Post-production requirements for 2k

[Jason]

Hi all,

I am planning to get an Apple computer to finish my work on 2k.
Can anyone let me know what's the minimal system needed to work on 2k?

And what's the best workflow like for 2k?
I can edit the rough cut on DVCPRO HD, and what do I do next to conform to 2k?

Will be great if someone can point me to the right direction.
Thanks.

 

[Mike McCarthy]

Blackmagic offers some interesting options for realtime 2K edit and preview with their Multibridge and HDLink Pro solutions. All of that is uncompressed, so you will need a large Raid Array to support those data rates. Ideally you would export Uncompressed 2K Blackmagic 10bit RGB MOV files from R3D in RedCine. The MOV files will have maximum possible quality for final DPX output.

Cineform has Neo2K for Mac which allows compressed 10or12bit 2K editing without massive disk arrays. For Red, the eventual workflow would be export from R3D to Cineform MOV files in RedCine, and edit in NLE, using the graphics card for monitoring, possiby on a 30" LCD, and then export 2K DPXs if required, without having to conform for online.

Blackmagic will require a large disk array, while the Cineform solution will benefit from Quad core CPUs on the MacPro.

There are other solutions, those are simply the ones I am familiar with.

 

[Jason]

Is there any other workflow where I can use Final Cut Pro straight without additional items like Black Magic?

 

[Noah Kadner]

Is there any other workflow where I can use Final Cut Pro straight without additional items like Black Magic?

Kinda depends- you want to see footage output to an HD monitor- yes. For desktop playback only- which is not true 'finishing-' no. And on the workflow question, I'd go ProRes all the way. No reason to bring dvcprohd into the mix.

Noah

 

[Jason]

Hi Noah,

So what is the kind of Mac requirements that I should purchase for ProRes?
ProRes allows up to 2k finishing right?
Thanks for your feedback.

 

[Steve Sherrick]

My experience has been that you never have enough horsepower, even with the current crop of computers. Doesn't mean you can't get it done, just isn't as fast as you might want it to be. We have high expectations for computers these days because of the constant advances.

So, the basic theory is to get the best out there. If you are on a Mac, wait for the next generation to come out, if you don't need it right now. Anything that offers more CPU, more RAM, faster hard drives, etc will make editing and finishing much more enjoyable.

Steve

 

[Steve Sherrick]

One more thing. I have also found that when setting up editing systems, both audio and video, make sure you have everything at the appropriate rev. Always check in with the hardware/software vendors to make sure you are matching their products with the right version of OS, the appropriate drivers, etc. This can go a long way to a smooth running system as well.

Steve

 

[M Most]

Hi Noah,

So what is the kind of Mac requirements that I should purchase for ProRes?
ProRes allows up to 2k finishing right?

You seem to be very hung up on a number - in your case "2K" - and not on what you're actually going to deliver or how you're going to deliver it. What are you planning to shoot? What are you planning to make out of it? Answering these questions will lead to the correct conclusions as to what formats to convert to. If you're making DVD's you don't need "2K." If you're making HD video, you still don't need "2K." If you've got the money and plans for a film recording, then maybe "2K" has some meaning for your project. But based on your posts, it seems like you really might not know what 2K is or why you need it.

 

[Jason]

Hi mmost,
It's good that you can predict and conclude that I do not know what 2k is based on my post alone.

But fortunately, I do know what 2k is. I am just not very familiar with the Red workflow and to get to 2k.
Perhaps I should explain more on my needs so that you don't have to assume I don't need 2k using Final Cut & Red.

We made my previous project on HD and transferred to film. It was done on an Avid system, I shot on HDCAM, edited on DNxHD 1920 x 1080, not the best compression for film transfer but it was good enough for me. I then output the entire project on DPX stills for film transfer at 1920 x 1080.

Now I am planning to set up my own post-production for the same purpose, that is to make movies on HD and transfer them to film, and I plan to work on 2k, as 4k is definitely beyond my resources at the moment.

And i'm still a bit confuse with the Redcine workflow to get there, that's why I am trying to find out more from here. I just want to make sure before I start purchasing Mac, and finding out that the system I setup could not provide for my needs for 2k finishing.
Perhaps someone can help me to provide a clearer picture? Thanks.

 

[M Most]

And i'm still a bit confuse with the Redcine workflow to get there, that's why I am trying to find out more from here. I just want to make sure before I start purchasing Mac, and finding out that the system I setup could not provide for my needs for 2k finishing.
Perhaps someone can help me to provide a clearer picture? Thanks.

Since Redcine isn't out yet, there isn't a truly "clear" picture. Nor is there only one way to do what you're asking for. But I would make the suggestion that you look at this a bit differently than you looked at your last project, and embrace the idea of offline/online in the sense that there's no reason to "edit" in the final output resolution. You do your basic editing in a proxy resolution, then conform the higher resolution version prior to color correction. This is the way nearly all high end work is done - including, BTW, HD television programs, which are for the most part cut using DVCam downconversions (I'm talking about both television and features here). In the case of your last project, it might have made sense to redigitize the final sequence without compression, rather than use the "offline" version directly for a film recording. So in the case of wanting to output a 2K version of a Red project, you might want to consider either transcoding to, say, DVCPro HD or ProRes if you want to see HD images, or using Quicktime wrappers with 1K proxies, and then rebuilding the final timeline from higher resolution versions by either using 2K proxies via the QT wrappers, or transcoding to DPX sequences.

The problem here is that anything suggested today will be different a few months from now. 2K real time playback directly from the QT wrapped Red files is not possible today. In 4 or 5 months, who knows. Transcoding today takes a long time and has to be done one file at a time. 2 months from now, with Redcine, that hopefully changes. Today you can't create a timeline in Final Cut that uses a Red codec, so anything you drop into it that does (i.e., the QT wrappers for the Red files) has to be rendered and can't be played in real time until you do. To me, this is a severely restrictive way of editing, but in the future, it will be remedied. When, who knows. I guess what I'm trying to say is you're looking for semi-definitive answers with a device that doesn't yet have them. Definitive work flows don't exist until the tools are available to build them around. That's not quite the case yet.