1.6.n.

It works only in 1.6+

 

[Deanan]

Honestly guys I dont know. I wasn't around camera so I dont know if it gave a warning I only noticed it when I got a 2 frame error on frames 466 and 480 when transcoding to pro-res, No big issue.

Send me the log from the camera and I can check if there was
anything reported in the camera.

I highly recommend using disk arbitrator to mount read only.
A loose esata or fw800 cable or a unclean eject or power down can
cause some corruption or mess up the filesystme. Disk Arbitrator can
prevent those cases, especially with Spotlight writing it's indexs to mags.

https://github.com/aburgh/Disk-Arbitrator/downloads

 

[Eric Ulbrich]

Deanan, thanks for clearing all that up. I will check out disk arbitrator. I am currently using r3d datamanager with an md5 checksum on version 6.4 for downloading.

So for my understanding it basically moderates any volumes you mount to the system and either blocks any mounting from happening or mounting with the option for read only? Does it block the auto mount in OSX so you basically have to mount a new SSD mag through the disk arbitrator. Does this affect how r3d data manager writes its checksums to the SSD's?

 

[Tai Wah Lim]

Eric, thanks for the question. Waiting for Deanan to come back on this one - Lim

Deanan, thanks for clearing all that up. I will check out disk arbitrator. I am currently using r3d datamanager with an md5 checksum on version 6.4 for downloading.

So for my understanding it basically moderates any volumes you mount to the system and either blocks any mounting from happening or mounting with the option for read only? Does it block the auto mount in OSX so you basically have to mount a new SSD mag through the disk arbitrator. Does this affect how r3d data manager writes its checksums to the SSD's?

 

[Deanan]

Eric, thanks for the question. Waiting for Deanan to come back on this one - Lim

I replied to Eric directly over email. In summary:

You can use disk arbitrator to control mounts so that they happen read only on OSX.
Whenever it's on, subsequent mounts will happen read only but you can turn it off if you
need to put something as read/write and then turn read only back on. The readonly
state only happens when you first mount a drive so once it's mounted readonly,
it stays read only while its mounted.

I don't know if R3D data manager has an option to write the checksums elsewhere.
It would prevent writing checksum files to the original media which I don't recommend
anyway.

 

[Eric Ulbrich]

yeah got it, seems r3d datamanager still works with it. All set thanks!

 

[Conrad Hunziker]

Does this affect how r3d data manager writes its checksums to the SSD's?

R3D Data Manager does not write anything to any source media.

 

[Eric Ulbrich]

ah ok, my mistake. Thanks for clearing that up!