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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Epic x soon?

Jannard said:
...We have found alternate sources (as have all of the other major companies) of parts that were exclusively made in Northern Japan. All of us are just waiting and in line for these parts and pieces. It appears that a solution to the supply of these parts will allow production of EPIC-X to begin in earnest in June. We have a full production facility and 98% of the components ready and waiting to rock as soon as we receive these parts...

Jim
Click to expand...

Around 30 days...
 
Jim said at the May 3rd resolution event at Red Studious that the Epic M's were going out now because they were able to find the parts they are missing (tsunami reasons) in small quantities and outrageous prices. He said that some parts were up to 20X the normal cost! Its this additional parts cost as well as the machining costs that account for the price difference of Epic Ms and Epic Xs. They couldn't make Epic Xs at those parts prices and still make money, so Epic Xs are on hold until the supply chain is re established at normal costs. He didn't give a time frame, so I assume that June is still the target for Epic Xs to start being assembled. We shall see :)
 
EPIC -X parts

EPIC -X parts

Hi,
In an earlier post it was stated by JIM that there are around 18parts that are required to start delivering the EPIC-X.
If those parts are still a problem and if an offer is made to the STAGE II red owners adding the extra amount RED has to chalk out for these parts to get EPIC X on the delivery line ,I think most of the guys will lap it up....
Harcharan
 
I have been saying for months now.... if you have the funds, order the Epic M right away. Trying to save ten grand by waiting for the X is not a wise move, IMO. A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush.
 
I think you'll find parts pricing must come down. Parts are costing up to 2000% what they are normally. Not economical.
So said Jim yesterday at RSH.
Click to expand...

If that's the case.

I think RED should make sure they deliver all the X's stages commitments as of now, and then close that loop.

Start a new line of Epic-T "Titanium" at a higher price.

That would be interesting?

Brain F#%t

Hehe
 
EPIX -M and EPIC-X diffrence

EPIX -M and EPIC-X diffrence

Hi,
I am trying to calculate the difference between EPI-M and EPIC-X (correct me if I am wrong)


EPIC-M EPIC-X
------- -------

EPIC-M Brain with titanium PL mount (machined) : EPIC-X Brain upgrade price(MXED CAMERA) USD18250=00
Bomb EVF : BOMB EVF USD 3200=00
5" Touchscreen LCD (machined) : 5" Touchscreen LCd included in upgrade
DSMC Side Handle (machined) : DSMC Side Handle (Machined)(Approx) USD 750=00
DSMC Side SSD Module (machined) : DSMC Side SSD Module USD 1500=00
REDmote (machined) : REDmote included in upgrade
4x 128GB SSD cards : 4x126GB SSD cards USD 7200=00
4x REDVolt batteries and travel charger : Two extra REDvolt batteries and charges USD 1200=00
Custom laser-cut foam EPIC Pelican 1510 case : Case USD 600=00
2 years of warranty coverage :1 Year extra warranty (Approx value) USD 5000=00

TOTAL USD58000=00 USD 37700=00

So approximately the difference is around USD20,000/. How it is coming to ten grands...Am I missing something.

Thks
Harcharan
 
Last edited:
Harcharan Singh said:
Hi,

Can someone put a 'actual' difference one has to pay by comparing the price of EPIC-M and EPIC-X.

Thks

Harcharan
Click to expand...

It's impossible to properly quantify the exact cost difference until Red clarifies the current stage system. I think it is inaccurate to say that it is simply a $10,000 difference. It might be fairly close for a complete outsider, but not for a stage eligible camera owner.

For a stage eligible camera owners to buy an Epic-M, it means they will either end up buying two Epic cameras (1 M, 1 X), or sell their place in line for the Epic-X.

Furthermore, Stage 2 and 3 owners currently expect some camera accessories (LCD, modules, module adapter, Redvolts and charger, etc.) as a loyalty bonus. If stage eligible camera owners were able to utilize their trade in value toward an Epic-M, it might very well sway some to go that direction. However, it would still cause confusion among Stage 2 and 3 owners until there is more "bonus module" information out there.

My guess is that Red wants to wait and see where the Japanese price environment will level out. Then they will crunch the numbers and refine the new stage system.
 
Whether the difference is $10,000 ... $15,000 ... or $20,000 between M and Stage 2 or 3 -- I think it's pretty safe to say that many M owners have (or will) have recouped the price difference during the time gap (between receiving an M, and whenever Stage 2 or 3 ships) via rentals and jobs.

My problem is that I'm staying temporarily working/living in a country where rental is not that viable of an option. And by the time I'm back in LA full time later this summer, we should be pretty close to early Stage 3. So the premium doesn't make as much sense for me.

But overall, I agree with Tom -- if I was someplace where I could be renting it and putting it to work on paid jobs -- I would not hesitate on the M ...
 
But if you're business plan was to trade in and trade up to the Epic . . .
then you have to hope very hard that someone in Japan (or elsewhere) comes through reasonably soon.
 
Jim McKinney said:
But if you're business plan was to trade in and trade up to the Epic . . .
then you have to hope very hard that someone in Japan (or elsewhere) comes through reasonably soon.
Click to expand...

Exactly. For folks who are impatient, need the camera and can earn significantly immediately, M makes sense. For guys like me (stage 3, limited budget) a choice between $60k for M, and $10k plus R1 trade-in for Stage 3 X... is no choice at all.

If it's only 18 bloody parts out of thousands... they *can't*, individually or collectively, add *that* much to the cost of the camera... if RED have to put a few hundred bucks on the price tag we would understand I'm sure. I suspect the bigger issue is simply the logistics of running a production line; small-batch irregular supplies of components are not such a big deal when you're hand-building a few hundred (EPIC-M), but are a serious problem when you're trying to start a line making thousands (EPIC-X) and a complete non-starter when you're making tens of thousands (Scarlet).

The actual component part cost of electronics tends to be a fairly small percentage of the purchase price remember - you're paying for a LOT of R&D, assembly & QC, overheads, support, and profit. At least with RED there's not much marketing budget; everyone who matters knows who they are, what they do, and how good they are at it :)

Mike
 
Mike 'Fireman' Ross said:
Exactly. For folks who are impatient, need the camera and can earn significantly immediately, M makes sense. For guys like me (stage 3, limited budget) a choice between $60k for M, and $10k plus R1 trade-in for Stage 3 X... is no choice at all.

If it's only 18 bloody parts out of thousands... they *can't*, individually or collectively, add *that* much to the cost of the camera... if RED have to put a few hundred bucks on the price tag we would understand I'm sure. I suspect the bigger issue is simply the logistics of running a production line; small-batch irregular supplies of components are not such a big deal when you're hand-building a few hundred (EPIC-M), but are a serious problem when you're trying to start a line making thousands (EPIC-X) and a complete non-starter when you're making tens of thousands (Scarlet).

The actual component part cost of electronics tends to be a fairly small percentage of the purchase price remember - you're paying for a LOT of R&D, assembly & QC, overheads, support, and profit. At least with RED there's not much marketing budget; everyone who matters knows who they are, what they do, and how good they are at it :)

Mike
Click to expand...

I understand what you're saying Mike ... but not quite an apples-to-apples comparison there. What you get in Stage 3 is NOT equal to what comes in an M package -- as it was announced before, it doesn't have the side handle, SSD module, SSD media, or Bomb EVF. That's probably about $12-15,000 in extras to equal an M package. So really, it's more like Red One + $23-25,000. With Epic-M being $58,000, the real difference is more like $13,000-18,000 (forgive me if my math sucks, these are all very quick mental estimates.)

Now if you consider someone in a Stage 3 position (let's assume end of July for delivery date), who has rental demand or client needs where the M would enable them to profit from extra rentals/jobs ... and that person got an M in early April, that person essentially has 4 months where he'd have the M in hand, and would only need about $4-5000 per month in M-camera-generated income for it to be a smart business decision. Anything over that would be gravy.

Also, this is not even factoring in that some are selling their Stage 2's at a slight profit, and then using that extra money to help finance the M. With the extra money and head start with the camera, they get into the green that much faster.

Like I said, if I were somewhere that I could aggressively rent it or use it to land new jobs, the M would be a no brainer now. But I'm not, so it doesn't.

But given how many smart Redusers are dropping the $58k lately, it's obviously that it's a great business move for many of these guys :)
 
Looking for a silver lining to the Epic X delay? Then consider that there should be plenty of modules, media, and firmware upgrades completed by the time it ships. Not sure if that would have been the case if it had shipped according to previous schedule.
 
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