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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Please convince me otherwise

David Rasberry said:
Renting is fine if you are in a major city with access to rental houses and you work at the level you do David.
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I agree about the first part, it helps to live in a major rental market, but as for the second part, obviously I didn't start out at the budget levels I currently tend to work at, and even as a beginner out of film school, owning a camera wasn't a requirement to advancement as a DP. In fact, back then, it may have been a hinderance because I would have only been able to afford 16mm equipment back in the early 1990's and would have looked for work with it, limiting myself to 16mm projects, whereas all of my early low-budget work as a DP was in 35mm. So my career wasn't limited to the equipment I was able to afford to own.

But I wonder if today things are different because the cost of ownership of decent-quality digital equipment is so much lower, so more producers than ever expect a young DP to come with his own package (ripe for exploitation I might add) -- even in a renter's market like Los Angeles.

If I ever get a camera, it would be more to either shoot my own small projects, to shoot B-roll / 2nd Unit material, or to throw in as an occasional C-camera. I don't want to even think about outfitting myself with a full-on production package. The Scarlet intrigues me because it looks like something I could handle by myself.
 
David Mullen ASC said:
But I wonder if today things are different because the cost of ownership of decent-quality digital equipment is so much lower, so more producers than ever expect a young DP to come with his own package (ripe for exploitation I might add) -- even in a renter's market like Los Angeles.

If I ever get a camera, it would be more to either shoot my own small projects, to shoot B-roll / 2nd Unit material, or to throw in as an occasional C-camera. I don't want to even think about outfitting myself with a full-on production package. The Scarlet intrigues me because it looks like something I could handle by myself.
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Bingo. Scarlet is more of a near retirement serious hobby camera for me. I don't have to make a living with it, just find enough small projects to help defray the cost. It is nice when the toys can pay for themselves. But I am more interested in pursuing some personal documentary and experimental art projects with it. My last hobby camera, a Canon GL2, paid for itself with one job documenting a water line construction project.

Sure I would love to have an Epic, but Scarlet is already stretching the budget range to the edge of discomfort. I just really like what this little camera offers.
 
The fixed scarlets 3k raw codec 120fps and ssd long record times with great lens and professional audio inputs will be an awesome future proofed aquisition tool. It will be complimented nicely with upcoming thunderbolt technologies for editing so all i can say is that for me waiting a few more months is well worth it .
 
Hunter Peterson said:
Hey guys.

-2/3rds sensor is too small and DOF is essentially lost as compared to a T2i
-Way too expensive
Thanks guys.
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Hmm, this post normally would have been a non read as we are talking apples and oranges... but it got me thinking, why would you make a 2/3 sensor in this day and age when full frame sensors are not that expensive? Don't get me wrong, red understands filmmakers so the camera will be capable of things, we'll most camera will never be able to do. Does this stem from a goal of 3k for 3k 2 years ago. or is there hundreds of boards that I have not read that talks of this. To me, at the end of the day it's about what the picture looks like coming from the feild. I was impressed with the recent footage from scarlet.

I agree that gap is closing in technology, but the companies are very far away in philosophy. Canon is too mass market, and Arri is too top heavy to go into a lower price point.
 
2/3" , 16mm film image sized format is very popular in its own right with a lot of practical strengths. It needs no justification beyond that for its existence alongside 35mm anything.
 
Michael Dalton said:
it got me thinking, why would you make a 2/3 sensor in this day and age when full frame sensors are not that expensive?
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You said it yourself - Canon is mass market. It and the other big players have the economy of scale to be able to produce s35 sensors that are cheap enough to put in their cheap cameras. Combined with the fact that the Mysterium X sensor is probably a hell of a lot more complex than the still camera sensors that Canon, Sony, Nikon etc. use, (far, far higher frame rates, faster read-reset, higher resolution etc.), it's probably not yet cheap enough to produce to put the s35 sized one in the lower end Scarlet.

I'm sure that in 5 years, you'll be able to buy something better than EPIC-S at Scarlet's ~$6,000 price point.
 
Hunter Peterson said:
-Resolution means nothing.
-No computers can handle it
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The second your friend is simply incorrect about, but the first reveals that he is an idiot.

Stephen Gentle said:
I'm sure that in 5 years, you'll be able to buy something better than EPIC-S at Scarlet's ~$6,000 price point.
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Red One has been around about that long and it's still unmatched at any price point...
 
David Rasberry said:
2/3" , 16mm film image sized format is very popular in its own right with a lot of practical strengths. It needs no justification beyond that for its existence alongside 35mm anything.
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My decision on a Scarlet Cinema is based entirely on this point. I like the 16mm format. On other posts the list of films that have been sucessful using this format always pops up, but what it comes down to is personal preferance. I love 16mm film, the more I see out-of-focus DSLR footage the more I want that depth-of-field without having to work so hard for it.

(and as an aside, I am activly lobbying for David Mullen to get a few Scarlets and make a film!)
 
"Guys guys come here!"
[everyone joins in a huddle] :grouphug:

"Listen we all know the Scarlet is going to be amazing but if we convince him not to get a Scarlet..."

[looks over to making sure hes not listening, then whispers] :glare:

".....that will be one less person we have to fight on the waiting list"

[raises his eye brows] :ihih:

"ehh ehh"

And scene! :biggrinjester:
 
Tim Nitsch said:
"Guys guys come here!"
[everyone joins in a huddle] :grouphug:

"Listen we all know the Scarlet is going to be amazing but if we convince him not to get a Scarlet..."

[looks over to making sure hes not listening, then whispers] :glare:

".....that will be one less person we have to fight on the waiting list"

[raises his eye brows] :ihih:

"ehh ehh"

And scene! :biggrinjester:
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LOL

In essence, I'm arguing for shooting as soon as you are ready with the camera you can get as opposed to waiting for "the camera you want" to shoot.

I do have to say that while I encourage a user to shoot with what they can get now, even if that is a DSLR, its almost a no brainer to spend some cash on a Scarlet fixed.

So, if one is asking whether they should buy a Scarlet ... then obviously if you have any enthusiasm for making moving images the answer is a resounding YES!!!.

This of course is rather the opposite of getting folks out of line for a Scarlet. :)
 
All joking aside, I don't think anyone can make the decision for you.

Im my situation I can either get a Scarlet or get something else completely. I don't have the money to get something like a T2i while waiting for the Scarlet, but I can borrow a 7D from a friend if I really need it so that also helps.

I think you need to take into consideration whether or not that camera is going to be paying the bills. If it is, then you might want to go with the DSLR route so you can start making money now and pick up a Scarlet down the road.
If its not essential to pay the bills or if you can use something else while your waiting, I'd say just wait for the Scarlet is going to be totally worth it.


Bottom line:

:biggrin: Scarlet > DSLRS :sad:
 
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This is directed to Jarred, Ted or anyone else at RED who may have viewed Scarlet fixed lens footage on the big screen. How would you describe the projected image? Does it look and feel like 16mm? Something between 16 and 35? Or something else altogether. I am curious RED.

Many thanks:
 
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