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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Dell UltraSharp 32″ HDR PremierColor Monitor

Matt W. said:
What would you recommend? And recommend to calibrate the monitor? Again, it can be pretty bad, just needs to be ballpark.
Click to expand...

For Rec-709 you can buy an old HP DreamColor monitor, use free DisplayCal with used X-Rite i1Display and feed the monitor with HDMI from BM UltraStudio Monitor 3G. It's not ideal as DreamColor doesn't have 3D LUT capabilities, but it will be in the ballpark, depending on the age of the panel. The better solution is to use 42" LG OLED panel. You'd need a copy of CalMan calibration software (may be you can find a friend who has it). LG automatically communicates with CalMan and at the conclusion of auto calibration it uploads the calibration LUT to an internal 33x33 LUT storage. Or you can find on eBay a cheap ($500 or so) Color Edge 24" EIZO, which also can store 3D LUT for perfect calibration. Personally, I'd go with EIZO, it's not terribly expensive and it is a great budget monitor capable of proper calibration for REC-709.
 
jake blackstone said:
For Rec-709 you can buy an old HP DreamColor monitor, use free DisplayCal with used X-Rite i1Display and feed the monitor with HDMI from BM UltraStudio Monitor 3G. It's not ideal as DreamColor doesn't have 3D LUT capabilities, but it will be in the ballpark, depending on the age of the panel. The better solution is to use 42" LG OLED panel. You'd need a copy of CalMan calibration software (may be you can find a friend who has it). LG automatically communicates with CalMan and at the conclusion of auto calibration it uploads the calibration LUT to an internal 33x33 LUT storage. Or you can find on eBay a cheap ($500 or so) Color Edge 24" EIZO, which also can store 3D LUT for perfect calibration. Personally, I'd go with EIZO, it's not terribly expensive and it is a great budget monitor capable of proper calibration for REC-709.
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Thanks, the Eizo looks good.
 
Dell's crazy new 4k HDR Monitor that self color calibrates!


by
District 7 - Drew Geraci





"Dell's new UP3221Q 4k HDR Monitor with self-calibration mode makes color grading a breeze... the box it comes in is also HUGE! The new monitor is aimed at high-end cinematographers looking for the best in color as it boasts an impressive 99.8% DCI-P3 color gamut at 1000-nits in HDR mode."

"Skip ahead to 10:00 if you want to see it set up and rolling!"
 
rand thompson said:
Dell's crazy new 4k HDR Monitor that self color calibrates!


by
District 7 - Drew Geraci





"Dell's new UP3221Q 4k HDR Monitor with self-calibration mode makes color grading a breeze... the box it comes in is also HUGE! The new monitor is aimed at high-end cinematographers looking for the best in color as it boasts an impressive 99.8% DCI-P3 color gamut at 1000-nits in HDR mode."

"Skip ahead to 10:00 if you want to see it set up and rolling!"
Click to expand...

It's funny, he keeps going on and on about this monitor being able to self calibrate. So I wonder, if he never heard of Eizo monitors. They are able to do that for many years now:001_tongue:
Also, according to the poster, this monitor has only 1300:1 contrast ratio, which invalidates it for any kind of HDR work. The minimal contrast required for DolbyVision is 1,000,000:1.
 
jake blackstone said:
It's funny, he keeps going on and on about this monitor being able to self calibrate. So I wonder, if he never heard of Eizo monitors. They are able to do that for many years now:001_tongue:
Also, according to the poster, this monitor has only 1300:1 contrast ratio, which invalidates it for any kind of HDR work. The minimal contrast required for DolbyVision is 1,000,000:1.
Click to expand...

Hi Jake,

I've had the production model of the Dell UP3221Q for about 2 weeks now. It does meet Dolby Vision requirements and has been tested for some time.

From the manual, which I believe is officially released in about 48 hours:

phfx_dellForJake.jpg
 
I remembered when the guy said it that some other company also did self color calibration but I couldn't remember who it was. It's good that it does meet the Dolby Vision requirement at such a low cost relative to other more expensive Dolby Vision qualified monitors.

Phil, can we expect your review soon?
 
Phil Holland said:
Hi Jake,

I've had the production model of the Dell UP3221Q for about 2 weeks now. It does meet Dolby Vision requirements and has been tested for some time.

From the manual, which I believe is officially released in about 48 hours:

phfx_dellForJake.jpg
Click to expand...

Hi Phil.
Here is the Dolby Vision minimum monitor requirements according to Brahm Desmet from FSI:

Minimum Peak Luminance of 1,000nits
Minimum Static Contrast Ratio of 200,000:1
Minimum P3 Color Gamut
Support of 12bit signals
Support of ST2084 (PQ) EOTF

Brahm Desmet on Dynamic contrast ratio:
"Higher contrast would only happen temporally so likely not within the bounds of the specifications above"

Similar explanation was offered by Steve Shaw from Light Space:
"...a global dimming backlight is not at all suitable for critical colour work"

So, static dynamic contrast ratio of 1300:1 still doesn't meet the spec, which makes it unsuitable for any kind of Dolby Vision work.

And here is the Dolby's own monitor requirements for Dolby Vision work:
https://professional.dolby.com/siteassets/content-creation/dolby-vision-for-content-creators/dolby-vision_best-practices_facility.certificationv1.4.pdf
 
Blair S. Paulsen said:
Perhaps the 1,300:1 is specifically for SDR (rec709) content and the 1,000,000:1 is for HDR per the (HDR On) note after the 1,000,000:1 spec...

Cheers - #19
Click to expand...

It's not magic, no matter how much we'd all love to be able to buy a monitor, that would meet minimum Dolby Vision requirements for $5k.
This monitor is not that much different from a number of other monitors, that use local dimming zones. SDR doesn't need 1000 nits light output, so in that case local dimming backlight is not used and it defaults to a native LCD 1300:1 dynamic range, but in HDR local dimming is used resulting in higher dynamic ratio. Even best LCD's by itself are not capable of more than something like 1300:1 native dynamic range. That is why manufacturers now using dual LCD screens technology in order to be able to achieve 1,000,000:1 contrast. It is better tech, than OLED used in X300 and much cheaper to produce than Dolby's own $250k monitors. But, unfortunately, as a result of using this very expensive new dual screen tech, monitors that are capable of meeting Dolby Vision minimum requirements like Sony X310, Eizo CG3146, TV Logic LUM-310 or FSI XM311K and FSI XM310K are all $30k+.
 
Bruce Allen said:
(snip) As I was saying, if this new Dell monitor (or the Apple monitor) were a lot cheaper, it may make sense as an upgrade from the LG... but it's in a weird price bracket of "a LOT more expensive than the LG" but "also still not good enough REALLY."
I'm sure there are people with the projects this makes sense for - I just find it an odd product category for Apple and Dell to both go for.
Bruce Allen
www.bruceallen.tv
Click to expand...

Oh Bruce, Bruce, Bruce... trying to apply logic to marketing... ;-)

Kidding aside, it is a strange value proposition when a device intended for a specific purpose - HDR/rec2020(100% P3) monitoring/grading - can't actually hit the spec. As others have noted, it seems more like a short term solution to the current issue of the high cost of legit HDR monitors. For a lot of projects, these "close but no cigar" displays will suffice for HDR grading passes good enough to meet deliverables contracts, plus, give DPs/DITs/Gaffers/etc a fair feel for how their images will look in HDR. Could that bar be cleared with displays that sell for under $2K? Where is the "good enough" line drawn?

It seems likely that within a year or two or three we will see monitors with performance metrics equal to the $30K displays for under $10K. Based on that expectation and my particular business model, I'm going to live with a "decent", under $2K HDR monitor until better options emerge - then invest. Moreover, I really want a device that can handle high bandwidth signals and support 12bits to the panel. Achieving this will be a lot easier with updated SDI/DP/HDMI ports and internal processing chips able to handle 8K/60P 12bit baseband signals.

Cheers - #19
 
jake blackstone said:
It's not magic, no matter how much we'd all love to be able to buy a monitor, that would meet minimum Dolby Vision requirements for $5k.
This monitor is not that much different from a number of other monitors, that use local dimming zones. SDR doesn't need 1000 nits light output, so in that case local dimming backlight is not used and it defaults to a native LCD 1300:1 dynamic range, but in HDR local dimming is used resulting in higher dynamic ratio. Even best LCD's by itself are not capable of more than something like 1300:1 native dynamic range. That is why manufacturers now using dual LCD screens technology in order to be able to achieve 1,000,000:1 contrast. It is better tech, than OLED used in X300 and much cheaper to produce than Dolby's own $250k monitors. But, unfortunately, as a result of using this very expensive new dual screen tech, monitors like Sony X310, Eizo CG3146, TV Logic LUM-310 or FSI XM311K and FSI XM310K are all $30k+.
Click to expand...

Agreed. I was just pointing out that the Dell "claims" enough contrast ratio to meet one spec, didn't mean to ignore the collateral damage of local dimming zones. My assumption is that dual screen tech and other approaches still in development will eventually yield options under $10K that have performance metrics as good as - or better than - the current crop of $30K monitors noted above.

The real question is how long before that happens...

Cheers - #19
 
No one with a gun will be standing by your side, if you want to use one of these "inexpensive" monitors for YouTube delivery.
That is not what we're talking about when we are talking about meeting Dolby Vision minimum specs.
This only apples if you're planning to deliver for one of the streamers- HBO, Netflix, Disney, Apple etc.
All these deliveries must be done in an Dolby Vision approved facilities. That means, that Dolby representative will show up and inspect your monitor and it will be properly calibrated, if needed.
If you missing a monitor, that meets specs, you will not be given Dolby Vision approval, simple. But that was true before Covid. No more in-person traing and facilities visits, all is done remotely now.
And a couple of days ago that has changed again. Starting next year Dolby will stop certifying facilities.
Instead, they will be certifying colorists and engineers. It is all very new and details are still sketchy, but the bottom line, if you delivering for Youtube, you're good using pretty much any monitor you can afford and deem "good enough".
For proper Dolby Vision deliverables, not so much:eek6:
 
jake blackstone said:
No one with a gun will be standing by your side, if you want to use one of these "inexpensive" monitors for YouTube delivery.
That is not what we're talking about when we are talking about meeting Dolby Vision minimum specs.
This only apples if you're planning to deliver for one of the streamers- HBO, Netflix, Disney, Apple etc.
All these deliveries must be done in an Dolby Vision approved facilities. That means, that Dolby representative will show up and inspect your monitor and it will be properly calibrated, if needed.
If you missing a monitor, that meets specs, you will not be given Dolby Vision approval, simple. But that was true before Covid. No more in-person traing and facilities visits, all is done remotely now.
And a couple of days ago that has changed again. Starting next year Dolby will stop certifying facilities.
Instead, they will be certifying colorists and engineers. It is all very new and details are still sketchy, but the bottom line, if you delivering for Youtube, you're good using pretty much any monitor you can afford and deem "good enough".
For proper Dolby Vision deliverables, not so much:eek6:
Click to expand...


Will an already certified facility lose it's Dolby Vision Certification if the certified Colorist/Engineer or both leave that facility? And I guess those certified persons could almost name their price for competing Facilities.
 
rand thompson said:
Will an already certified facility lose it's Dolby Vision Certification if the certified Colorist/Engineer or both leave that facility? And I guess those certified persons could almost name their price for competing Facilities.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure if I'm allowed to quote letter from Dolby, so I'm only going to paraphrase.
Facility that is certified will be able to extend the certification for one year only.
After that no more facility certifications.
One more thing, any facility that had been certified after beginning of COVID really means, that they just paid their fees.
It is up to the facility to use the on-line training provided by Dolby. Needless to say, not many facilities do.
Luckily, for new personal Dolby Vision certification Dolby will requires a passing of a test.
So, yeah, it seems, certified personnel may end up in high demand:lurk5:
 
Thanks Jake for the detailed explanation!:thumbsup:
 
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