Producers and editors?????

[Barry Fontaine]

Who wants a project or just as important wants a freelancer with a Red?
This is not a personal add. I have real life questions about the marketability of a days work with a Red camera.

I have over 20 years shooting and editing ENG in a News environment. I have also worked on Docs where the shooting style and workflow has very much matched that of News. I have shot on every Sony Betacam SP/SX, Panasonic, Ikegami and others that have crossed my path. I own a Canon XL1 that is long since past it's usefullness that I freelanced on the side from my TV News work. Time to move up to an XDcam rig.
I will also likely buy a Red Scarlet 2/3 for a freelance rig. I like the ability to sell a 1080p product with superior image capture and codec. The ability to shoot 3K, 4K or 5K will no doubt set myself apart from the XDCam and DigiBeta and EX owners currently freelancing in my market. Is that a good thing?

My questions are based on economic realities. How will my product be accepted by clients? Will they be able to easily ingest or transfer my material into the wide range of workflows that exist in todays real life TV world? Is 1080p RGB on a CF or RAID with a RED codec going to be accepted? Are there other Codecs available "in camera" so as to deliver my footage quickly and in the language my clients will demand?

 

[thomas-english]

The most hired camera in the UK is still currently the DSR450. Which sounds weird but it came out of a recent survey of all the facilities houses. The RED camera is at the head of the curve. It has a better image and more options but it is not the easiest camera to work with on tight projects for people that don't know what they are doing.

Check your market thoughtfully. In a sense your question is about a camera that does not exist yet with workflows; in the future. If you were talking about monetizing a camera today, right now, the RED camera is not as profitable as EX3s and XDcams.

EX3s and XDcams go out constantly. When they go out they do so for days sometimes weeks at a time. This kind of work on corporates and TV is not there for the RED in the UK. Sure it happens but not like it does for the DSR450s, EX3s and XDcams.

However if your looking to produce more attractive images and upping your client base then the RED camera is the way to go. Things could be very very different in 6months to 12months. Lets face it they were very different 12 months ago. The RED camera is SO much more accepted and is on so many more jobs. There just happens to also be a lot more of them as well.

As a point aside. If I had to do a doco in Afganistan tomorrow. I would take an XDcam rather than one of our REDs. Mostly because of the weight and convenience factors (view finder etc).

 

[Jeremy Torrie]

On the drama side here in Winnipeg I've been told by local crew that 90% of the projects that were shot were done with the R1. That's a huge number.

To answer your question though -depending on what the client asks for at the end of the edit is the real question. HD SR or HDCam for the broadcasters, some Digi Beta submasters as well is what we've found. No SP at all.

 

[Stephen Williams]

No SP at all.

Hi,

I know Europe was ahead of the curve, but SP pretty much died 10 years ago here.

Stephen

 

[Barry Fontaine]

Thomas and Torrie, thank-you both specifically for your insight.
I am also thinking if I want to keep a camera working I would be best to have Sony XDCam's, PDW-700 and an EX3, in my camera box.

The future will likely see me replace my Canon 5D with a Red that is adept at Cinema quality high def and beyond motion image capture.

 

[Jeremy Torrie]

I only bring up the SP reference because I've read about how it's still an acceptable deliverable in a lot of US markets. We were delivering in SX for SD masters back in '98, and shooting and delivering HDcam in 2000 so it just goes to show how long it takes for 'new formats' to be replaced. BTW CBC wants HD SR masters for HD and Digi Beta for SD.

That said -Barry...considering I have bought and used both Sony and Panny I would strongly suggest checking out Panasonic, particularly anything that can record with AVC Intra. Sony does a good job of course but it's taken a very long time for them to get with the times and innovate. 10-bit pictures in the AVC Intra is pretty darn nice, especially with decent glass.

Keep in mind that if you buy or lease three cameras and you expect to keep them working you need to have a lot lined up in order to make payments on the loan or lease. But you will likely need to be able to hand some form of tape to your clients...so that means purchasing a deck...and is that HDcam? It's the only solution out there that you can hand off and be assured it can be ingested somewhere else.

 

[Rob Ruffo]

It really depends on where you want to go with your style. Red is wonderful in many ways, but it is more expensive in many ways too - these include weight and - this may seem silly but if you shoot at 4K hard drives add up, as does transfer time for delivery.

Whatever you do don't buy a cam that only records 1080i - producers are FINALLY realizing that 1080i on cable is not really 1080i, just a way of delivering 1080p in field pairs to the deinterlacers of user-TVs, which are progressive only. It took them a while to figure that one out - but they are there. So a 1080i cam becomes just a 720p cam and that is mediocre, especially if you want to do any resizing.

 

[Ronald Reddick]

At least for us we shoot mainly on our PDW700 XDCAM units, but I do plenty of work here in Afghanistan on my Red. For our network workflow I deliver in Prores4x4 and that works fine for them. I also sell plenty of footage via our station to other networks as well with no problem. My biggest issue is using the Red as a ENG camera, long boot time, heavy even stripped down, but I love it. Main glass is an Optimus zoom with servo and handgrip controls, works very well.

They key I think shooting indie for the market is getting what they want and being able to one light and delivery the footage in a format they can ingest easily. My short docs are no problem here, I shoot and edit myself and deliver to the station ready to air. But for breaking news it is extra work for them to get it on the air.

So I need the Epic big time, waiting to see where I end up on Stage 1 list as I want the upgrades in sensor, but mostly in the weight and form factor. I think the faster boot time with those other attributes is going to be a game changer and make it easier for ENG work. But you still need to have your own fast, easy workflow to deliver what the station wants.

Just my 2 cents

Ron

Still in Dusty Kabul

PS - the new frame rate should be killer for night fire fights and catching the air support strikes. Cannot wait for the 5K @ 120 FPS