Rethinking the Epic-X bundle?

[Steven-Marc C.]

There has been talk on another thread of rethinking the original Epic-X bundle, particularly to include the side handle, in place of another module, like the I/O module perhaps.
This has got me thinking that it might be opportune to rethink the original Epic-X package altogether. Of course this is entirely Red's decision to make and I am just very grateful for the original deal, but I thought they might be interested in our thoughts and our planned usage/purchase of other modules.

I realize prices of modules may still change, but unless I'm mistaken there were around $6000 of modules included in the Stage 2 Epic-X bundle.

I looked at what is to be included with the Epic-M package, as it seems these might the modules available from the start, and came up with a similar bundle:

- Epic Brain
- 5" Touchscreen LCD
- Side Handle
- Side SSD Module
- REDmote
- 1x 128GB SSD card (or 2x64GB ?)
- 4x batteries and charger

I haven't done any precise calculations but I'm guessing the pricing to be somewhat similar to that of the original bundle (please correct me if I'm wrong). This would get us a fully functionnal, ready-to-shoot package.

I would probably then get the pro I/O module separately. Not entirely sure about the battery module yet. It might be convenient to use Red Bricks or other industry standard batteries for when longer runtime is needed, rather than the RedVolt module, especially now that startup time is down to a few seconds.

I guess another option would be to give Stage 2/3 buyers an allowance, similar to what was done with early R1 reservation holders.

Again, not criticizing or second-guessing the original deal, but since Jarred seemed to agree the bundle might change I thought we'd give them our input.
I'd be interested in hearing other users and Red's thoughts on this.

 

[Elsie N]

Steven,

I like the idea of different bundles.

Good thoughts.

 

[David Battistella]

I think it is a good idea and I believe JArred did say that RED are exploring this as a "possible" option.

I like the side handle, SSD module set up a lot. It makes a lot of sense. I 'd like to "rent" modules for certain shoots, but I'd like a setup that can handle most situations. Thinking two person crew or single user here, not the big feature setup.

Side Handle
SSD
Base Audio I/O module
RedMote, (which I'n not even sure of because of the touchscreen)

With Boot times down to 7 seconds, battery changes are going to be simpler than with R1


David

 

[R. Schorman]

I thought that the pro I/O was the only module to have full sized XLR ports in which case I would definitely want one included. But I agree that a variety of options would be great!

 

[David Battistella]

Personally, I'd rather have 4 audio INPUTS in mini XLR. I already have all the cables I need and I don't want to have to move back to full size XLR now and give up 2 tracks of onboard audio.

Audio guys will hate me but stick with mini XLR, it's one extra audio snake in the kit.

David

 

[Michael Hastings]

There has been talk on another thread of rethinking the original Epic-X bundle, particularly to include the side handle, in place of another module, like the I/O module perhaps.
This has got me thinking that it might be opportune to rethink the original Epic-X package altogether. Of course this is entirely Red's decision to make and I am just very grateful for the original deal, but I thought they might be interested in our thoughts and our planned usage/purchase of other modules.

I realize prices of modules may still change, but unless I'm mistaken there were around $6000 of modules included in the Stage 2 Epic-X bundle.

I looked at what is to be included with the Epic-M package, as it seems these might the modules available from the start, and came up with a similar bundle:

- Epic Brain
- 5" Touchscreen LCD
- Side Handle
- Side SSD Module
- REDmote
- 1x 128GB SSD card (or 2x64GB ?)
- 4x batteries and charger

I haven't done any precise calculations but I'm guessing the pricing to be somewhat similar to that of the original bundle (please correct me if I'm wrong). This would get us a fully functionnal, ready-to-shoot package.

I would probably then get the pro I/O module separately. Not entirely sure about the battery module yet. It might be convenient to use Red Bricks or other industry standard batteries for when longer runtime is needed, rather than the RedVolt module, especially now that startup time is down to a few seconds.

I guess another option would be to give Stage 2/3 buyers an allowance, similar to what was done with early R1 reservation holders.

Again, not criticizing or second-guessing the original deal, but since Jarred seemed to agree the bundle might change I thought we'd give them our input.
I'd be interested in hearing other users and Red's thoughts on this.

As an accessory manufacturer (underwater housing) I kind of liked the idea that Epic-X would provide a common "standard package" so not thrilled with a totally a la carte approach. Also think it helps RED to have a standard package so they know how many of those modules they need to make/schedule and might be easier to just have a single standard box with everything as I propose below and then any differences would be add-on and completely separate boxes so easier for packaging and inventory purposes.

For starters, here's the Epic-X package from the Oct 30th (2009) announcement thread:

http://reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=37011

1x 5" LCD $1600 (stage 3 get 2.8" LCD instead)
1x REDMOTE $550
1x Side CF Module $550 - may not be made, probably switching to side 1.8"
1x Module Adaptor $300
1x Base I/O Module $1750 (pro $2950)
1x Pro Battery Module w/2x REDVOLT standard batteries $1250
1x travel charger ($NA ~$200?)

Other stuff:
Side Handle $950
Bottom HANDLE $350
BASE PLATE $500
Top Mount $200
Red Mattebox $1200
Electronic mounts (RED, Nikon, Canon) $500
Dual CF rear module $950
Bomb EVF $3200

So it seems like the closest exchange would be the $1750 base I/O module for the side handle $950 and a 64 gig REDMAG $950 (total $1900), so $150 difference (maybe throw out a battery from the standard "box" package to even it out - you normally only get one battery with a camcorder anyway). This would give you a complete "right out of the box" shooting package in either configuration.

Choice of I/O module would be an add on option - and RED doesn't have to keep track of who wanted to upgrade the standard to the Pro which was also discussed. Additional batteries optional and you could choose the normal or XL size.

And remember, they already have hundreds of Stage 2 people with large deposits so they can't alter the program too much, but the REDMAG seems like a nobrainer since you have to have it.

 

[Steven-Marc C.]

Ok, to be clear, I didn't suggest an "a la carte" approach. I was merely thinking of how the standard package could be modified to fit what seems to be the most common use of the camera now that we are nearing delivery and that Red has a clearer picture of how the pieces are going to all fit together.

 

[Elsie N]

Michael did make a good point about RED needing the certainty of the original package in order to arrange for supply. I'm guessing they are looking at where they can be flexible, if at all, and will act on their internal knowledge.

 

[Elsie N]

Personally, I'd rather have 4 audio INPUTS in mini XLR. I already have all the cables I need and I don't want to have to move back to full size XLR now and give up 2 tracks of onboard audio.

Audio guys will hate me but stick with mini XLR, it's one extra audio snake in the kit.

David

I'm o.k. with the mini XLR inputs too. For my information, doesn't the basic IO module have mini XLR? Not sure how many ports though.

 

[Joe Kleber]

In another thread, I listed the following kit as the most likely setup you would find at a rental house:

28,000...EPIC Brain with PL mount
1,600.....5" LCD
550.......REDMOTE
3,200....Bomb EVF
2,500....Side SSD Module
6,400....2 X 256GB SSDs
300.......Module Adaptor
2,950....Pro I/O Module
1,250....Pro Battery Module (with 2 batts)
500.......Base Plate
200.......Top Mount
200.......Top Mount
150.......Top Handle
160.......4 X 12" Steel Rods
360.......2 X LCD CABLE
360.......2 X Bomb EVF CABLE
135.......Power Supply



I'm guessing that most EPICs will end up being available with slight variations of this basic kit. ...seems to me that a bundle that gets you on your way to this configuration would be the way to go for many.

Isn't the a la carte or allowance idea a given, though? Hasn't RED stated that you can replace items in your bundle (and pay the difference in price if there is any)? Someone, please, correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[Michael Hastings]

In another thread, I listed the following kit as the most likely setup you would find at a rental house:

Snip...

I'm guessing that most EPICs will end up being available with slight variations of this basic kit. ...seems to me that a bundle that gets you on your way to this configuration would be the way to go for many.

Isn't the a la carte or allowance idea a given, though? Hasn't RED stated that you can replace items in your bundle (and pay the difference in price if there is any)? Someone, please, correct me if I'm wrong.

bundle doesn't matter much to rental owners who will almost certainly add a lot. Remember the epic-x is for current red1 owners only and the vast majority are individuals - many on tight budgets - so whatever allows them to actually get shooting at a minimum price is probably the most important.

There are many shooters that do corporate, documentary, advertising, etc. That could get by just fine with the package I mentioned and whatever support kit (monitors, tripods, rails, filters, matte box, red batteries, MacBook, lights, etc.) that they have been using with their Redone.

 

[Curran Giddens]

There has been talk on another thread of rethinking the original Epic-X bundle, particularly to include the side handle, in place of another module, like the I/O module perhaps.

anyone have a link to this other thread?

I really hope they keep the bundle the same for Stage 2. I will mostly be going with a cine setup where a side handle isn't needed. Also, bundles that include 64GB or 128GB SSD media don't interest me either. I plan on going all 256GB SSDs.