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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Extra $1000 (more or less) for HDRx on Scarlet?

Extra $1000 (more or less) for HDRx on Scarlet?

  • Total voters
    486
I voted NO, and I don't have an Epic anywhere in my future.

Jim, there is NO END to the kind of awesomeness you and your teams can find for pimping up a sensor. If you told us you could engineer a camera sensor that could bend space-time... It wouldn't surprise me. If you could engineer a codec that gives us 7 million lines of resolution in high dynamic range... in a data-rate less than a few pages of text file... I'd believe you.

But as long as it is still just on Reduser.net it's no use to me.

We need Scarlet. And we need it soon. You've created a monster and it cannot be caged much longer or it will die.

Please run with your current specs for the fixed 8X at least. Those modules will still have value as an entry level machine even alongside another module that is $1000 dearer containing HDRx™™™™™™™™™™.
 
Why would I pay more?

Why would I pay more?

PaulClements said:
I think that the Epic lineup has been in terrible need of a few decent high end features to really separate it from the Scarlet. High fps is one and I believe HDRx™ and one or two others could be the defining separators. I'm not convinced that lower compression cut's it as an added feature given how good Redcode has been.

If you can shoot 99% of something using the Scarlet S35 and get the same results as shooting with an Epic I just don't see the point of owning the Epic over the Scarlet. I and I'm sure many others would end up owning and using a Scarlet and simply rent an Epic for when I need to shoot slow motion. I'd like to think that a camera that's worth four times as much can do more than just one thing better.

That being said, if Red put such features into the Scarlet I'll simply sell the Epic and buy a Scarlet instead and have more money in my pocket. I doubt many people would buy an Epic brand new once the Scarlet is available.

Paul
Click to expand...

Paul you took the words out of my mouth. I agree. If I can buy an S35 Scarlet that pretty much does what the Epic does for half the price with all the accessories and recording media I could want, why would I sink money into the Epic?

Either way, both systems are going to rock!


RG
 
PaulClements said:
I think that the Epic lineup has been in terrible need of a few decent high end features to really separate it from the Scarlet.
Click to expand...

A vote for withholding features for the purpose of protecting the price of a more expensive product line? Can you say Stockholm Syndrome? Have we really been so abused that we would now encourage Red to do the exact thing that we railed against in the beginning? I understand why a business would consider such tactics, but for a consumer to subscribe to such dogma is backward thinking IMHO... No offense intended.

Red was founded on a philosophy that is against this kind of thing. It was part of the battle cry. This rebel bent is why we love Jim & Co. If the Borg were to assimilate them entirely I for one would have to consider joining the mutiny or jump ship.

Scarlet should remain accessible and expandable right up to the point that it is on par with Epic in terms of function. Modules should be available to allow that kind of upgrading. It seems reasonable that a Scarlet upgraded to the Epic level might cost as much if not more than Epic, and form factor would also be an acceptable trade-off to get there. If it costs more to physically add it, and you want it, you pay for it.

That is my rationale for voting No with module option.
 
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I'd prefer a HDR module if that was possible. If I had to choose then I'd rather have a cheaper Scarlet without the HDRx.
 
R. Gonzales said:
Paul you took the words out of my mouth. I agree. If I can buy an S35 Scarlet that pretty much does what the Epic does for half the price with all the accessories and recording media I could want, why would I sink money into the Epic?

Either way, both systems are going to rock!


RG
Click to expand...

i understand both of you completly. still, i am against artificial seperation...this sucked the past 10 years and red stopped it, red should stay this way
but before thinking of selling something, i really would like to have it in my hands :)

HDRx™ works, the cam records, the post pipeline for MX is here today, i am ready for delivery :driving:
 
The (fixed) Scarlet looks like a great tool for documentary and one-man-band work where HDRx™ feature could really come in handy.

Even if one looks at Scarlet as a B-camera for the Epic productions, it would need to have this option available so that the materials could be seamlessly matched (when Epic would use HDRx™ mode).

I can understand buyers of Epic - they might think that HDRx™ on Scarlet could compromise their investment (Scarlet having many Epic's features for a much lower price) so there could be some feature compromise: maybe Scarlet's HDRx™ capability should be limited to 24/25/30fps@3K (hopefully that way no extra board would be required)? If that is too much for current Scarlet board, maybe it can be at least possible at 24/25/30fps@2K?

If current Scarlet board just cannot perform this under any framerate/resolution, maybe a future board upgrade could be offered as an option and delivered after the release of "basic" Scarlet. But it would be great if this upgrade could be made also in other Red service centers (like in Europe) so that shipping costs/paperwork would not be cumbersome for Scarleteers.
 
*didn't feel like reading all 8 pages so don't know if this has been mentioned*

I like the idea being tossed around about the possibility of making a HRD module. The downside here would be that the price would surely come in well over the $1000 you'd pay for switching out internal boards.

My uneducated guess is in order to put both types of HDR into a module you'd more or less have to add on a second whole 'brain' complete with processors, fans, & the magic HDR boards. If I'm right, this HDR module would run closer to $3000 at which point I'd rather pay $1000 to have that option internally.

Here's another question. Would it be cheaper just to add HDRx™ & leave off EasyHDR™ since, if I'm understanding the difference between the two the HDRx™ would require much less in camera processing?
 
I am truly of mixed minds on this one. I really would love to have HDRx™™ in the 2/3" Scarlet, period. But as a serious hobbyist for the most part, that extra $1k would be pushing the limits of affordability. The package I would like to end up with is already well above $10k for a Scarlet cinema. I would drop some accessories from my initial purchase to get the HDRx feature though.
This is definitely not a low to mid range prosumer price camera if one takes everything into consideration anyway. Feature for feature it is comparable in price to other entry level 2/3" HD cameras, though it will be far more capable and higher image quality.

I like the idea of making it an add on module if that is possible. Best of both worlds there, although that would make the feature more expensive than building it in.

As fast as modern engineering methods can produce finished prototypes, I don't think it would affect the schedule much. I would rather have my Scarlet by Christmas without HDRx™™ than six months later with, but if it is going to be 6 months later anyway, I say add it.

A pox on those who consider 2/3" a lesser camera than the S35 versions. I love the idea of a fabulous 2/3" camera with Epic level performance and features. Let the S35 take the performance compromises relative to Epic.
Long live 2/3"! It is my personal favorite all around format.:hand:
 
I don't think it's as cost effective for the 2/3", but I think it definitely makes sense in the S35 and FF35 bodies. Actually I'd pay for it on the 2/3" but I'd rather not.
 
I have added thread and poll at the SCARLETUSER with more choices. The simple YES/NO is very limited...

http://www.scarletuser.com/showthread.php?t=4856

In any case I like the modular DSMC concept that makes obsolescence obsolete - so why not make a separate HDRx brains?
My main concern would not be the $1000 price tag, but rather the implications this would have on the delivery schedule...

:devil: Peter
 
Id easely pay $1000 more for Scarlet S35 if it has the HDR mode - heck I would even wait a bit longer for a Scarlet S35HDR or whatever - but for the 2/3rd I am not sure it will go down too well with some buyers.

And NO to module - heavier, more individual stuff to take care of etc - also will be even more expensive = not suited for scarlet. also the module wouldn´t be needed for epic so its a scarlet only device.

So maybe make the S35 more of an inbetween option (make it 1-2 grand more expensive for that if needed) - maybe squeeze whatever you can out of the 2/3rd and add a "small" HDR option of some kind if at all possible?!? Tough call really. It also sounds like an ASICS respin - ugh don´t know if I would wait another year for it though ;) by that time I have enough money for an epic anyways.

I would even be happy with a 1080p (scaled not cropped) HDR mode but that just me ;)

and to you elitist epic buyers wanting to deny the "poor" scarlet users the HDR option because your "investment" - I can´t write down the words I have for you I might get banned but your egocentric selfs can go to where the fire burns 24h and I will shoot it with an Scarlet HDR to see every little detail of your flesh disintegrating.
(and no I am not that mean but you get the point I hope - if not I dare you get a sony F35 to protect your investment)
 
I think HDrX would be a greater boon to the 2/3" than the S35 as there is bound to be less sensitivity and useable DR with the smaller sensor by some margin. Bigger payback IMO.
 
David Rasberry said:
A pox on those who consider 2/3" a lesser camera than the S35 versions. I love the idea of a fabulous 2/3" camera with Epic level performance and features. Let the S35 take the performance compromises relative to Epic.
Long live 2/3"! It is my personal favorite all around format.:hand:
Click to expand...

I love your passion David, but do you really think that a 2/3 with more features than the S35 fits logically within the product lines? I say they should have equal features as they are both Scarlet. To rephrase; Scarlet means feature set "X". You can get it in 2/3, S35 and (eventually) FF35. That makes sense to me.
 
I would love to have this feature, and would not mind paying $1000 extra, but ONLY if it wouldn't affect the delivery schedule. If this means a bunch more time, forget it. I want to see the camera in people's hands really soon.
 
Same as many here, I am willing to pay more for the hdr feature. But since I don't know how much extra time it would add to the release.
I voted no and Im happy go with current scarlet which will be a brilliant peace im sure!
I agree it would be better if it would be realeased as an module later.

Also to be considered is that I would problely end up single if I have to wait another 7 month extra cause of the feature. Not everybody in the family loves to hear about Scarlet news every morning for years=(
 
I say keep the Scarlet 2/3 cheap and on time. The 2/3 should beat the DR of any camera at the price, by miles.

Adding HDRx to the more expensive S35 brain, or offering a module makes more sense.
 
Peter Majtan said:
In any case I like the modular DSMC concept that makes obsolescence obsolete - so why not make a separate HDRx™ brains?
My main concern would not be the $1000 price tag, but rather the implications this would have on the delivery schedule...

:devil: Peter
Click to expand...

Another brain is a nice enough idea, but why not? Consider the implications down the line: To add a module that can bolt on to any Scarlet brain means they only have to produce one module to service all of Scarlet. On the other hand, adding HDRX internally could mean adding six new brains to your production and inventory: 2/3 Scarlet, 2/3 Scarlet HDRX, S35 Scarlet, S35 Scarlet HDRX, FF35 Scarlet, FF35 Scarlet HDRX... All for what, to save the end user $200 or so? Cost:Benefit for Red doesn't justify it.
 
YES. I would pay more for HDR in Scarlet. But please try and not delay its release.
 
Seeing as how there is no differentiation made between the 2/3" Fixed version and the S35 and up flavors, I voted no.

I'd like to see the fixed version not deviate significantly from it's current price point.. even if it means not have every feature of the bigger cams.

-sc
 
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